Dallas Protest, Shots Fired

[halfmileharry]

I'm thinking that the cops might want to put up their own sniper teams in place to slow down the carnage.
If this is a continuous happening they should stay on alert.
Cop jobs ain't about the money for sure.
Thanks again to the LEOs and cya. Be safe.
Most of you guys and gals I like.

 

[Thegeek]

I'm holding my tongue on most of the shootings because I don't have all the facts, but I do feel the need to get something off my chest. I've had numerous interactions with the police. I've been arrested twice. I've never once felt in fear of my life. What I understand that I think the majority of people don't is that you're not arrested for what you did, you're arrested for what the officer thinks you did. If you disagree with the officer, it's not the officer you need to argue with. Cooperate, go to your arraignment, and argue in court. If you feel that you were wrongfully arrested, you have legal recourse. Sure there are such things as bad cops, planted evidence, and even murder. Doesn't mean you're going to experience it. I don't care if you think the officer is wrong, you comply, you cooperate, and you remain silent about the situation. Fight them in court, not on the street.

Again, I'm not going to armchair quarterback either of the situations, but I will offer a hypothetical. Do you think the person in LA would be dead right now if they would have relaxed and complied? I'm betting they'd be alive, but in jail right now. It's not about blame, it's about cause and chain of events. Just for argument, take an aggressive cop. I got pulled over for speeding on my motorcycle. Officer dressed in tactical pants, drop leg holster, and super tight army green t-shirt comes up and the first words to me were "it should be legal for me to just run your asses off the road". I was going 75 in a 55 on US 40 near the Hendricks/Putnam county line around 7:30am. Hardly worthy of a death threat. I responded with "absolutely officer, you can have my license and registration". That entire interaction could have had me behind bars if I lost my cool.

Everyone has this idea that they can explain their way out of a ticket/arrest with the police. What's funny is if they're already interacting with you, it's too late. Just shut up and get a lawyer. The one thing all of these events have in common is confrontation. Either started by the attitude of the police, or the attitude of the suspect. All we've done is make that worse. BLM has spread the "F the police" and "cops are out to kill you", and the cops are going into every situation like they're going to be killed. Instead of trying to calm everyone down, these protests are just increasing the tension that leads to bad things. Both sides are at fault, and both sides are making matters worse.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

As far as reasonable solutions go.... what is there?

I actually am curious about answers to this question. How do you stop/quell racial violence? Or is this something we should just expect to happen in a free society from time-to-time?

 

[Expat]

Position: BLM is responsible for the attacks because the shooter(s) supported the principles of BLM.

Position: Gun owners are responsible for the attacks because the shooter(s) supported the principles of gun ownership.

The same flawed logic leads to both positions.

Did I miss the gun owners marching around different towns chanting, Pigs in a blanket, Fry 'em like bacon?

 

[oldpink]

Position: BLM is responsible for the attacks because the shooter(s) supported the principles of BLM.

Position: Gun owners are responsible for the attacks because the shooter(s) supported the principles of gun ownership.

The same flawed logic leads to both positions.

With one key difference: You don't see those who are motivated by 2A issues celebrating the deaths of cops literally in the faces of other cops.

 

[phylodog]

Position: BLM is responsible for the attacks because the shooter(s) supported the principles of BLM.

So...completely ignore the time and place of the attack? Just a coincidence that it happened during a BLM protest?

Ok, sure.

 

[Wolfhound]

I actually am curious about answers to this question. How do you stop/quell racial violence? Or is this something we should just expect to happen in a free society from time-to-time?

I don't have all the answers but I think if the media would drop their agenda and stop race baiting and cop bashing that might be a good start. In my eyes the media has blood on their hands now.

 

[Kutnupe14]

So...completely ignore the time and place of the attack? Just a coincidence that it happened during a BLM protest?

Ok, sure.

So are you saying ALL the people who participated in this march, are just as responsible for the attack as the shooters themselves? I'm just trying to see where you think the two diverge.... if at all.

 

[jamil]

...

 

[phylodog]

So are you saying ALL the people who participated in this march, are just as responsible for the attack as the shooters themselves? I'm just trying to see where you think the two diverge.... if at all.

I'm saying this has been the logical direction BLM has been moving from day one. I'll allow someone else to sprinkle the blame throughout accordingly.

 

[indiucky]

That poor guy with the long gun is going be a marked man, and probably be given grief til they put him in the ground. NRA, needs to highlight that guy...because outside of the police, he's the only other person who could obviously defend himself if needed.

Truth...

 

[T.Lex]

Did I miss the gun owners marching around different towns chanting, Pigs in a blanket, Fry 'em like bacon?

With one key difference: You don't see those who are motivated by 2A issues celebrating the deaths of cops literally in the faces of other cops.

Not every BLM participant does either of those things. BLM - to the extent it is organized - does not say that. Or did I miss the part of its website where it advocates killing cops?

Oh that's right, this is INGO. Totally logical to extrapolate the extremism of a subgroup to an entire group.

Let's remember that when certain INGOers say extreme things about other groups.

So...completely ignore the time and place of the attack? Just a coincidence that it happened during a BLM protest?

Ok, sure.

If it had been at a gay pride event, would you blame gayness?

If you can blame BLM because it was at a BLM event, how can you deny the logic of blaming RKBA for someone using the arms they have the right to bear? If the BLM protest hadn't happened, the cops wouldn't have been shot at the event. If the shooter hadn't had guns, the cops wouldn't have been shot.

