NWI INGO General Post - Part 7

[jedi]

Just FYI ... It's not recommended that you refill. Once you refill a 1# cylinder, it becomes a federal offense (felony) to transport that tank. $500,000 fine and 5 years in prison (49 U.S.C. 5124)

ADDED: You're playing with fire.

Thanks

 

[jedi]

Guess I'm just better off buying a 20# tank and the adpater for the webber grill then since those **CAN** be refilled **AND** transported right?

 

[jedi]

nevermind

 

[Wild Deuce]

Sorry ... didn't mean to harsh your mellow.

 

[geronimojoe85]

Jedi, you suck at this game

 

[melensdad]

Jedi, you suck [strike]at this game[/strike]

Joe, FIFY

 

[melensdad]

Just FYI ... It's not recommended that you refill. Once you refill a 1# cylinder, it becomes a federal offense (felony) to transport that tank. $500,000 fine and 5 years in prison (49 U.S.C. 5124)

ADDED: You're playing with fire.

Guess I'm just better off buying a 20# tank and the adpater for the webber grill then since those **CAN** be refilled **AND** transported right?

It should also be pointed out that it is actually safe to refill the canisters. What you do with them after their are refilled may well be restricted to protect crony capitalism, but it doesn't make it unsafe to refill or use refilled canisters.

If fact if it were unsafe then the companies selling those adapters would be open to huge lawsuits and product recalls by the Consumer Products Safety Commission.

Yes, Hernando is correct you are playing with fire. But then why not also warn everyone about RELOADING being dangerous? After all, smokeless powder is highly flammable.

Follow instructions.

Handle volatile gases carefully.

Don't say "Hold my beer and watch this" just before doing anything . . .

 

[lonehoosier]

https://www.indianagunowners.com/fo...ings/323305-new-member-northwest-indiana.html

Same new member lookin for idea.

https://www.indianagunowners.com/forums/handguns/323309-first-gun-possibly-ruger-sp101.html

 

[sadclownwp]

Ok guys, now that we know the 21st has won for the Bythe's Christmas Shoot, I need a head count for all those attending.

 

[gunbunnies]

Soooo how can a person that is enforcing such laws figure out if your 1# propane canister has been refilled in order to arrest you ? What is different about that can versus the ones you just picked up at walmart ?

You guys got it all wrong on the alcolhol.... Nothing like a pain killer with a scotch chaser... Just saying....

now hold my beer while I..... nevermind....

 

[jedi]

@GB

how do they know would be a question for the courts just like how does the aft know you are 922r complaint with your ak having enough us-parts without it being inspected and your house raided for other evidence and these post online as well.

in doing more readinging online the issue with refilling the 1#lb cans comes from the metal used by those cans. the 1# were not designed to be refilled (metal wise mfg processes) vs the 20# and up that were. so the refilling process continues to weaken the metal canister to the point where it may not be stable for transportation (ie. all that banging around, movement). that seems to be the issue. granted the coleman ones are 'overbuild' metal wise but still not up to par per the fed regs.
yes you can refil and use as many have done but you have to know the risk and be careful about it.
everyone of us is already on 'da list' so i'm not giving BB another reason.

 

[Wild Deuce]

It should also be pointed out that it is actually safe to refill the canisters. What you do with them after their are refilled may well be restricted to protect crony capitalism, but it doesn't make it unsafe to refill or use refilled canisters.

If fact if it were unsafe then the companies selling those adapters would be open to huge lawsuits and product recalls by the Consumer Products Safety Commission.

Yes, Hernando is correct you are playing with fire. But then why not also warn everyone about RELOADING being dangerous? After all, smokeless powder is highly flammable.

Follow instructions.

Handle volatile gases carefully.

Don't say "Hold my beer and watch this" just before doing anything . . .

The "playing with fire" comment was meant as a figure of speech. I was not referencing the flammable characteristics of Propane in particular.

I sent this to Jedi and I might as well post it here since it is being discussed ...

The issue isn't the Feds although I agree that businesses at times will use the coercive force of government to protect their interests.

It's about knowing what you are doing with those tanks AND understanding the characteristics of Propane. The cylinders are cheap and not meant for multiple use. You have no way of hydrostatic testing the cylinders and don't know when one of them will fail. It's like reloading brass except that you can't visually inspect the inside of the tank. The tank will not bulge (like softer brass) or crack benignly prior to failure ... it will just fail catastrophically.

