Allow police to have proper tools to determine who the real outlaws are

[ArmedProgrammer]

You would drive on and leave all those poor defenseless kids with an obviously armed dangerous gunman?

that's a no win situation - how many does he have on the bus that he's exposing to danger by stopping? You can't have it both ways...

talk about "damned if you do and damned if you don't"... walk in his shoes for a minute. There are parents to protect those outside - the ones IN the bus have ONLY the driver.

 

[BiscuitNaBasket]

Does OCing a pocket knife also constitute driving past the stop and reporting a MWAK? Honest question for OP.

Also, nothing you've described about bus driver relations to kids in the sticks applies to bus driver relations in a city except picking up kids and dropping them off.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

Does OCing a pocket knife also constitute driving past the stop and reporting a MWAK? Honest question.Also, nothing you've described about being a bus driver in the sticks applies to being a bus driver in a city.

No - but if you've got someone standing off to the side looking like Aqualung from Jethro Tull fame - with a knife on his hip - you're an idiot if you don't notice and get ready just in case.....And yes - rural vs urban are two different environments - and they by rights SHOULD be treated differently.

 

[churchmouse]

No - but if you've got someone standing off to the side looking like Aqualung from Jethro Tull fame - with a knife on his hip - you're an idiot if you don't notice and get ready just in case.....And yes - rural vs urban are two different environments - and they by rights SHOULD be treated differently.

The kids in an urban environment might beat ole tull down and take his knife.......

 

[BiscuitNaBasket]

Dang it. I guess I'll have to cover up my broad-sword with my T-shirt.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

Dang it. I guess I'll have to cover up my broad-sword with my T-shirt.

You look and / or act like Aqualung? Really?

 

[BiscuitNaBasket]

/purple. Haha FOGITABOUTIT.

 

[Birds Away]

It would appear that even our friends are really our enemies.

 

[lonehoosier]

I just don't see a threat form a holster sidearm. On a side not, maybe this gentleman was ignorant of the law and thought he could not stand with he's kids at the bus stop and that's why he was by himself across the street.

 

[ArmedProgrammer]

It would appear that even our friends are really our enemies.

I don't think so - or at least at not as much as you may think.

Few of us would take the hard line (sloughfoot is likely on the harder end of things here) simply because someone was OCing. While it might make us take a second look - if no other reason than it's out of the ordinary - it would require out of normal _behavior_ to make most of us ACT

for the record - someone dressed in an out of expected fashion would get my situational awareness up as well. ANYTHING out of the ordinary should.

And Biscuit - all good... just be sure that you keep your creeper van away from the elementary schools.... then you can OC your sword all you want....

 

[timsdl72]

It is not a hypothetical. It happened in the newspaper story. What the bus driver should do is policy in many school districts. It is actually logical policy to ensure the safety of the kids on the bus.

You guys are not thinking this all the way through to the logical conclusion. You guys are assuming that you are each individually "good guys" and everybody knows this. What should the person who doesn't see that you are "good guys" do?

Maybe the regular driver has sat at your kitchen table and is cool with you. He gets sick or his mother dies or he is still drunk from the night before and he calls for a sub to run his route? What is the sub to do when he sees somebody visibly armed at the bus stop?

This whole thread is about school bus stops with somebody's innocent kids at stake. Keep that in mind.

If I have YOUR kids on my bus and as I approach a bus stop I see someone is standing there with a gun on the hip.

What do you think I should do? What would be your response?

We've answered this question numerous times. There is no law being broken. The presence of a firearm is not an indication that something is amiss. Again, expanding the "gun free zones" to include a school bus stop moves us into an arena of "anywhere there are children" which naturally then includes my home. This thread is a perfect example of why "common sense gun control" does not exist. Your definition of reasonable is obviously at odds with a number of us here and we're all supposed to be 2nd amendment supporters. Imagine the difference of opinion we would have if we didn't claim that basic belief.

 

[timsdl72]

I get his point and see merit in it. That you do not is your mind set. Some times common sense should be used. Just because you can does not mean you should.
Situations vary. JMHO.

I CC every day when picking up the grand daughter and so does my son. No panicked moms or freaked out kids.

I absolutely agree and CC for the same reasons every day. However, watching someone OC does not alarm me and I'll not support the idea that OC is cause for a police officer to ask for "my papers". There is no liberty if we must prove we have the "right" when we exercise it.

