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CIVIL RELIGIOUS DISCUSSION: All things Christianity
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That thar's Latin...Jetta's an educated man....
Partially == any; which is a total anathema to Protestants. The only work in salvation is the work that Christ did on Calvary.
Of course, we say that in one breath, and in the next breath talk about sanctification which is the life of works as a result salvation and Christ working in our lives. It's not necessary for salvation, but it is the inevitable product of salvation. If your life is lacking of works, then perhaps salvation was not genuine. (e.g. The man with "fire insurance" that said the sinner's prayer at church camp then proceeded to live a selfish, sinful life).
Wait till bust out by Greek skillz, yo.
Reminds me when my daughter was 4 (she's now 5) we were reading some children's Bible story at bed time and there was some reference to asking Jesus into your heart... I asked her if she'd like to ask Jesus into her heart and she rolls her eyes at me (surely a trait learned from her mother) and says "He's already in me heart, what do you want him to do, jump out and jump back in again!?"
-rvb
That's one smart girl you've got there, Ryan. 
It will take some time to answer this. It is a great question though.
"Are you saved?" is a very unOrthodox question. So much so that many Orthodox respond with what does that mean? For Protestants, it seems to us that salvation=saved, but we don't view it that way. The best Orthodox answer to that is I am saved, I am being saved, and by God's grace and mercy, I will be saved.
You can probably see the hints of where your understanding of sanctification would fit into that answer, but to give you a more thorough answer will take time. Maybe days or even a week
Wow.
Perseverance of the Saints (also known as Once Saved Always Saved), is the one of the five points of Calvinism that all reformationist and partial reformationist accept as truth. I think even a large number of Methodist accept it as truth.
As we re-cast these discussions (which I think were also addressed upthread), I keep coming back to the notion that the Biblical expressions of these concepts seem very much like trying to describe a complicated modern process to people without such a background. Or using Six Sigma vernacular on someone without that expertise. It all makes sense when you look at it a certain way, but parts of it just don't make sense, if you are the receiver of the information.
As we re-cast these discussions (which I think were also addressed upthread), I keep coming back to the notion that the Biblical expressions of these concepts seem very much like trying to describe a complicated modern process to people without such a background. Or using Six Sigma vernacular on someone without that expertise. It all makes sense when you look at it a certain way, but parts of it just don't make sense, if you are the receiver of the information.
Agreed. Our framework, terminology, etc. is different enough that it's hard to communicate even when you are saying the same thing.
I'll still maintain that I'm technically correct.
If Methodist do, that would be a surprise.
Wesleyan tradition Churches, ie Methodist, Wesleyan, Nazarene, etc would reject Calvinism. They usually are sworn enemies
Look up Wesleyan-Armenianism vs Calvinism for typical views.
The ability to Backslide which, I believe, is the antithesis of the P in Tulip, is a hallmark of John Wesley and his followers.
Being raised in a Wesleyan tradition, it is the Protestant Tradition with which I am most familiar. It was actually learning of John Wesley's rediscovery of the Greek Fathers that played a key role in my becoming Orthodox.
