What Can a Glock Do That a 1911 or BHP Cannot?

[XtremeVel]

I have not personally witnessed seven cracked 1911 frames. However, it is admittedly easier to find this sort of thing with google. The point I and I think Joe was trying to make is that sometimes stuff just brakes. Glock frames can crack over time. 1911 frames can crack over time. There isn't a clear durability advantage to polymer as you claim.

I haven't either. But I have personally seen 3. (2) 1911's and (1) 92F. I also remember STORIES from military armors about this issue. I also was around and saw aftermath of a Glock Kaboom. I won't start another issue by stating what I think was the cause tho. I will only say is was not a .40.

I do agree that anything can fail. And I was also aware that there are examples of Glocks that have cracked also.

As for the clear durability advantage of polymer, I will let it rest for now. I have typed about this now since page 5 I think. LOL I could of whipped out 500 rounds in that time. But hey, this was much cheaper !

 

[OD*]

OK. We're on the same page then. I think. Maybe.

Yes Sir, I believe we are.

 

[XtremeVel]

Oh, there's no doubt there are plenty of cracked steel frames out there! Only gun I think would actually surprise me would be one of Ruger's P-series pistols. They are so overbuilt, I can't picture the amount of use it would take to cause one to break from plain ole fatigue.

Edit: Of course, the Ruger's don't actually have a steel frame. Oh well, still germane to the topic of metal vs polymer frame cracking.

Being consistent with my logic, the one that surprises me that I hear has some cracking issue is the longer slide Walther P22. Now, isn't the Walther frame Polymer ? If so, how does a steel slide crack when it impacts polymer ?

 

[kingnereli]

I haven't either. But I have personally seen 3. (2) 1911's and (1) 92F. I also remember STORIES from military armors about this issue. I also was around and saw aftermath of a Glock Kaboom. I won't start another issue by stating what I think was the cause tho. I will only say is was not a .40.

I do agree that anything can fail. And I was also aware that there are examples of Glocks that have cracked also.

As for the clear durability advantage of polymer, I will let it rest for now. I have typed about this now since page 5 I think. LOL I could of whipped out 500 rounds in that time. But hey, this was much cheaper !

That makes sense. It would be disingenuous for anyone to say steel guns can't crack. That's obviously not the case. It seem we too may be on the same page after all.

 

[Joe Williams]

Being consistent with my logic, the one that surprises me that I hear has some cracking issue is the longer slide Walther P22. Now, isn't the Walther frame Polymer ? If so, how does a steel slide crack when it impacts polymer ?

Could be wrong, but I don't think those are steel. I think they have slides made of a zinc alloy casting... think "Jennings," only better made. Not nearly as rugged as steel.

 

[XtremeVel]

That makes sense. It would be disingenuous for anyone to say steel guns can't crack. That's obviously not the case. It seem we too may be on the same page after all.

We were never too far off. At least the debate was solely on the longevity issue only. I think we both agree both are fine choices. We just might disagree which might make it to the 100,000 round count.

 

[XtremeVel]

Could be wrong, but I don't think those are steel. I think they have slides made of a zinc alloy casting... think "Jennings," only better made. Not nearly as rugged as steel.

LOL.. And here I just bought one and I don't know. I did buy the short slide version. I only did it because I liked the looks better, not because of what I heard. I will have to see if a magnet sticks... Now you have me curious. That would help to explain it.

 

[Joe Williams]

We were never too far off. At least the debate was solely on the longevity issue only. I think we both agree both are fine choices. We just might disagree which might make it to the 100,000 round count.

Both can make it to that round count, and have more than once. I think it was RVB that posted about his Beretta making it past there before breaking, and that's an aluminum framed gun. IIRC, it wasn't the frame that finally broke, though.

You want to talk about a gun that was subject to battering, look at the Star PD, .45 ACP, steel slide, aluminum frame. That was a gun that was notorious for destroying itself in short order if shot without a recoil buffer. A sweetheart of a gun to carry and shoot, though, so long as you kept the buffer in good shape!

 

[thompal]

That is a matter of opinion. I think people miss the point sometimes... Just because a Glock feels weird in your hand doesn't mean it doesn't feel perfect in someone else's. Like a few others have said, it's really just a matter of preference. If a Glock feels comfortable to you and you shoot well with it, so much the better for you. If a 1911 or BHP serves you better, grab one an enjoy it.

What baffles me about this whole argument is why people compare these two brands specifically... I mean, Glocks and 1911's are fundamentally different enough that I wouldn't think they would step on each other's toes so much. Different trigger, different composition, striker v. hammer, grip angle, etc. If I was looking for a pistol that met one set of criteria why would I care about the pistol that meets all the opposite? Doesn't mean the other pistol is any worse, it just means it's not the pistol I prefer to shoot. That's all.

How DARE you try to bring the voice of logic and reason to a perfectly good Glock vs. 1911 fight!!

 

[XtremeVel]

Both can make it to that round count, and have more than once. I think it was RVB that posted about his Beretta making it past there before breaking, and that's an aluminum framed gun. IIRC, it wasn't the frame that finally broke, though.

