Military To Replace M9 With?

[jeremy]

that is not true, everybody knows that bigger holes=better, which explains why a .380 is more powerful than a .338 Lapua

LOL....338 penetrates body armor still at over 1500 meters....and .380 and .38 special is considered by nearly all of the world ballistics leaders to be the minimum acceptable calibers for self defense...and you really just compared them.....never heard of neural shock huh...let alone witnessed it

Pssstttt....

That was SARCASM...

 

[RobbLG]

LOL....338 penetrates body armor still at over 1500 meters....and .380 and .38 special is considered by nearly all of the world ballistics leaders to be the minimum acceptable calibers for self defense...and you really just compared them.....never heard of neural shock huh...let alone witnessed it

I don't think he Failed... I think he just Failed to make it purple..

 

[the1kidd03]

I'll gladly call him a Liar...
I HAVE been shot in the vest a Couple of Times by 7.62x39 on a couple different occasions and it does not send you ass flying through the air. Tell His Pogue Ass to get better Stories...

I have...
In Afghanistan, Iraq, Bosnia, Kosovo, Albainia, Macedonia, Africa, Central and South America...
And a Pistol does not have Knock Down Power...
What next on your listing of Fail...



You do realize that 9mm has probably Killed more Persons in Combat than any other Pistol Cartridge...

It has been working for over a 100 Years at ridding the World of Enemy Combatants...

Jeremy, rough start....but you're awesome....lol "pogue"...

 

[RobbLG]

Pretty entertaining thread...

I voted M&P just for the fact that I've thought many times that I wish I could qualify with my personal M&P... I just shoot it better...

 

[the1kidd03]

I don't think he Failed... I think he just Failed to make it purple..

roger that....I fail at getting sarcasm a lot....I'll admit

 

[ryknoll3]

LOL....338 penetrates body armor still at over 1500 meters....and .380 and .38 special is considered by nearly all of the world ballistics leaders to be the minimum acceptable calibers for self defense...and you really just compared them.....never heard of neural shock huh...let alone witnessed it

No one on INGO ever seems to understand un-purple sarcasm. =)

 

[grizman]

Wrong!

Why yes you are!

The HS2000 (Hrvatski Samokres (Croatian Pistol)), or XD (X-treme Duty) are a series of semi-automatic pistol that are polymer-framed and striker-fired. Manufactured in the city of Karlovac, Croatia by HS Produkt (formerly I.M. Metal), the Springfield Armory XD is the marketing name for the weapon, which is licensed and sold in the US by Springfield Armory, Inc.


Do some research!!

 

[the1kidd03]

lol...I don't doubt that.....oh, and my apologies to the OP of that comment

 

[UncleMike]

LMFAO!!!!1 headshots...NOT kill?? after seeing how many people have thrown their 2 cents in I wasn't even going to try to catch up...but I couldn't pass this up...... I mean...have you ever seen someone take a round to the head..lol it's LITERALLY like a light switch....no movement, no reaction....just drop like a sac of potatoes....that's why it's standard training.....and I'm sure your personal experience/testing is far more credible than government funded nationwide testing from the last several decades to include live body headshots...but hey...I'm sure you know better

OK
I'll type this real slow so even someone like you can understand it.
As a recent example, Gabby Giffords was shot in the head at close range with a Glock M 19 loaded with WW 115 gr ball ammo.
The bullet passed through without inflicting fatal damage.
In case you missed that, it was in all of the papers.

And I really would like to read those Government funded Nationwide Testing from the last several decades to include LIVE BODY HEADSHOTS.
Since you're aware of their existence I can safely presume they are Public Record and available to all INGO Members.
Please link to the reports.
Or could it be that you're full of ??

 

[Earl Sinclair]

Voted for Glock because I believe they are most likely to work in harsh climates with indifferent maintenance. Unfortunately, the Pentagon is almost certain to have target shooters choose the gun, giving our men in uniform something else that is excessively accurate for combat conditions, which is another way of saying cantankerous, fragile, and high-maintenance.

 

[the1kidd03]

Then you'll remember in the 80's..live slaughter house testing was still allowed ( I said live body, I didn't say human) in which ballistics experts from all walks of life tested just about everything....the skull resembling the same characteristics as that of the human skull, it reacts the same in regards to impact.....22's almost always did not finish the job...where as 9mm did.....not to mention the countless casualties of the 9mm in the last few decades of military service and of my own witnessed head shots....in your "extensive studies"...you may wish to look up testing performed by Massad Ayoob, Evan Marshall, Edwin Sanow, and even the jello junkies from the FBI as well as prefessional testimony/opinions of several renowned neurologists like Dr. Dennis Tobin who expert medical opinion fully verified the concept of neural shock.....

but I'm sure you know all about each one of those men's studies, since you have more than them under you're belt

 

[the1kidd03]

oh...and Chuck Karwan...who was also a combat vet and martial arts expert

you're not the only one who "studies" ballistics...but credibility comes from much more than back yard shooting and theories

 

[jeremy]

On a serious note I am actually amazed by the number of Posters that Have no Idea how Military Weapons Trails are...

