Video of cop shooting unarmed man released

[kingnereli]

This is an obviously bad shoot. The right arm movement is simply what the cop's lawyer is going to stress in a pitiful attempt to keep his client out of jail. His hand was on his thigh and DID NOT MOVE for several seconds before he was shot. Let along some imagined drawing motion to the waist band.

The news report said he is looking at up to 11 years in prison. It won't be justice unless he gets the maximum sentence. I'd bet a weeks wages he is found guilty.

 

[j706]

IMO no conviction will happen with this. It depends on the type of jury. The officer does not have to prove the idiot had a gun. All he has to do is prove that he thought that he had a gun. Any reasonable person given the circumstances, could/would have thought the guy was armed.

What kind of goof runs from the police and then fails to comply with even the most basic demands like showing your hands? Life is hard,Life is even harder when you are stupid. This idiot on the bike was stupid. His life is very hard. I say not guilty on the officer, they will buy the idiot a motorized humaround wheel chair complete with shiny mag wheels on it and give him a few bucks.

With all that out of the way, if the officer would have had backup with him or in other words had lethal force to back him up-right there and right then. Myself I would have given the guy the electric ride. But only if I had lethal force backup. Maybe the officer fired a little fast. We do not know his past history. Has he been shot at before? Is he new? Tough call. But IMO it sure is NOT criminal.

Bottom line-don't run from the police. If you do decide to run from the police and you do get caught (or stop on your own) do what the man tells you and do it when he tells you. Common sense people....common sense. This one is a bad deal for all involved. There are no winners with this incident.

 

[samot]

I find it entertaining, the amount of gun lovin, 2nd amendment toten, people on this forum that carry the mindstate of do as the copper says or DIE

 

[Eddie]

I find it entertaining, the amount of gun lovin, 2nd amendment toten, people on this forum that carry the mindstate of do as the copper says or DIE

IMO this is the type of case that gets won or lost during jury selection. Remember, its a criminal trial so the defense just needs to get one juror seated who will find that the state didn't prove its case beyond a reasonable doubt. Its all gonna depend on what kind of pool they had to pick from and how sharp the prosecutor was at striking jurors.

This is the sort where the longer they are out, the better it is for the defense. My bet is that if they turn in a verdict by five, he's guilty, if it goes over the weekend they'll end up with a hung jury. I would be surprised to see a return of an "innocent" verdict.

 

[buffalo-springfield40]

Nationally televised, real time news coverage of the slow moving Ford Bronco chase.

That, and the best legal defense that money could buy.

i do get your point...but still....male , at the time a suspect of a double murder...fleeing.....with a gun...and at the time they thought had a hostage...compared to a young man on a sportster....who turns his head the wrong direction....and maybe or maybe not heard the cop say something....wrong dude is dead...shame bad cops give good cops a bad rap...

 

[printcraft]

Guy on the harley was clearly coming right for him.

What a tool.

 

[JBusch8899]

i do get your point...but still....male , at the time a suspect of a double murder...fleeing.....with a gun...and at the time they thought had a hostage...compared to a young man on a sportster....who turns his head the wrong direction....and maybe or maybe not heard the cop say something....wrong dude is dead...shame bad cops give good cops a bad rap...

Again, I'm going to ask, why does everyone presume that this guy is a "bad" cop?

Monday morning quarterbacking and reviewing the video dozens of times doesn't change the totality of the circumstances or the outcomes for both the cop and the person shot.

 

[JBusch8899]

.....I would be surprised to see a return of an "innocent" verdict.

No such verdict is currently available in our criminal justice system. A "Not guilty" verdict merely states that the prosecution did not meet their burden of proof to ascertain a guilty verdict.

Even within a civil action, a person is deemed "liable", or "not liable" for his actions or inactions. Again, the burden of proof is upon the plaintiff, to prove liability. A finding of "not liable", merely means that the plaintiff did not prove his case.

A person cannot, by definition, be considered summarily exonerated of the offense after the verdict of a trial.