[FONT=&]I wrote the following 6 years ago. It is an excerpt from a larger piece that still remains unfinished. It may offer some insight to the personal salvation and sanctification question. The last time the file itself was opened was in 2014 and I have not edited it since then so I freely admit I may have misrepresented my own views, but with out further ado.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]So, as established above, all of my major sticking points had been settled and I began attending a small mission parish in Lafayette, Indiana in October of 1999. By November I was a catechumenate and was expected to be received into the Church at Pascha in 2000. My spiritual father though, with whom I met weekly outside of church, believed me to be in need of the sacraments of the Church during the period of Lent and received me by chrismation into the Church on March 5, 2000 a Sunday just prior to Lent. The Saturday Evening prior, in the chapel at the priests house, I made my first confession. I spent a week preparing for it. The sacramental forgiveness would not occur until Sunday morning but, this was my first step into Orthodoxy, I remember both the excitement and joy of finally coming home to the Church of Christ coupled with the reticence to let someone else in on all the sins I had carried with me since my youth. It seems priests can be a little different in their phraseology during confession, and so when I heard the words “are you sorry for your sins?” while bowing in front of the icon of Christ, I simply said yes. Wow was that easy. We returned to the couch and the priest gently admonished me that perhaps I should be ready to enumerate my sins a little for confession to which I replied I had 3 pages of things I had written down to confess but I had been waiting for an obvious cue. Well we returned to the Icon and I went through my list and after a bit of counselling, we burned the list in a trash can. Watching those sins burn away brought back the same emotional feelings of “being saved” in my youth, but I knew the path I was on now would choose different terminology for the changes that could should and would happen in my life. Sunday morning, I would be received by the Church through Holy Chrismation instead of Baptism and Chrismation because as the creed says, “we believe in one baptism..” and I had been previously baptized using a trinitarian formula in the church of my youth.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Sunday I after entering the church building, I was given the opportunity to renounce Satan and even to physically spit on him. I was anointed with the oil of chrismation on the head, heart, hands, feet and all 5 senses to seal me unto God in mind, heart, and soul. Already I was experiencing the joy of what I had found, the pearl of great price for here, characteristic of sacramental theology, I was engaged in all my senses. Orthodoxy does not teach simply a spiritual redemption of the individual, but the redemption of Creation as a whole. Physical things could be sanctified or blessed, and become avenues for communion with God. Over and over again in the hymns of the Church one hears phrases such as “All of creation rejoices....” or All of creation does magnify...” This was most joyously manifested in the receiving of communion. The spiritual direction of my life had changed, and I embarked on a new journey.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Like most people who convert from one tradition to another, I was no exception. I wanted all others to believe as I did. That sentiment has not changed but the overt approach I used in the beginning has been greatly toned down. Orthodoxy has had great missionaries. Saints Cyril and Methodius spring readily to mind, yet I have come to believe both through reading and my personal experience, that the best missionary work is done through each individual Orthodox Christian living a life conformed to the Church. Yet as I have alluded to, Orthodoxy stresses not the individual salvation but corporate. As Tertullian once said long ago, “One Christian is no Christian”; the Russian proverb, “The only thing a person can do alone is perish”. Christians are members of each other in the Body of Christ through baptism and the actions of the one affect all. Western Christianity might agree with that in rational thought but in praxis this belief is not manifested on any great scale if at all. I would say the greatest missionary work accomplished by Orthodoxy though was the conversion of the Russian Lands. This was mainly accomplished through a visit to Constantinople by emmissaries from Saint Vladimir who upon witnessing Orthodoxy in action so impressed St Vladimir that Orthodoxy became the religion in Russia. St Vladimir gets the credit for the recognition and conversion of the Russian Lands, but I would argue that the people his emissaries witnessed engaged in worshipping are worthy of sainthood for it was their actions that precipitated the conversion of Russia. They were living their faith. There is no such thing as an individual Orthodox Christian. One man can not the body of Christ be. One priest can not serve the Liturgy. There must be another person present. I offer the weight of scripture. Noah was saved, but not Noah alone, his family also. The ark was loaded at least by twos. Moses led the children of Israel out, but needed Aaron as his mouthpiece. God opposed kingship, but relented to the people and we know the troubles that caused them. Where two or three are gathered there is Christ in the midst, 12 gathered for the last supper, 120 gathered for pentecost. Pauls letters are addressed to Churches, the letters of Revelations are addressed to Churches. By the actions of one man came the fall, and by the actions of the God-man came eternal life.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Living a New Life[/FONT]
