Merry Christmas! You killed your step-daughter.

[Hookeye]

New idea for a Wed night TV movie....................


Pissed off teen girl lets her thug BF in to knock off her annoying parents.

Coulda made the dad into a Capt Tactical character too.

Eh, too far fetched.

Sorry Kirk you'll never make the big or small screen

 

[Libertarian01]

To All,

I have seen some interesting, thoughtful, and not so thoughtful comments made here.

I tend to agree with the idea that you should 100% determine that the target is a threat before using any kind of force.

There is a thought that, "If someone is in my home without invitation they MUST be up to no good." Really, would you shoot the 72 year old Alzheimers guy who may have broken in with the mail?

I will tell you a true story that illustrates the folly of presuming hostile intent without having all of the facts.

For some background my father sells insurance. Years ago he had a guy insured that decided he didn't need no darn 'lectrician. He just knew how to wire stuff. He had done it before and could do it again. You all know "the guy" or have been him at one time. The one who really doesn't know the forest, but can plant a tree here or there. So this guy runs wires through the attic to put a new ceiling fan in for his wife. She wanted it, so he went out to buy it and install it all on his own. He gotter done! The switch was flipped and the light came on and the fan blades spun.

The problem was he really didn't know what he was doing. Something about wires getting hot near insulation that wasn't quite factored in. At about 3AM, before the era of cell phones, a very decent human being was driving down the road who just happened to see smoke and fire coming from - you guessed it - out of the attic! The driver stopped and started pounding on the front door. After pounding briefly and getting no response the good Samaritan was worried for the safety of the family. Not knowing if they had been overcome with smoke the guy kicked in the front door and started yelling for people to "get up! Your house is on fire" or something to that effect. Finally, the family was awoken and found themselves in the middle of the night standing out in their front lawn watching their house burn as the fire department arrived. The house was saved (mostly), the ceiling fan was not.

Someday one of us may wake up to a total stranger running around inside our house screaming. That does not, in and of itself, denote a threat!

Every time I hear about "if he ain't invited I'm blastin' 'im" or something to that effect I think about the man who saved a family. A man who risked his own life to bring out a husband, a wife, and children because of a fire. I sure as hell would not want to blast him just because he wasn't invited. Would you...?

Regards,

Doug

 

[Kirk Freeman]

Pissed off teen girl lets her thug BF in to knock off her annoying parents.

Sorry, Hook, too many "meye property" types out there and they have guns. My money, all be it I'm playing the percentages, is that this is a "meye property and I can do whatever I wants to" defense.

 

[danielson]

Is Colorado Springs by South Park? Was she comin right at him? Maybe he thought it was ManBearPig.

That's not Scuzzlebutt

YEESS!!!! I cant rep you sepe, have to spread it around.

 

[Hookeye]

Proly a safe bet Kirk, but with the story we've been given it could go any way.
I know kids do stupid things, and that some kids are truly evil.
If a known gun home, then some rules must be followed.
Along with your bet, my guess is that the shooter and victim both didn't think as they should have.

 

[indydrew1]

FWIW I was taught not to sneak into or about the house.

Overall, with that, me thinks that society would be better off if some stepkids did get popped.

OP's story........might have been a terrible accident. Might have been just what was needed. Some rather A holes kids do "snap pout of it". Most don't, but then are just screwups in general, no real threat.

But some never do, and are truly dangerous, even at age 14.

You advocate the killing of innocent children and not one person says a word....... People wonder why gun advocates get a bad wrap?

Its also nice that you only feel "step kids" should get killed, not your own flesh and blood. No issues in your house sir....

 

[Hookeye]

We know really NOTHING of the shooting incident per the story.
And there's NOTHING known about the shooter or victim's character.

Your type still thinks Trayvon to be an angel.

 

[indydrew1]

We know really NOTHING of the shooting incident per the story.
And there's NOTHING known about the shooter or victim's character.

Your type still thinks Trayvon to be an angel.

Great job of trying to change the subject! We are not talking about the case. We are talking about your crazy ass statements. Which have nothing to do with OP's story. And by the way Mr Zimmernan should have been found not guilty. And that has nothing to do with advocating the death of "step children" after you tell a personal story about kids.

 

[Hookeye]

Nobody said crap because I didn't advocate anything.

Whether or not you believe it, some scary kids do exist.

Read between the lines man, without emotionalism, you're making gun owners look bad.

 

[churchmouse]

Nobody said crap because I didn't advocate anything.
Grow up.
Some evil kids do exist, and I've actually met one. Pegged him at age 12.

Like Kirk pointed out and I agreed, probably an OK kid shot by accident. But we don't know anything to say that for certain.

I had to go back and verify but I did not see any advocating shooting an innocent child. I did see a comment as to maybe the right thing was done......could not see a lot of wrong in that.

 

[indydrew1]

Nobody said crap because I didn't advocate anything.

Whether or not you believe it, some scary kids do exist.

Read between the lines man, without emotionalism, you're making gun owners look bad.