You know I understand the emotions involved here. But, in this moment - right now - we must be VERY careful about who we hold responsible, lest it come back to become a sidewinder in our ass later.

 

[miguel]

I'm holding my tongue on most of the shootings because I don't have all the facts, but I do feel the need to get something off my chest. I've had numerous interactions with the police. I've been arrested twice. I've never once felt in fear of my life. What I understand that I think the majority of people don't is that you're not arrested for what you did, you're arrested for what the officer thinks you did. If you disagree with the officer, it's not the officer you need to argue with. Cooperate, go to your arraignment, and argue in court. If you feel that you were wrongfully arrested, you have legal recourse. Sure there are such things as bad cops, planted evidence, and even murder. Doesn't mean you're going to experience it. I don't care if you think the officer is wrong, you comply, you cooperate, and you remain silent about the situation. Fight them in court, not on the street.

Again, I'm not going to armchair quarterback either of the situations, but I will offer a hypothetical. Do you think the person in LA would be dead right now if they would have relaxed and complied? I'm betting they'd be alive, but in jail right now. It's not about blame, it's about cause and chain of events. Just for argument, take an aggressive cop. I got pulled over for speeding on my motorcycle. Officer dressed in tactical pants, drop leg holster, and super tight army green t-shirt comes up and the first words to me were "it should be legal for me to just run your asses off the road". I was going 75 in a 55 on US 40 near the Hendricks/Putnam county line around 7:30am. Hardly worthy of a death threat. I responded with "absolutely officer, you can have my license and registration". That entire interaction could have had me behind bars if I lost my cool.

Everyone has this idea that they can explain their way out of a ticket/arrest with the police. What's funny is if they're already interacting with you, it's too late. Just shut up and get a lawyer. The one thing all of these events have in common is confrontation. Either started by the attitude of the police, or the attitude of the suspect. All we've done is make that worse. BLM has spread the "F the police" and "cops are out to kill you", and the cops are going into every situation like they're going to be killed. Instead of trying to calm everyone down, these protests are just increasing the tension that leads to bad things. Both sides are at fault, and both sides are making matters worse.

At the risk of sounding like John Lennon and losing my reputation as the "punch 'em in the face" and "**** you!" guy on INGO, I think this is the best post I've ever read here.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

This also doesn't help:

This is the start of the Obama/Soros destabilization race war

Also, NRA praises the officers

NRA praises Dallas officers who 'ran toward danger' | Washington Examiner

 

[phylodog]

Not every BLM participant does either of those things. BLM - to the extent it is organized - does not say that. Or did I miss the part of its website where it advocates killing cops?

Oh that's right, this is INGO. Totally logical to extrapolate the extremism of a subgroup to an entire group.

Let's remember that when certain INGOers say extreme things about other groups.


If it had been at a gay pride event, would you blame gayness?

If you can blame BLM because it was at a BLM event, how can you deny the logic of blaming RKBA for someone using the arms they have the right to bear? If the BLM protest hadn't happened, the cops wouldn't have been shot at the event. If the shooter hadn't had guns, the cops wouldn't have been shot.

You know I understand the emotions involved here. But, in this moment - right now - we must be VERY careful about who we hold responsible, lest it come back to become a sidewinder in our ass later.

Perhaps you missed this post:

And there it is.


Dallas chief just said suspects were "motivated by BLM"

Police Chief: "Suspect wanted to kill white people. Especially white officers."

Says 4th suspect did not shoot himself... was killed by police-detonated explosive device.

Today might set an all-time record for deleted tweets

 

[T.Lex]

Perhaps you missed this post:

I did not.

The suspect wanted to kill white people. It is an emotional reaction - totally justifiable given what happened - to project that onto the larger group. But, it is also flawed. It is emotion, not reason. Understandable, but dangerous.

Think of it this way: it is the exact same emotional reaction that would cause someone to project the actions of a few police officer onto all police officers.

I'll not call out the chief, may God bless him in this tragedy, for what he says. That is his opinion in this terrible moment. It does not make it fact, and it sure as hell doesn't make it logical.

 

[Double T]

What happened to photos? Why is all video crappy?

WHat happened to the media reporting occuring like this:

?

What happened here is a tragedy, but there's a reason we are not being shown the carnage, in ALL of these attacks. I don't believe the hype. I am wondering why this happened YESTERDAY. Some very troubling info came from a committee after all...

Super sad, but I don't believe the rhetoric.

 

[Wolfhound]

Also, NRA praises the officers

NRA praises Dallas officers who 'ran toward danger' | Washington Examiner

I think that was the right thing for the NRA to do. I just hope they have increased their security measures for the next few weeks.

 

[phylodog]

I did not.

The suspect wanted to kill white people. It is an emotional reaction - totally justifiable given what happened - to project that onto the larger group. But, it is also flawed. It is emotion, not reason. Understandable, but dangerous.

Think of it this way: it is the exact same emotional reaction that would cause someone to project the actions of a few police officer onto all police officers.

I'll not call out the chief, may God bless him in this tragedy, for what he says. That is his opinion in this terrible moment. It does not make it fact, and it sure as hell doesn't make it logical.

The larger group who regularly chants things like "**** the police" and "Only good cop it a dead cop". You're right, I'll just consider them all innocent and completely ignore the writing on the wall so I can be "progressive".

 

[T.Lex]

The larger group who regularly chants things like "**** the police" and "Only good cop it a dead cop". You're right, I'll just consider them all innocent and completely ignore the writing on the wall so I can be "progressive".

So, shoot'em all and let God sort 'em out?