[FONT=&]I have neither the experience or spiritual knowledge to lead others. So I write the following simple thoughts more for others to read and correct me in my misthoughts. Each of us have a methodology to our lives whether we reflect on it much or not. This is my first attempt to formally put to paper my methodology and I am sure will be greatly revised, modified and in some aspects completely changed. Because I believe in cause and effect, my model is based on the consequences of living in linear time. With that brief introduction, I dive in.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Second by Second[/FONT]
[FONT=&]This is the smallest timeframe I consider. To be technically correct, I should title this “from the most infintesmally measurable unit of time to one second” but that would be much too scholastic of me. These brief moments in time are the realm of thoughts. There are various school of thoughts but I offer my own synthesis for consideration. Remembering my penchant for both the absolute and apophatic theology, I eliminate the possiblity of arguing the neutral if I were to say thoughts can be for good or evil by saying thoughts can be for good or not. The Christian should strive to fill the mind with good thoughts I believe this is one reason and actually the primary reason for the need of prayer without ceasing. The more we fill our thoughts with contemplation of the good, the less chance evil has to enter in. At one point in my life, I was practicing the Jesus Prayer, an Orthodox tradition that involves the repetition of a simple prayer. Two common variants are the following:[/FONT]
[FONT=&]“Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&]“Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&]I said it upon arising and while I went through the automatic motions of the shower and dressing that required little consious thought. I recited it while walking to and from classes on campus, and I would say it as I prepared for sleep and when I fell asleep I tried to make it my last thought saying it audibly until sleep took over. I experienced awakening with the prayer audibly on my lips without conscious effort. Oh how I yearn for such experiences now. Filling idle moments with prayer drives away idle thoughts.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The question to really consider is are thoughts sins? Some say thoughts are not sins but rather temptations until we begin to dwell on them or even worse to act upon them. I will not presume to know any answers to the question, but offer my own thoughts on the matter. Many thoughts or temptations come to us because we have experienced the “pleasure” of them in the past. If I had lived as I ought I would not have knowledge of or recall the sensations of pleasure that acting upon such thoughts brings to myself. So even if thoughts are not sins in themselves, they are temporal punishments for the sins of our past because many times they recall past sins. My prayer, O Lord, Use these thoughts to create humility, for I have fallen before, use these thoughts for repentance because I have not filled my thoughts with good things, use these thoughts for thanksgiving for I have been forgiven, Amen. [/FONT]
[FONT=&]Minute by Minute[/FONT]
[FONT=&]We move from the realm of thought to action. It is here we must consider the butterfly effect of our actions on others. No action is truly isolated. All action we take must be for the good in the framework as established above with assumption that no thought can be both good and not good at the same time so with actions. The Christian should strive to fill his life with good actions. In the realm of minutes is where so many sins are committed for me. I don't spend hours, days, months or years planning to sin, I sin minute by minute. Most often these sins are expressed verbally. I tear down my fellow man, I share anothers failings with a third party. I fail to perceive the needs of my brother and meet them. I set my own needs above all others and meet them unfailingly. Actions are decisions made based on thoughts whether conscious or unconscious. As I began my Christian walk, most sins I committed were based on unconscious thought manifesting itself in actions because I was simply acting out the desires of the heart. Most good actions resulted from conscious thought as I began the struggle against the habitual actions of the past. Here is a real danger for as I begin to consciously change, the sin of pride can easily creep in as I admire the new changes in my life and want to take credit for them. I believe this is why the gift of prayer unceasing was taken from me because I became proud that it had happened to me and I have yet to experience it again. Here I encounter the first need for Confession. As a young Christian, I see and begin to identify, through the grace and mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ, the unconscious thoughts that lead me to sin and I begin to struggle to uproot them using the weapons of prayer, fasting, confession, the eucharist, reading of scripture and the lives of the saints. The filling of the mind with spiritual thoughts and the action of dwelling upon them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]At the beginning of the walk, the mountain of unconcious thoughts that lead to sin would seem insurmountable, but I believe that the true magnitude our sinfulness is concealed from ourselves in some degree to keep us from despair. The joy though, is that God forgives and does not give us more work than we can handle at one time. As we mature as Christians, I believe our conscious thoughts and actions towards the good become unconscious as we become more habitual Christians than habitual sinners. Slowly, the sinfulness of our unconscious thoughts and actions are supplanted as our conscious thoughts and actions towards the good move into the realm of unconsciousness and become habitual. And slowly God imparts to us more knowledge of things in our lives that still need work. I believe this is why some saints consider themselves so sinful. At any moment in time, we struggle against the passions and we see some successes and failures, but we keep on pressing towards the good.