 

[CountryBoy19]

IMO no conviction will happen with this. It depends on the type of jury. The officer does not have to prove the idiot had a gun. All he has to do is prove that he thought that he had a gun. Any reasonable person given the circumstances, could/would have thought the guy was armed.

What kind of goof runs from the police and then fails to comply with even the most basic demands like showing your hands? Life is hard,Life is even harder when you are stupid. This idiot on the bike was stupid. His life is very hard. I say not guilty on the officer, they will buy the idiot a motorized humaround wheel chair complete with shiny mag wheels on it and give him a few bucks.

With all that out of the way, if the officer would have had backup with him or in other words had lethal force to back him up-right there and right then. Myself I would have given the guy the electric ride. But only if I had lethal force backup. Maybe the officer fired a little fast. We do not know his past history. Has he been shot at before? Is he new? Tough call. But IMO it sure is NOT criminal.

Bottom line-don't run from the police. If you do decide to run from the police and you do get caught (or stop on your own) do what the man tells you and do it when he tells you. Common sense people....common sense. This one is a bad deal for all involved. There are no winners with this incident.

Runs from the police?
I think you must have missed the part of the video where he stopped... did you even watch the video? By the time he/they realized there was an officer with his lights on behind them they stopped as soon as they could. Have you ever ridden a bike before? They certainly can't/don't stop as quickly as a car, and I've never seen anybody slam on their brakes and pull over immediately anyways. They aren't required to lock their brakes up and crash on the side of the road to pull over for the cops, they just have to safely pull over, which is what they did considering the circumstances...

 

[Tryin']

Really, this is sad. A cops life is ruined. A bikers life, and that of his family (if any) is destroyed. Over what? A sudden acceleration citation turned almost manslaughter. (don't know the technical term, attempted murder doesn't seem right)

Armchair quarter back or not, THAT. WAS. NOT. a justifiable reaction. Not even close.

You guys defending the officer, make sure you watch the video. Not sayin', jus' sayin'. . .

I have had more threatening conversations, under more duress, with my father in law. And boss. And coworkers. I appreciate all that law enforcement does, but that was saddening.

 

[JBusch8899]

Runs from the police?
I think you must have missed the part of the video where he stopped... did you even watch the video? By the time he/they realized there was an officer with his lights on behind them they stopped as soon as they could. Have you ever ridden a bike before? They certainly can't/don't stop as quickly as a car, and I've never seen anybody slam on their brakes and pull over immediately anyways. They aren't required to lock their brakes up and crash on the side of the road to pull over for the cops, they just have to safely pull over, which is what they did considering the circumstances...

I'm not advocating for the LEO in this instance, but lets not forget a few things here....... the guy on the bike didn't demonstrate that he was all too smart.

Who drives in that manner, especially with a cop in one's rear view mirror? Motorcyles are more likely to not be seen and hit than other motorized vehicle on the road. Who on a bike doesn't pay extra particular attention to his surroundings, so that an automobile doesn't hit him? On a dark night, who can't see a cop's overhead lights that lights up one's surroundings?

When pulled over by a cop, who hides their hands? Who makes sudden movements when a firearm is pointed at your body? Who disobeys a cop's order to show his hands?

 

[groovatron]

cop needs to go to jail for a long long time. whats fair for us citizens is fair for cops too! we citizens would be going to jail, but im sure he will just get a slap on the hand, and probly be working as a cop somewhere else shortly. shame on the system!!!

This is pretty much my viewpoint. If we were all talking about a civilian shooting like this, the case would be cut and dry. Why does a cop get special privileges? He had the positional advantage being behind the guy, flood light on him, gun drawn, and backup officer nearby. Anyone who thinks that this shoot is justified is an absolute fool and should move to a third world country where this kind of thing is more commonplace.

If disobeying a cop gets you shot, the experiment of having police has failed. We need to fire them all and try something new.

 

[sporter]

Throw him in the can for 8 years.

