Dear trainers: The cost of the NRA *Basic* Pistol course is too damn high!

[CB45]

Agreed. Is that a modified 1911 I'm assuming (by the name "45")?

I always get comments because I don't fall in line with the beat of drum.

Yes its a modified 1911. typically referred to as 2011. Shoots .355 dia. 115gr bullets at 1500fps and can hold up to 29rds.

The screen name originates from my passion for 1911's...

Lots of good discussion here, some bad too. Seems we at least figured out that there are folks offering reasonably priced basic classes. The higher priced ones exists because supply and demand allows it to.

I appreciate the folks who help support and grow the firearms community with reasonably priced training. Thanks for your dedication and passion.

Yesterday a thought crossed my mind. Training versus Instruction, is the NRA basic class instruction or training, or maybe a little of both. Maybe I view it as mostly as instruction, which is why I don't value it as highly as I do training. Just a thought.

 

[Shay]

Again, what makes you think I haven't?

Ok. It's very simple then. Post a link to where the public can register for your classes.

 

[the1kidd03]

Yes its a modified 1911. typically referred to as 2011. Shoots .355 dia. 115gr bullets at 1500fps and can hold up to 29rds.

The screen name originates from my passion for 1911's...

Lots of good discussion here, some bad too. Seems we at least figured out that there are folks offering reasonably priced basic classes. The higher priced ones exists because supply and demand allows it to.

I appreciate the folks who help support and grow the firearms community with reasonably priced training. Thanks for your dedication and passion.

Yesterday a thought crossed my mind. Training versus Instruction, is the NRA basic class instruction or training, or maybe a little of both. Maybe I view it as mostly as instruction, which is why I don't value it as highly as I do training. Just a thought.

I'm not sure I'm interpreting the same distinction you have between "training" and "instruction?"

I think I get what you're saying, but I'm not sure which you believe to be which (if that makes sense.)

I would agree that there is a difference which NRA basic doesn't necessarily fit into. However, that depends on the instructor. They can put more effort into it than required if they wish and that's what makes a difference between each of them which introduces more competition. When they put more into it, then sure the cost would be justified in being a little higher if they are meeting expectation for that. However, consider who's taking such a class. Usually NEW gun owners. They have no training experience or knowledge to compare it to really, so of course they're going to think highly of the value of the training regardless. As gun owners, we have the ability to critique training to a higher standard. Of course, we're evil for doing so however.

 

[cedartop]

Yes! Unless the person offering it wants at least some compensation for their time, then No. So No. But the material is basic on on the internet so Yes.

That about sums it up it would appear.

 

[rvb]

Yesterday a thought crossed my mind. Training versus Instruction, is the NRA basic class instruction or training, or maybe a little of both. Maybe I view it as mostly as instruction, which is why I don't value it as highly as I do training. Just a thought.

When I hear "training" I think in terms of "training for a marathon." No instructor in any indeavor can hold your hand for months while you "train" to do something (unless you hire a "personal trainer" who guides/pushes you through your practice/exercise regiment regularly). Every class offered to gun owners is "instruction." You should value training more as the real learning comes from putting the reps in to really develop and become proficient with the new information, and that can't be done in one session of 8 or 16 hrs in a class.

I think that's where you're coming from. And I agree.

But instruction has value, especially if you've never heard the information before. The concept is no different if it's an NRA Basic course or a weekend w/ Ben Stoeger, it's just different places on the learning curve (gun 101 vs grad school). If you don't know where to get the QUALITY information, you have to validate the source. Some people would rather pay for an NRA course than watch youtube, because they can trust information has been vetted and they are getting good information. No different really than paying a national chamption vs going to youtube or listening to the schmuk at the local match because the title validates the information quality. youtube or the schmuk at the local match may teach you garbage (or may teach the same quality information, you don't know).... and if you don't know if it's garbage and think it's right, you'll always do it wrong.

-rvb

 

[CB45]

When I hear "training" I think in terms of "training for a marathon." No instructor in any indeavor can hold your hand for months while you "train" to do something (unless you hire a "personal trainer" who guides/pushes you through your practice/exercise regiment regularly). Every class offered to gun owners is "instruction." You should value training more as the real learning comes from putting the reps in to really develop and become proficient with the new information, and that can't be done in 8 or 16 hrs on the range.

I think that's where you're coming from. And I agree.