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Hour by Hour[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Here we encounter goals. Our thoughts move into actions but the linking of multiple actions contribute to the realization of a goal. Here we have the beginning of reflection. The conscious often lets us know immediately of any wrongdoing and how I choose to react says a lot about my spiritual health. Do I know that I have wronged someone, but hesitate to apologize? I am in need of humility and forfeit the blessing promised to the meek. Do I hesitate to apologize because there are too many people around who may hear? I not only need humility but am suffering from pride and thus breaking the second commandment by making myself a god. Forgiveness should fit the crime. Ideally, if I sin, I confess and ask forgiveness in front of everyone who saw or heard the deed immediately. As a Christian my goal is to love the Lord my God with all my heart, and with all my soul, and with all my mind and to love my neighbor as myself. To achieve this completely I must orient all my thoughts and actions towards this goal. The first hours of the day are often spent getting ready for the days labors. Do I thank God upon awakening that I have been blessed to draw breath another day, or do I believe I am self-sustaining? Do I set aside a time for prayer asking for guidance throughout the day, or do I rely on my own judgment? Do I look around me and thank God for all the comforts He has blessed me with, or do I lust after the one thing I don't have breaking the tenth commandment? Do I use the drive to work as a time for prayer and reflection or do I already feel the seeds of anger at the person slowing me down thus robbing myself of the blessing given to the pure in heart? Do I thank God that I have a job to go to, or do I grumble because the parking spot I normally use closer to the door has been taken? At work, the spiritual goal becomes even more distant, but is still there, psychology tells us that repetitive tasks take little conscious thought. Do I thank God upon arriving at work that I have gainful employment, or do I grumble about the boss's ingratitude? Do I ask His help to accomplish whatever task is set before me each time I begin my work? Do I use this to my advantage and remain in prayer or do I yield to the temptation to engage in gossip thus breaking the ninth commandment? Do I take a spare moment to read a spiritually nourishing poem or short article or do I engage in disparaging the work of a coworker depriving myself of the blessing of the peacemakers? Even more abstract, is the ultimate goal of work. Do I ask God to make me a good stewart of all that He has blessed me with, or do I squander a portion of my wages because I deserve a break thus breaking the first commandment and losing the blessing promised to the poor in spirit? At the end of the work day, do I thank God for the opportunity to work, or do I congratulate myself for making it through another day? Do I exhibit love and patience to my fellow man on my way home or do I break the second commandment of Christ? Upon arriving at home, do I choose to watch TV and give up the blessing promised to those who hunger and thirst after righteousness or do I choose to read and meditate on scripture? Do I read my latest magazine or do I read about the life of the saint of the day? It is easiest to recognize that spiritual goals “compete” for my leisure time, but there is chore time around the house, as I mow the yard do I choose to listen to secular music on the mp3 player or do I say the Jesus Prayer? As the hour for sleep approaches do I thank God for his blessings of the day and the enjoyment of good health? Do I ask for his safekeeping of myself and my possessions that he has given me? Do I let the cares of the world weigh down my mind as I lay upon my bed or do I pray unceasingly?[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Day by Day[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The period of a day gives us the first real opportunity for reflection. At the end of each day, how I answered each question above offer a telling view into whether or not I made any spiritual progress. The morning should be spent in thankfulness for a restful sleep and requesting God's mercy to come upon us to allow the work of the day at hand to be fruitful for the kingdom. The evening should be spent examining the day and asking forgiveness for shortcomings. This cyclical cleansing is very important for if I forget that each day is a fresh start, I am open to the sin of dispair and despondency because I deny God forgives me. The realm of the individual resides mostly in the second to second, minute to minute, and hour to hour in my view, as we move into the longer timespans, the influence of the corporate aspect of Salvation becomes more apparent. The Day marks the beginning of a formal structure that can be applied to our lives based on the witness of the Church. The daily cycle of worship.