Merry Christmas! You killed your step-daughter.

[SERparacord]

Somebody coming through a basement window is more than trespassing, it is called breaking and entering.

Who said she was coming in through the window? I heard on the internet that she had threatened to tell mom about his sexual advances. Story is full of holes. Merry Christmas.

 

[rgrimm01]

The dispatcher said "the homeowners said it may have been their daughter coming through window. She is in the basement now.".

 

[Fargo]

Who said she was coming in through the window? I heard on the internet that she had threatened to tell mom about his sexual advances. Story is full of holes. Merry Christmas.

So "I heard on the internet" is the standard you use to send people to prison, a la your earlier post?

I dunno what happened so I'm not gonna say what should happen. I am fascinated by those with the great INGO balls-o-clairvoyance...

 

[SERparacord]

So "I heard on the internet" is the standard you use to send people to prison, a la your earlier post?

I dunno what happened so I'm not gonna say what should happen. I am fascinated by those with the great INGO balls-o-clairvoyance...

You didn't buy yours when the INGO Store was open! Shame, shame.

 

[Fargo]

Ah yes, a collectors collectible!

 

[Manatee]

And absolutely should be shot.

This from an instructor?!!! Turn in your clipboard and whistle, buddy.

 

[Snapdragon]

I'm thinking Shay may have implied purple with that comment.

 

[Manatee]

Some people can tell a joke. Some people can't.

Death of a kid in these circumstances is not something to joke about.

 

[Snapdragon]

Agreed.

 

[EdC]

Sounds to me like he did ID his target, it was the person breaking into his home through a window... I would wager there is a reason no arrest has been made, and I would wager it is because the cops and DA are thinking he can meet the preponderance standard in the statute.

I think you are right with respect to the preponderance/reasonable person standard, and I wouldn't bet against you on that.

However, that standard is not really in line with I've understood rule 4 to be. This expresses it better than I can:

"Know what it is, what is in line with it, and what is behind it. Never shoot at anything you have not positively identified . . ." Got it from here: safetyrules

I remember a pic from an NRA book on gun safety/home defense from a course I took some years ago. It showed a silhouette of man coming up the stairs with an arm upraised with what looked like a club in his hand. Looked threatening enough, but lo and behold it was "dad" smiling with a newspaper in his hand.

I agree that it would be reasonable for a person under the circumstances to presume that an unknown person coming in through a basement window at 6:00 am intends to do harm to person or property. As it's impossible to know what someone is thinking, the law allows us to draw reasonable inferences as to their intent from the circumstances. I'm all for that, as the legal standard.

I agree that juveniles living in a house with guns kept for home defense should be made to understand that creeping into their house through a basement window might have some pretty dire consequences. However, I also believe that an adult living in a house with kids should also know that sometimes 14 year olds don't do what they are told, because they are 14 years old, and sometimes make stupid decisions. So identify your target before you shoot it.

Could I see myself in the step dad's shoes, screwing up like he did? You bet I can. But as between a 14 year old girl doing something stupid and a 29 year old adult, the screw up that got someone killed is mostly on him (or would be on me, if I were in his shoes).

My knickers really got twisted in a knot over this, I guess. Sorry about the cursing.

 

[SERparacord]

This from an instructor?!!! Turn in your clipboard and whistle, buddy.

Some people can tell a joke. Some people can't.

Death of a kid in these circumstances is not something to joke about.

I think you are right with respect to the preponderance/reasonable person standard, and I wouldn't bet against you on that.

However, that standard is not really in line with I've understood rule 4 to be. This expresses it better than I can:

"Know what it is, what is in line with it, and what is behind it. Never shoot at anything you have not positively identified . . ." Got it from here: safetyrules

I remember a pic from an NRA book on gun safety/home defense from a course I took some years ago. It showed a silhouette of man coming up the stairs with an arm upraised with what looked like a club in his hand. Looked threatening enough, but lo and behold it was "dad" smiling with a newspaper in his hand.

I agree that it would be reasonable for a person under the circumstances to presume that an unknown person coming in through a basement window at 6:00 am intends to do harm to person or property. As it's impossible to know what someone is thinking, the law allows us to draw reasonable inferences as to their intent from the circumstances. I'm all for that, as the legal standard.

I agree that juveniles living in a house with guns kept for home defense should be made to understand that creeping into their house through a basement window might have some pretty dire consequences. However, I also believe that an adult living in a house with kids should also know that sometimes 14 year olds don't do what they are told, because they are 14 years old, and sometimes make stupid decisions. So identify your target before you shoot it.

Could I see myself in the step dad's shoes, screwing up like he did? You bet I can. But as between a 14 year old girl doing something stupid and a 29 year old adult, the screw up that got someone killed is mostly on him (or would be on me, if I were in his shoes).

My knickers really got twisted in a knot over this, I guess. Sorry about the cursing.

With the mindset you see in the posts here, I am surprised it hasn't happened more. Sound shoots are cool, no need to identify the target.

 

[EdC]

With the mindset you see in the posts here, I am surprised it hasn't happened more. Sound shoots are cool, no need to identify the target.

I'm missing or not understanding something here. Please elaborate on the mindset you see. Thanks.

 

[Birds Away]

So now you have to positively ID them and know their intent? I guess there is no point in having a gun on the nightstand. Safer to lock it up so the BG can't steal it after he kills you.

 

[SERparacord]

I'm missing or not understanding something here. Please elaborate on the mindset you see. Thanks.

I agree with your post.

 

[SERparacord]

So now you have to positively ID them and know their intent? I guess there is no point in having a gun on the nightstand. Safer to lock it up so the BG can't steal it after he kills you.

No need to identify your target, what could possibly happen. Sound shooting is cool.

 

[Manatee]

So now you have to positively ID them and know their intent? I guess there is no point in having a gun on the nightstand. Safer to lock it up so the BG can't steal it after he kills you.

ID'ing friend or foe? Ahhh…….yeah. That's a real good idea unless you want to play drop the soap in greybar.

 

[Fargo]

ID'ing friend or foe? Ahhh…….yeah. That's a real good idea unless you want to play drop the soap in greybar.

Yeah, cause folks breaking into your house at night are not presumptively foes... Once again, they haven't even seen fit to arrest him and you are talking prison. I really need some of those balls-o-clairvoyance.

 

[Birds Away]

ID'ing friend or foe? Ahhh…….yeah. That's a real good idea unless you want to play drop the soap in greybar.

No need to identify your target, what could possibly happen. Sound shooting is cool.

When they sign the affadavit that they mean to do you bodily harm, is a witness or notary required?

 

[Manatee]

No one says he has to be arrested today for a murder/manslaughter charge to be filed. Lots of time to investigate the motive.

 

[Manatee]

When they sign the affadavit that they mean to do you bodily harm, is a witness or notary required?

They? How much bodily harm do you suspect the 14 year old resident of the house was going to employ?

But, he was an officer. I wouldn't expect him to have any common sense.