 

[timsdl72]

I know bus drivers who CC every day. They are quite prepared to protect the children on their bus. They will not be victims and will not allow their kids to be victims. They don't wait for "permission" from their school district. I know of one who was told privately by the director of transportation that if he used his CC gun to protect the kids on the bus that he better damn well be justified. He would be fired but he would not face criminal charges. And he would get lots of loving hugs from the staff when he walked away.


That is the rumor that I have heard. I was not there. It may or may not be true.

Warriers are everywhere. They just don't always make themselves obvious to everybody.

I think I am done with this thread.

And this statement I wholeheartedly agree with (except for the getting fired part!). As a parent, I place my children in the protective hands of school system employees everyday. I would much rather they be prepared to defend my children with more than their bodies should the need arise. A human shield is not terribly effective.

 

[looney2ns]

My paranoia (situational awareness) has kept me alive as a soldier, bomb disposal tech, police officer and a few other titles, to reach my age of 62.

If your child is ever in my charge, they will be as well protected as they can be. I can assure you of that. I also understand nothing is perfect.

I am not sure why the vitriol. Calm down.

i just ask that you think the scenario through from all sides as presented by the OP.

I really would like your opinion on what YOU would do if you were driving a school bus and observed an individual armed that was standing off from the group at the bus stop. Would you make a normal stop or just drive on?

I maintain that I would drive on and err on the side of caution.

I'll bite, I wouldn't give him a second thought...Make the stop and move on.

 

[eldirector]

I'll bite, too.

As the bus driver:
Pull up, and pick the the kids. Say hello to the parents. If the MWAG is close enough, say hello. If not, then a friendly wave. It ends there if all is normal. If he acts weird (no eye contact, won't wave, gets all sweaty and fidgety) then report up the food chain when I get back.

As another parent:
Say hello.

From the article in the OP, it was much ado about nothing. Seriously, the likelihood of the guy being another parent is pretty high when the ONLY other people there are parents and children.

I'm more concerned that the other parents didn't recognize him or his kid(s). Folks just don't seem to talk to the neighbors any more.....

 

[LarryC]

It is not a hypothetical. It happened in the newspaper story. What the bus driver should do is policy in many school districts. It is actually logical policy to ensure the safety of the kids on the bus.

You guys are not thinking this all the way through to the logical conclusion. You guys are assuming that you are each individually "good guys" and everybody knows this. What should the person who doesn't see that you are "good guys" do? Maybe the regular driver has sat at your kitchen table and is cool with you. He gets sick or his mother dies or he is still drunk from the night before and he calls for a sub to run his route? What is the sub to do when he sees somebody visibly armed at the bus stop?

This whole thread is about school bus stops with somebody's innocent kids at stake. Keep that in mind.

If I have YOUR kids on my bus and as I approach a bus stop I see someone is standing there with a gun on the hip.

What do you think I should do? What would be your response?

I would pick the children up as usual!

Reason 1. In my limited experience criminals DO NOT openly display firearms in public. Actually I would feel safer if my great grandchildren were standing at a bus stop with a person openly carrying a firearm.

Reason 2, My worry would be the person with a "bulge" in his coat pocket rather than a person with a holstered firearm. Almost all shootings have been done with illegal firearms - or concealed firearms brought out just before shooting. Anyone with an "illegal" weapon would certainly not be carrying it in a holster at his hip. And NO, I do not normally open carry - usually CC, but don't see any issue with those that do.

 

[cedartop]

We don't do the bus for my daughter. Dean, me might consider it if you were the driver.

Something someone said above was good. If you are a concerned parent at the stop politely engage the MWG in conversation. That could end the uncertainty.

 

[actaeon277]

We don't do the bus for my daughter. Dean, me might consider it if you were the driver.

Something someone said above was good. If you are a concerned parent at the stop politely engage the MWG in conversation. That could end the uncertainty.

So could driving away. Hard to miss a bus.

 

[lonehoosier]

We don't do the bus for my daughter. Dean, me might consider it if you were the driver.

Something someone said above was good. If you are a concerned parent at the stop politely engage the MWG in conversation. That could end the uncertainty.

I will ask this question again. Do you think a person with a holster sidearm is a threat? I for one do not.

 

[cedartop]

I will ask this question again. Do you think a person with a holster sidearm is a threat? I for one do not.

That's easy. Yes, I do. Am I automatically scared or suspicious? No. Do I think he is a potential threat? Yes.