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Orthodox day runs from sunset to sunset so the first service of the day is vespers, a sunset service. During vespers we offer thanks for God's mercy during the day and ask for His blessing throughout the evening. The service contrasts the coming darkness with the arrival of the light of the world. We read Psalm 102 calling to mind that it is God's creation of which we are a part and it is God who sustains us. Using Psalms 140, 141, and 116 we cry out to God for His mercy and praise Him. We sing the hymn “O Gladsome Light” which is the oldest known hymn of the Church outside the bible and we ask for a peaceful and sinless evening.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Then the Complines service which is meant as an after dinner prayer before retiring to sleep. Here we thank God for rest from our labors and call to mind death through the metaphor of sleep, asking God to keep us by praying the Psalms 50, 69, 142 which have a penitential quality, especially 50.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Midnight Office, usually observed in monasteries only, at midnight can also be observed by the lay person upon awakening. Here we welcome the Bridegroom and glorify the Resurrection. We call to mind Christ who prayed at midnight. We are reminded of the unceasing prayer and praise of the angels. We read Psalm 50 and then on Monday through Friday read Psalm 118 in its entirety. Other Psalms are selected for Saturday.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Matins, or morning prayers, begin with six Psalms 3, 37, 62, 87, 102, and 142. We open the day praising God using Psalms 148, 149, and 150.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]First Hour, an opportunity to pray before any activity of the day.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Third Hour, prayer of thanks for Pentecost and reflection on Christ was condemned by Pilate.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Sixth Hour, we recall the handing over of Jesus to the Jews and his crucifixion and sacrifice for our sins.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Ninth Hour, the death of our Savior upon the cross.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]All of these services can be done as a reader service either by purchasing a book or downloading one of the texts available on the internet.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]There are even abbreviated services which are really just short selections of prayers specific to each hour.[/FONT]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&]
The Desire for Change[/FONT]
The Desire for Change[/FONT]
[FONT=&]So, as established above, all of my major sticking points had been settled and I began attending a small mission parish in Lafayette, Indiana in October of 1999. By November I was a catechumenate and was expected to be received into the Church at Pascha in 2000. My spiritual father though, with whom I met weekly outside of church, believed me to be in need of the sacraments of the Church during the period of Lent and received me by chrismation into the Church on March 5, 2000 a Sunday just prior to Lent. The Saturday Evening prior, in the chapel at the priests house, I made my first confession. I spent a week preparing for it. The sacramental forgiveness would not occur until Sunday morning but, this was my first step into Orthodoxy, I remember both the excitement and joy of finally coming home to the Church of Christ coupled with the reticence to let someone else in on all the sins I had carried with me since my youth. It seems priests can be a little different in their phraseology during confession, and so when I heard the words “are you sorry for your sins?” while bowing in front of the icon of Christ, I simply said yes. Wow was that easy. We returned to the couch and the priest gently admonished me that perhaps I should be ready to enumerate my sins a little for confession to which I replied I had 3 pages of things I had written down to confess but I had been waiting for an obvious cue. Well we returned to the Icon and I went through my list and after a bit of counselling, we burned the list in a trash can. Watching those sins burn away brought back the same emotional feelings of “being saved” in my youth, but I knew the path I was on now would choose different terminology for the changes that could should and would happen in my life. Sunday morning, I would be received by the Church through Holy Chrismation instead of Baptism and Chrismation because as the creed says, “we believe in one baptism..” and I had been previously baptized using a trinitarian formula in the church of my youth.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Sunday I after entering the church building, I was given the opportunity to renounce Satan and even to physically spit on him. I was anointed with the oil of chrismation on the head, heart, hands, feet and all 5 senses to seal me unto God in mind, heart, and soul. Already I was experiencing the joy of what I had found, the pearl of great price for here, characteristic of sacramental theology, I was engaged in all my senses. Orthodoxy does not teach simply a spiritual redemption of the individual, but the redemption of Creation as a whole. Physical things could be sanctified or blessed, and become avenues for communion with God. Over and over again in the hymns of the Church one hears phrases such as “All of creation rejoices....” or All of creation does magnify...” This was most joyously manifested in the receiving of communion. The spiritual direction of my life had changed, and I embarked on a new journey.