Also, when pressurizing any vessel and during usage, you have issues with moisture buildup that will cause corrosion on the inside of the tank. This can weaken the tank further. You also have no way of knowing (without hydrostatic testing) if there are any stress fractures in the steel. Dedicated cylinders intended for multiple refills are made of heavier gauge steel and have test dates stamped on them (take a look at the next 20# cylinder you see). Even those 20# tanks have a limited life. The 1# tanks would have a much, much shorter life span if they are being refilled ... could even be one refill. I would hate to be around ... especially when it's being filled with propane.

When tanks are refilled at suppliers, they also employ an NFPA mandated OPD (required for 4-40 lb cylinders). They are not required for anything under 4 lbs because those cylinders are not supposed to be refilled commercially.

You're also not going to get the max refill from your 20# tank and the amount you get will drop with each 1# tank that you fill.

Bottom line ... do what you want but be aware of ALL the risks and see if they are worth the money you are saving.
​

 

[gunbunnies]

Lets see here where do I get one of these refillers and where did I put those used cans at.....

The NSA's been watching us all for years.... and I just wish they would give me back those images I lost when that old hard drive failed a couple years ago... come on I know you guys have them...

Sooo basically they wouldn't know unless you had a accident with one then... It's just like anything else, know the issues and plan for them and if you can save a buck with the process and keep it safe why not ?......

 

[baddyna96]

sadclown, Colleen and I will be there.

 

[melensdad]

FWIW, if you put your 1# canisters in the freezer prior to re-charging them you will get more gas in them since gas contracts when its cold and expands when its warm.

Clearly you can tell what side of the "refillable canister debate" I fall on.

And with all the research done on this issue I'd like to see what % of people have had issues. ZERO-POINT-WHAT percent? Its sort of like what % of guns are used in crimes? Or what % of matches are used to start arson fires.

Now hold my beer while I light a cigar. I'm in the middle of pouring W321 into the hopper of my progressive reloader and I don't want to drop my ash into the powder hopper.

 

[geronimojoe85]

If say Jedi is more likely to blow himself up than get thrown in the pokey for this particular "crime." The only reason I say that is because after all it is Jedi.

 

[Wild Deuce]

I'm going to stop here. Soooo much bad advice and misunderstanding about refilling a pressurized vessel ... freezing the tanks? condensation, frozen pressure relief valves ... oh my.

Every time you refill and it works fine, I'll just say "Bravo! Good for you! ... so far, so good"

[video=youtube;V7GP3l5znc8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V7GP3l5znc8[/video]

It doesn't matter to me personally. I'm not calling the feds. I was just passing along the information so Jedi could make an informed decision. The rest of it is job security for me.

BTW, how much money is saved by refilling those 1lb tanks?

 

[melensdad]

About $1.50 per tank.

 

[gunbunnies]

I would also put the ability to refill the 1# canisters in the category of having the tools and knowledge if I need it too...

I don't normally pour my own bullets for normal handgun reloading or make and reload cartridges with black powder for shooting, or make my own caned heat stoves etc... but I have the knowledge to do it and if there are any strange tools I need to have on hand it's a bonus if I possess them...

I don't use enough of the 1 # cans of propane to make it useful to do it on a regular basis but it is a nice tool and skill set to have if needed....

WD, I take notice to the dangers of doing it just as I would keep in mind the dangers of producing diesel from alcohol and grease from the kitchen or harnessing the use of methane from the waste around the house for heating... but yet still do it if I need to....

 

[jedi]

FYI the 2014 NWI Calendar of Events is now up!
2014 NWI Events

IF YOU HAVE AN EVENT PLEASE PM ME SO I CAN EITHER PUT IT UNDER THE RIGHT HEADING OR MAKE A NEW HEADING FOR IT

Note the NOV 2014 Meet & Shoot is already set.
In addition 2nd week of JAN 2014 we need to start talking about Youth Day for JUN 2014 with Winamac DNR once again.
So keep that in mind. If you see .22lr please keep us/winamac in mind. They have cash to buy .22lr but can't find it.