I am almost betting this cop in the excitement had his booger picker on the trigger finger and zapped one off by accident.
Obviously from there the "he was going for a gun" story comes in, problem is there was no gun and this guy had his back to the cop.

 

[Srtsi4wd]

8 Seconds.

Watch the vid and pay attention to the counter in the corner.
8 seconds elapse from the point the officer's car stops to the shot being fired.

The rider has been on a Harley, riding next to a buddy with the same.
2 possibilities here.
1. He had earplugs in. Not likely. But same result as #2.
2. After riding on and next to a Harley, having a 2 sirens blaring, 1 right behind him and 1 directly in front, how well do you think he was hearing at that point?

The main argument being made on this thread is to COMPLY or risk being shot. Being unable to hear the command and refusing to comply are two VERY different things. Yes, he was a jacka$$ and should have received a citation, not a hollowpoint.

8 seconds. During which he was intently watching his buddy be pulled over directly in front of him. IMHO, he didn't hear a word the cop said. Maybe just enough to think he heard the cop behind him, but I doubt he could understand.

One shot. LEO would have unloaded on him if he really thought he was in danger. My bet is he had his finger on the trigger and was in the middle of a andrenaline surge. It wasn't cold blood, but it wasn't justified either.
My

 

[PatriotPride]

One shot. LEO would have unloaded on him if he really thought he was in danger. My bet is he had his finger on the trigger and was in the middle of a andrenaline surge. It wasn't cold blood, but it wasn't justified either.
My

It took one shot to stop the percieved threat here. That's what we advocate here, isn't it? Shoot until the threat ceases. I find your assumption that "LEO would have unloaded on him if he really thought he was in danger" asinine at best and downright dangerous at worst. Having this kind of mentality will cause some serious issues IMO.

 

[KDUBCR250]

So its ok to shoot people for making a sudden move if I feel threatened ? Or does the badge make it ok ? Ill have to remember to tell my lawyer this. Badge or no badge it a bad shoot and anyone can see that !

 

[smoking357]

This is pretty much my viewpoint. If we were all talking about a civilian shooting like this, the case would be cut and dry. Why does a cop get special privileges? He had the positional advantage being behind the guy, flood light on him, gun drawn, and backup officer nearby. Anyone who thinks that this shoot is justified is an absolute fool and should move to a third world country where this kind of thing is more commonplace.

Here's the rub: even in depressed third-world countries, this stuff is nowhere near as common as it is here. Many third-world countries don't give a hoot about you driving off the road on your motorcycle. They're not going to break their backs trying to get you to the hospital, either.

 

[buffalo-springfield40]

Again, I'm going to ask, why does everyone presume that this guy is a "bad" cop?

Monday morning quarterbacking and reviewing the video dozens of times doesn't change the totality of the circumstances or the outcomes for both the cop and the person shot.

cause he shot a kid in the back!!!!!!!!!!!!.......even outlaws in the cowboy days didnt think to highly of anyone shooting someone in the back...this kid did not pose any threat to anyone..he was sitting on a motorcycle..grant it..it looks like a sportster..but even that isnt reason to shoot you...IN THE BACK!!

 

[buffalo-springfield40]

oh yea..best part is when this cop shoots the guy..watches him fall...then yells.."put your hands up",,,,,jeez..

 

[JBusch8899]

cause he shot a kid in the back!!!!!!!!!!!!.......even outlaws in the cowboy days didnt think to highly of anyone shooting someone in the back...this kid did not pose any threat to anyone..he was sitting on a motorcycle..grant it..it looks like a sportster..but even that isnt reason to shoot you...IN THE BACK!!

Actually, outlaws in the old west did it all the time. That is the reason why bars have mirrors behind them. The history channel is a good thing.

Again, we can speculate all we want by looking through the video all the times we want, one has to consider the totality of the circumstances when determining culpability.

As we hadn't sat at the trial to observe the testimony presented, how can any of us, definitively state that he is a bad cop, clean cop, jerk, hero, coward, etc.? Answer: We can't. At least, not until the verdict arrives.