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Like most people who convert from one tradition to another, I was no exception. I wanted all others to believe as I did. That sentiment has not changed but the overt approach I used in the beginning has been greatly toned down. Orthodoxy has had great missionaries. Saints Cyril and Methodius spring readily to mind, yet I have come to believe both through reading and my personal experience, that the best missionary work is done through each individual Orthodox Christian living a life conformed to the Church. Yet as I have alluded to, Orthodoxy stresses not the individual salvation but corporate. As Tertullian once said long ago, “One Christian is no Christian”; the Russian proverb, “The only thing a person can do alone is perish”. Christians are members of each other in the Body of Christ through baptism and the actions of the one affect all. Western Christianity might agree with that in rational thought but in praxis this belief is not manifested on any great scale if at all. I would say the greatest missionary work accomplished by Orthodoxy though was the conversion of the Russian Lands. This was mainly accomplished through a visit to Constantinople by emmissaries from Saint Vladimir who upon witnessing Orthodoxy in action so impressed St Vladimir that Orthodoxy became the religion in Russia. St Vladimir gets the credit for the recognition and conversion of the Russian Lands, but I would argue that the people his emissaries witnessed engaged in worshipping are worthy of sainthood for it was their actions that precipitated the conversion of Russia. They were living their faith. There is no such thing as an individual Orthodox Christian. One man can not the body of Christ be. One priest can not serve the Liturgy. There must be another person present. I offer the weight of scripture. Noah was saved, but not Noah alone, his family also. The ark was loaded at least by twos. Moses led the children of Israel out, but needed Aaron as his mouthpiece. God opposed kingship, but relented to the people and we know the troubles that caused them. Where two or three are gathered there is Christ in the midst, 12 gathered for the last supper, 120 gathered for pentecost. Pauls letters are addressed to Churches, the letters of Revelations are addressed to Churches. By the actions of one man came the fall, and by the actions of the God-man came eternal life.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Living a New Life[/FONT]
[FONT=&]I have neither the experience or spiritual knowledge to lead others. So I write the following simple thoughts more for others to read and correct me in my misthoughts. Each of us have a methodology to our lives whether we reflect on it much or not. This is my first attempt to formally put to paper my methodology and I am sure will be greatly revised, modified and in some aspects completely changed. Because I believe in cause and effect, my model is based on the consequences of living in linear time. With that brief introduction, I dive in.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Second by Second[/FONT]
[FONT=&]This is the smallest timeframe I consider. To be technically correct, I should title this “from the most infintesmally measurable unit of time to one second” but that would be much too scholastic of me. These brief moments in time are the realm of thoughts. There are various school of thoughts but I offer my own synthesis for consideration. Remembering my penchant for both the absolute and apophatic theology, I eliminate the possiblity of arguing the neutral if I were to say thoughts can be for good or evil by saying thoughts can be for good or not. The Christian should strive to fill the mind with good thoughts I believe this is one reason and actually the primary reason for the need of prayer without ceasing. The more we fill our thoughts with contemplation of the good, the less chance evil has to enter in. At one point in my life, I was practicing the Jesus Prayer, an Orthodox tradition that involves the repetition of a simple prayer. Two common variants are the following:[/FONT]
[FONT=&]“Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me, a sinner.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&]“Lord Jesus Christ, have mercy on me.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&]I said it upon arising and while I went through the automatic motions of the shower and dressing that required little consious thought. I recited it while walking to and from classes on campus, and I would say it as I prepared for sleep and when I fell asleep I tried to make it my last thought saying it audibly until sleep took over. I experienced awakening with the prayer audibly on my lips without conscious effort. Oh how I yearn for such experiences now. Filling idle moments with prayer drives away idle thoughts.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The question to really consider is are thoughts sins? Some say thoughts are not sins but rather temptations until we begin to dwell on them or even worse to act upon them. I will not presume to know any answers to the question, but offer my own thoughts on the matter. Many thoughts or temptations come to us because we have experienced the “pleasure” of them in the past. If I had lived as I ought I would not have knowledge of or recall the sensations of pleasure that acting upon such thoughts brings to myself. So even if thoughts are not sins in themselves, they are temporal punishments for the sins of our past because many times they recall past sins. My prayer, O Lord, Use these thoughts to create humility, for I have fallen before, use these thoughts for repentance because I have not filled my thoughts with good things, use these thoughts for thanksgiving for I have been forgiven, Amen. [/FONT]
[FONT=&]Minute by Minute[/FONT]