 

[Silverado]

OK
I'll type this real slow so even someone like you can understand it.
As a recent example, Gabby Giffords was shot in the head at close range with a Glock M 19 loaded with WW 115 gr ball ammo.
The bullet passed through without inflicting fatal damage.
In case you missed that, it was in all of the papers.

It may not have killed her, but it probably reduced her to your level of reasoning ability.

BTW, I notice you didn't have much to say about my link to the incident where multiple .45 hollowpoints didn't put someone out of the fight, even with 6 torso hits.

Cat got your keyboard?

Here's another one for ya. Multiple .45 rounds, failing to stop someone:

The Shootist: One Man Got Involved. The Perry Stephens/George Temple Incident

Finally a head shot did the trick. But barely. Must have been Boar Hog brand Teat Bullets.

 

[HICKMAN]

funny how we hear talk of stopping power, calibers, headshots...

From the FBI web site, over the past several years, the number of deaths inflicted upon LEO by the BGs, have been decreasing.

Surprisingly, deaths of LEOs, are caused by the .38special and the .40S&W, both had six kills each of LEO through their body amour.

In the civilian world, the lowly .22cal LR is still the top dog in kills of any caliber. Of course we do not wear body amour, but the stats speak for themselves.

I know we're talking military here, where guns are subjected to the worst conditions, not an air conditioned patrol car. But a bullet is bullet, aim is more important.



I voted bacon... killer of all muslim terrorists


SOCOM has their own rules, they buy what they want. It would be nice if the branches got together and let the people who actually USE sidearms the most (and the armorers that have to repair them) decide what fits them best.

 

[the1kidd03]

you can site one instance of recent 9mm mishaps...where you cannot confirm distance from muzzle, angle of trajectory, or point of impact........or you can go from countless dead bodies across the world...whether police, combat, or gangbanger scenarios...the 9mm speaks for itself

 

[AF Gunner]

On a serious note I am actually amazed by the number of Posters that Have no Idea how Military Weapons Trails are...

They are just a political as any other government process. You think the best one is the one we buy?

 

[LLDJR]

is that a joke?

and seriously 18 people so far have put xD?

I surely thought the post was good for more than 2 rises

 

[the1kidd03]

funny how we hear talk of stopping power, calibers, headshots...

From the FBI web site, over the past several years, the number of deaths inflicted upon LEO by the BGs, have been decreasing.

Surprisingly, deaths of LEOs, are caused by the .38special and the .40S&W, both had six kills each of LEO through their body amour.

In the civilian world, the lowly .22cal LR is still the top dog in kills of any caliber. Of course we do not wear body amour, but the stats speak for themselves.

I know we're talking military here, where guns are subjected to the worst conditions, not an air conditioned patrol car. But a bullet is bullet, aim is more important.



I voted bacon... killer of all muslim terrorists


SOCOM has their own rules, they buy what they want. It would be nice if the branches got together and let the people who actually USE sidearms the most (and the armorers that have to repair them) decide what fits them best.

I completely second this....it's the soldier/marine's life on the line...he should be able to choose what he wants to protect it....it's just not cost effective....although, not to sound too coneited I'm pretty accurate with the Beretta and would probably still choose it myself....I do love 1911's though, but I like 15 vs 7/8

 

[the1kidd03]

funny how we hear talk of stopping power, calibers, headshots...

From the FBI web site, over the past several years, the number of deaths inflicted upon LEO by the BGs, have been decreasing.

Surprisingly, deaths of LEOs, are caused by the .38special and the .40S&W, both had six kills each of LEO through their body amour.

In the civilian world, the lowly .22cal LR is still the top dog in kills of any caliber. Of course we do not wear body amour, but the stats speak for themselves.

I know we're talking military here, where guns are subjected to the worst conditions, not an air conditioned patrol car. But a bullet is bullet, aim is more important.



I voted bacon... killer of all muslim terrorists


SOCOM has their own rules, they buy what they want. It would be nice if the branches got together and let the people who actually USE sidearms the most (and the armorers that have to repair them) decide what fits them best.

I don't doubt the count on the 22 considering accidental shootings and such.....but I've seen one actually NOT break skin....amongst much, much other evidence...so I won't be putting my life on the line of a 22 anytime soon..lol ....but agree with your post..