But instruction has value, especially if you've never heard the information before. The concept is no different if it's an NRA Basic course or a weekend w/ Ben Stoeger, it's just different places on the learning curve (gun 101 vs grad school). If you don't know where to get the QUALITY information, you have to validate the source. Some people would rather pay for an NRA course than watch youtube, because they can trust information has been vetted and they are getting good information. No different really than paying a national chamption vs going to youtube or listening to the schmuk at the local match because the title validates the information quality. youtube or the schmuk at the local match may teach you garbage.... and if you don't know if it's garbage and think it's right, you'll always do it wrong.

-rvb

Yep, that sounds about right!

 

[Bunnykid68]

Have they lowered the price yet? I only have $5.33 to offer now.

 

[the1kidd03]

When I hear "training" I think in terms of "training for a marathon." No instructor in any indeavor can hold your hand for months while you "train" to do something (unless you hire a "personal trainer" who guides/pushes you through your practice/exercise regiment regularly). Every class offered to gun owners is "instruction." You should value training more as the real learning comes from putting the reps in to really develop and become proficient with the new information, and that can't be done in one session of 8 or 16 hrs in a class.

I think that's where you're coming from. And I agree.

But instruction has value, especially if you've never heard the information before. The concept is no different if it's an NRA Basic course or a weekend w/ Ben Stoeger, it's just different places on the learning curve (gun 101 vs grad school). If you don't know where to get the QUALITY information, you have to validate the source. Some people would rather pay for an NRA course than watch youtube, because they can trust information has been vetted and they are getting good information. No different really than paying a national chamption vs going to youtube or listening to the schmuk at the local match because the title validates the information quality. youtube or the schmuk at the local match may teach you garbage (or may teach the same quality information, you don't know).... and if you don't know if it's garbage and think it's right, you'll always do it wrong.

-rvb

Yep, that sounds about right!

Ok. We're on the same page then. Military guys tend to use the word "training" in regards to everything so the line can be muddied so I just wanted to verify that this was the distinction you were making. The corporate world also muddies this distinction unfortunately

 

[funeralweb]

I also roll my eyes at the guys that buy all the whiz-bang Jeep stuff, and then immediately get their mall-crawler stuck.

I witnessed this a couple of weeks ago. Guy was trying to climb snow piles at the local Wal-Mart in his brand-spankin' new temporary-tagged J-toy. I bet he was wearing pajama pants.

 

[VERT]

Have they lowered the price yet? I only have $5.33 to offer now.

OK. $5. Deal. Bring brownies. I like sweets.

 

[iChokePeople]

OK. $5. Deal. Bring brownies. I like sweets.

But at that price you run the risk of 20 people showing up. Then you're making $100 for the day, you know, because it's pure profit, and that's more than some of those guys make. You ****** instructors are getting RICH off this stuff.

 

[VERT]

But at that price you run the risk of 20 people showing up. Then you're making $100 for the day, you know, because it's pure profit, and that's more than some of those guys make. You ****** instructors are getting RICH off this stuff.

I am more concerned that I won't be able to eat that many brownies. Maybe I can freeze them?

 

[the1kidd03]

Fortunately, brownies aren't used as "reason" to promote the infringement of our rights in political debates.

 

[IndyGunSafety]

Na, most of the NRA trainers on this forum aren't competition guys.

The competition guys who are are still competitors. I was just saying when I wash out, I may need something to do.

REALLY? Every single one of my instructors competes.

 

[Roscoe38]

Maybe gun school tuition should be tax deductible?

Since it is not recognized by Nancy and Barry, it would probably fall into the 2% category and not be deductable. But it sounds good to me.

 

[bwframe]

While we are talking semantics, what is the difference between training and practice?

In my vernacular, "training" involves instruction. Shooting without instruction/oversight/review is "practice."

 

[the1kidd03]

While we are talking semantics, what is the difference between training and practice?

In my vernacular, "training" involves instruction. Shooting without instruction/oversight/review is "practice."

Hence my confusion and need to clarify. Words mean different things to different people.

 

[darinb]

I took the basic course a couple years ago since it was provided free through my employer at the time but I wouldn't pay over $100 for it based upon the course contents but I think its good to have some documented training. It is good for people with no firearms experience or knowledge but the instructor I had was really bad and didn't know much when it came to the hands on portion but Ive heard others have had great instructors.

 

[Bunnykid68]

OK. $5. Deal. Bring brownies. I like sweets.

I knew someone would work with me. Do you like your brownies with icing?

 

[Bunnykid68]

But at that price you run the risk of 20 people showing up. Then you're making $100 for the day, you know, because it's pure profit, and that's more than some of those guys make. You ****** instructors are getting RICH off this stuff.

Not to mention the pounds and pounds of brownies he will have