[FONT=&]We move from the realm of thought to action. It is here we must consider the butterfly effect of our actions on others. No action is truly isolated. All action we take must be for the good in the framework as established above with assumption that no thought can be both good and not good at the same time so with actions. The Christian should strive to fill his life with good actions. In the realm of minutes is where so many sins are committed for me. I don't spend hours, days, months or years planning to sin, I sin minute by minute. Most often these sins are expressed verbally. I tear down my fellow man, I share anothers failings with a third party. I fail to perceive the needs of my brother and meet them. I set my own needs above all others and meet them unfailingly. Actions are decisions made based on thoughts whether conscious or unconscious. As I began my Christian walk, most sins I committed were based on unconscious thought manifesting itself in actions because I was simply acting out the desires of the heart. Most good actions resulted from conscious thought as I began the struggle against the habitual actions of the past. Here is a real danger for as I begin to consciously change, the sin of pride can easily creep in as I admire the new changes in my life and want to take credit for them. I believe this is why the gift of prayer unceasing was taken from me because I became proud that it had happened to me and I have yet to experience it again. Here I encounter the first need for Confession. As a young Christian, I see and begin to identify, through the grace and mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ, the unconscious thoughts that lead me to sin and I begin to struggle to uproot them using the weapons of prayer, fasting, confession, the eucharist, reading of scripture and the lives of the saints. The filling of the mind with spiritual thoughts and the action of dwelling upon them.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]At the beginning of the walk, the mountain of unconcious thoughts that lead to sin would seem insurmountable, but I believe that the true magnitude our sinfulness is concealed from ourselves in some degree to keep us from despair. The joy though, is that God forgives and does not give us more work than we can handle at one time. As we mature as Christians, I believe our conscious thoughts and actions towards the good become unconscious as we become more habitual Christians than habitual sinners. Slowly, the sinfulness of our unconscious thoughts and actions are supplanted as our conscious thoughts and actions towards the good move into the realm of unconsciousness and become habitual. And slowly God imparts to us more knowledge of things in our lives that still need work. I believe this is why some saints consider themselves so sinful. At any moment in time, we struggle against the passions and we see some successes and failures, but we keep on pressing towards the good.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Hour by Hour[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Here we encounter goals. Our thoughts move into actions but the linking of multiple actions contribute to the realization of a goal. Here we have the beginning of reflection. The conscious often lets us know immediately of any wrongdoing and how I choose to react says a lot about my spiritual health. Do I know that I have wronged someone, but hesitate to apologize? I am in need of humility and forfeit the blessing promised to the meek. Do I hesitate to apologize because there are too many people around who may hear? I not only need humility but am suffering from pride and thus breaking the second commandment by making myself a god. Forgiveness should fit the crime. Ideally, if I sin, I confess and ask forgiveness in front of everyone who saw or heard the deed immediately. As a Christian my goal is to love the Lord my God with all my heart, and with all my soul, and with all my mind and to love my neighbor as myself. To achieve this completely I must orient all my thoughts and actions towards this goal. The first hours of the day are often spent getting ready for the days labors. Do I thank God upon awakening that I have been blessed to draw breath another day, or do I believe I am self-sustaining? Do I set aside a time for prayer asking for guidance throughout the day, or do I rely on my own judgment? Do I look around me and thank God for all the comforts He has blessed me with, or do I lust after the one thing I don't have breaking the tenth commandment? Do I use the drive to work as a time for prayer and reflection or do I already feel the seeds of anger at the person slowing me down thus robbing myself of the blessing given to the pure in heart? Do I thank God that I have a job to go to, or do I grumble because the parking spot I normally use closer to the door has been taken? At work, the spiritual goal becomes even more distant, but is still there, psychology tells us that repetitive tasks take little conscious thought. Do I thank God upon arriving at work that I have gainful employment, or do I grumble about the boss's ingratitude? Do I ask His help to accomplish whatever task is set before me each time I begin my work? Do I use this to my advantage and remain in prayer or do I yield to the temptation to engage in gossip thus breaking the ninth commandment? Do I take a spare moment to read a spiritually nourishing poem or short article or do I engage in disparaging the work of a coworker depriving myself of the blessing of the peacemakers? Even more abstract, is the ultimate goal of work. Do I ask God to make me a good stewart of all that He has blessed me with, or do I squander a portion of my wages because I deserve a break thus breaking the first commandment and losing the blessing promised to the poor in spirit? At the end of the work day, do I thank God for the opportunity to work, or do I congratulate myself for making it through another day? Do I exhibit love and patience to my fellow man on my way home or do I break the second commandment of Christ? Upon arriving at home, do I choose to watch TV and give up the blessing promised to those who hunger and thirst after righteousness or do I choose to read and meditate on scripture? Do I read my latest magazine or do I read about the life of the saint of the day? It is easiest to recognize that spiritual goals “compete” for my leisure time, but there is chore time around the house, as I mow the yard do I choose to listen to secular music on the mp3 player or do I say the Jesus Prayer? As the hour for sleep approaches do I thank God for his blessings of the day and the enjoyment of good health? Do I ask for his safekeeping of myself and my possessions that he has given me? Do I let the cares of the world weigh down my mind as I lay upon my bed or do I pray unceasingly?