You said;

[FONT=Verdana, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]Overall, with that, me thinks that society would be better off if some stepkids did get popped.[/FONT]


[FONT=Verdana, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]Because killing a "step kid" who is posing no threat to you or anyone else, besides in your own mind is a great thing to post. [/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana, Tahoma, Calibri, Geneva, sans-serif]Justify all you want: it's insane and yes you are right evil does exist. The evil is anyone who thinks kids she get "popped". When they do nothing wrong. [/FONT]

 

[Hookeye]

Probably a decent kid gone by somebody acting stupid.
My point was that it might not be (in a general sense)

 

[Dirtebiker]

Pffft, under the facts of a gun forum, silly.

Hi, Kirk the Safety Nanny here. Remember when I told you that the Four Rules were a good idea so you don't set yourself or others on fire? Well, those very same Four Rules that INGO says are old and busted and not hip and cool like all those "modern trainers" will keep your behind out of prison. Yes, kids, taking a human life will have consequences and no amount of times of saying "meye property" will defeat those consequences that you have brought down upon yourself by ignoring the Four Rules.

You say things like this often.
I don't read everything on INGO, so maybe I missed "those very same Four Rules that INGO says are old and busted...". Can you show me where INGO says this?
what the heck is "meye"?

 

[Dirtebiker]

You advocate the killing of innocent children and not one person says a word....... People wonder why gun advocates get a bad wrap?

Its also nice that you only feel "step kids" should get killed, not your own flesh and blood. No issues in your house sir....

That statement ^^^^^^^^ is just silly!
No one said ANYTHING like that!

 

[Hookeye]

A civilized society is reactive to criminal activity and that at times carries a terrible cost.

Unfortunately some bad kids grow up to be worse adults.
Sometimes it's not too hard to see how things will progress.

Some stepkids will turn out to be violent criminals.
Some non stepkids will too.

Just because I didn't make a statement all inclusive, that doesn't mean I was singling out a specific group.
Which leads me to question the uproar.

Don't need or even want an answer to that.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Ug. You sure did get spun up about someone suggesting you actually take a second to identify your target. Coincidentally it's one of those pesky 4 cardinal firearm safety rules people like me go on and on about.....

No, that isn't what you said. You put forth the requirements to ascertain what the person is thinking and what he is capable of doing. That is a long damned way from 'taking a second to identify the target'.

There are plenty of reasons why a person might be in your house, but not be a threat to you.

OK then, how about some realistic examples of why a stranger or hostile non-stranger should be in my house and I should consider it acceptable. Once again, I did not advocate shooting at shadows--I simply reserved the right not to wait for information I am not likely to collect and live to tell about it in the absence of clairvoyant powers.

Ultimately you get to shoot who ever you want. I just hope you don't shoot a kid, your spouse or an old senile person who isn't a threat to you.

Once again you spew bullsh*t. I did NOT--ONCE AGAIN NOT SINCE YOU APPEAR UNABLE TO UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT--advocate shooting people who have not been established to be either unauthorized strangers or hostile non-strangers.

And no, I'm not a "duty to retreat" person. I'm a "don't shoot people who don't need to be shot" person.

If your clairvoyant powers are that good that you magically know the intent of intruders, shouldn't you have supernaturally forseen the incident in time to have the police waiting at the time of the intruder's arrival?

The point is, if you decide to have a gun, every action has an equal and opposite reaction. It's cool to talk tough on a message board, but when you pull that trigger, a life will be over. That's reality.

Fair enough, but if it happens in my house, my life isn't going to be the one ending if I can help it.

Everybodys house and family is different, ideally you'd get your family locked in 1 room, call 911 - yell out that the police are on their way and aim at the door. If this guy had called out, she'd be alive.

The anti gunners have a valid point, you are MORE LIKELY to kill a relative than a bad guy. To dismiss that point and not take it to heart and prep for it well, kind of makes you an idiot.

How do you figure? The last time I checked, there were something on the order of 30 times more crimes stopped with guns than 'accidental' deaths which include general negligence, faulty target identification like this, hunting accidents, and deliberate suicides.

(ex - this daughter sneaks home with a bff, you see the friend, not the daughter & shoot)

.

 

[Hookeye]

And what if that relative is committing an act worthy of being shot?

Doesn't that fit the anti gunner's claim?

Most people murdered or raped knew their attacker.

 

[IndyDave1776]

And what if that relative is committing an act worthy of being shot?

Doesn't that fit the anti gunner's claim?

Most people murdered or raped knew their attacker.

Great point, and one the disingenuous enemies would gleefully ignore while using statistics to prove that figures don't lie, but liars figure.

 

[Fargo]

According to the article below she was climbing in a basement window when shot. Stepdad was also an Army officer, Iraq war vet, and possibly SF.

Death of Kiana O'Neil, shot by stepfather, destroys two military families | Mail Online

If that truly is the case and he didn't know she had snuck out, I'm not going to be piling on stepdad even If I think he could/should have done better. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

The whole thing just sucks no matter what the case.

 

[Hookeye]

Knock, call, text or get somebody who can.
No need to sneak in.
Esp in a gun home.

I guess "don't sneak out" doesn't mean "don't sneak out".

Terrible deal, but damnit, why can't today's kids understand an absolute?

Society tells them to challenge everything, well...............there ya go!