You want to talk about a gun that was subject to battering, look at the Star PD, .45 ACP, steel slide, aluminum frame. That was a gun that was notorious for destroying itself in short order if shot without a recoil buffer. A sweetheart of a gun to carry and shoot, though, so long as you kept the buffer in good shape!

Alot of it had to do with caliber and load. Here, much of the argument was really apples to oranges. 90 % of what I shoot out of my Glocks is .357 sig. I don't forsee that to change either. Fortunately, I jumped in about 5 years ago back when the Brass Shoppe was selling once fired cases for 19.00 /1000. I was so impressed with that round I pretty much had a blanket order with them for a few thousand cases a month. If my Glocks can do it, I won't be in any need of cases to make that mark. LOL

 

[bwframe]

Depends on the range. My Glock Poly frame can handle pressures like the .357 sig and it is flat shooting and can reach out. It also holds 15 rounds...

Right. With that fireball, you'll be easily identified. Better make the first one count. Also, your recoil will be more difficult to deal with, your mag capacity advantage will be quickly eliminated.

I said "serious 1911 operator," they won't be standing still, waiting for you to shoot them.

 

[XtremeVel]

Right. With that fireball, you'll be easily identified. Better make the first one count. Also, your recoil will be more difficult to deal with, your mag capacity advantage will be quickly eliminated.

I said "serious 1911 operator," they won't be standing still, waiting for you to shoot them.

Your right about the fireball. And I load it with a slower burning powder too ( Blue Dot ) . But as the recoil... I hear many say that. I don't find it bad at all. I actually find the .40 to have more. The 9mm bullet is a lot lighter thus less resistence leaving the barrel. The .357 does have much more muzzle blast tho.

 

[tnek]

I've only seen one 1911 pattern pistol run an entire class without a single malfunction. I've only seen one Glock malfunction in a class. It had more aftermarket parts than factory.

I have a Wilson Stainless Protector that in many years of shooting that I can count on one hand that has choked. And that has been a ammo or mag issue.
I have seen Glocks choke at matches. Not a lot of them but they are not the be all end all.

My XD Tactical has the same grip angles and I love it. After an inital problem with a bit of foriegn debris from a magwell addition by Canyon Creek it now runs like a pickle seeder. I have less than a two thousand rounds thru it but I think its going to be a LONG time before it has another issue.
Time will tell.

 

[OD*]

But as the recoil... I hear many say that. I don't find it bad at all. I actually find the .40 to have more.

That we agree on.

I enjoy shooting my friends .357 Sig G19 much more than his G23.

 

[thompal]

Again, the 1911 is a fine weapon. I was just answering the initial op's question. I was only stating the Glock longevity was better than not only a 1911, but any steel / alloy framed guns that come to mind. Doesn't mean that I believe most 1911's will eventually crack, but rather the Glock will take much more punishment.

Unfortunately, this is a debate to which we will never have an answer, because there will be no answer to the longevity question for another 70 years or so. Because it will be that long until the oldest Glocks can possibly be as old as the oldest (99 years) 1911s that are still functional today.

 

[thompal]

with a bit of foriegn debris from a magwell addition by Canyon Creek it now runs like a pickle seeder.

?? A quaint saying that I've never heard before?? How is that possible?

 

[XtremeVel]

Unfortunately, this is a debate to which we will never have an answer, because there will be no answer to the longevity question for another 70 years or so. Because it will be that long until the oldest Glocks can possibly be as old as the oldest (99 years) 1911s that are still functional today.

LOL... Not again.... Maybe I need to go back and edit and word my posts better. What I met by longevity is whether one was a 50,000 round gun and another was a 100,000 round gun. I will admit the 1911 is the King of longevity as you are refering. I was refering to round count and abuse. The way things change, I will be shocked if the Glock as we know it now will be around and the same in just 30 years, let alone 70.

 

[Joe Williams]

LOL... Not again.... Maybe I need to go back and edit and word my posts better. What I met by longevity is whether one was a 50,000 round gun and another was a 100,000 round gun. I will admit the 1911 is the King of longevity as you are refering. I was refering to round count and abuse. The way things change, I will be shocked if the Glock as we know it now will be around and the same in just 30 years, let alone 70.

If it's not, then we'll have the proof it's not as good a gun as the 1911, which at 99 years old is almost as good as the K-frame Smith, a 111 y/o design

 

[XtremeVel]

That we agree on.

I enjoy shooting my friends .357 Sig G19 much more than his G23.

Probably met G32 or the service sized G31 ? G19 is the 9mm and I don't think a conversion barrel swings from that to a ..357... At least as far as I know. You can go the other way tho.

I have a G22 and G35. Service and tactical sized. Longer yet. Very controllable. I am not a huge fan of the .40. Far as I'm concerned, I could only shoot the .357 and .45 and be perfectly happy.

 

[tnek]

One more thing before I go. I have owned a couple Glocks. They ran fine but I never really shot them that much. I just dont care for the grip angle. Its almost a Ginger vs Mary Ann thing.