[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Day by Day[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The period of a day gives us the first real opportunity for reflection. At the end of each day, how I answered each question above offer a telling view into whether or not I made any spiritual progress. The morning should be spent in thankfulness for a restful sleep and requesting God's mercy to come upon us to allow the work of the day at hand to be fruitful for the kingdom. The evening should be spent examining the day and asking forgiveness for shortcomings. This cyclical cleansing is very important for if I forget that each day is a fresh start, I am open to the sin of dispair and despondency because I deny God forgives me. The realm of the individual resides mostly in the second to second, minute to minute, and hour to hour in my view, as we move into the longer timespans, the influence of the corporate aspect of Salvation becomes more apparent. The Day marks the beginning of a formal structure that can be applied to our lives based on the witness of the Church. The daily cycle of worship.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Orthodox day runs from sunset to sunset so the first service of the day is vespers, a sunset service. During vespers we offer thanks for God's mercy during the day and ask for His blessing throughout the evening. The service contrasts the coming darkness with the arrival of the light of the world. We read Psalm 102 calling to mind that it is God's creation of which we are a part and it is God who sustains us. Using Psalms 140, 141, and 116 we cry out to God for His mercy and praise Him. We sing the hymn “O Gladsome Light” which is the oldest known hymn of the Church outside the bible and we ask for a peaceful and sinless evening.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Then the Complines service which is meant as an after dinner prayer before retiring to sleep. Here we thank God for rest from our labors and call to mind death through the metaphor of sleep, asking God to keep us by praying the Psalms 50, 69, 142 which have a penitential quality, especially 50.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Midnight Office, usually observed in monasteries only, at midnight can also be observed by the lay person upon awakening. Here we welcome the Bridegroom and glorify the Resurrection. We call to mind Christ who prayed at midnight. We are reminded of the unceasing prayer and praise of the angels. We read Psalm 50 and then on Monday through Friday read Psalm 118 in its entirety. Other Psalms are selected for Saturday.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]Matins, or morning prayers, begin with six Psalms 3, 37, 62, 87, 102, and 142. We open the day praising God using Psalms 148, 149, and 150.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]First Hour, an opportunity to pray before any activity of the day.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Third Hour, prayer of thanks for Pentecost and reflection on Christ was condemned by Pilate.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Sixth Hour, we recall the handing over of Jesus to the Jews and his crucifixion and sacrifice for our sins.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]The Ninth Hour, the death of our Savior upon the cross.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]All of these services can be done as a reader service either by purchasing a book or downloading one of the texts available on the internet.[/FONT]
[FONT=&]There are even abbreviated services which are really just short selections of prayers specific to each hour.[/FONT]
Oh, I know. I just believe that a lot of Methodist have moved away from Wesleyanism; at least among the laity.If Methodist do, that would be a surprise.
Wesleyan tradition Churches, ie Methodist, Wesleyan, Nazarene, etc would reject Calvinism. They usually are sworn enemies
Look up Wesleyan-Armenianism vs Calvinism for typical views.
The ability to Backslide which, I believe, is the antithesis of the P in Tulip, is a hallmark of John Wesley and his followers.
Being raised in a Wesleyan tradition, it is the Protestant Tradition with which I am most familiar. It was actually learning of John Wesley's rediscovery of the Greek Fathers that played a key role in my becoming Orthodox.
Now that I have had time to read what I copied and pasted, I think I almost answered your questions, JettaKnight.
I may not have put the terms with the actions well enough but rather focused directly upon the process itself.
Want me to pair up the terms with the process a little more clearly?
I may not have put the terms with the actions well enough but rather focused directly upon the process itself.
Want me to pair up the terms with the process a little more clearly?
I did read it, and think highly of it. Remove the Orthodox formality and structure and you have the basis of a Protestant's sanctified lifestyle.
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