Two bodies found in Carroll County

[nakinate]

And I do not believe much that the Gov. feeds us.
The stats show a decrease but the crimes are far more violent even if there are less of them.

And yes, different times. Freaks are multiplying. JMHO.

Fair points on both counts.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Apparently the "parents" of those poor girls thought the same way. And here we are....

Yep. And the parents of the girl that was taken out of her yard just a few feet from her house. They got lucky though, the girl escaped after a few days by chewing her way through duct tape for several hours and figuring out how to get out of the house without being caught. Or the parents who's child was taken out of her bed. Or..

Agreed but these are seriously troubled times. When I was a kid we never ever worried about these predators. Now it seems all to common an occurrence.
We will not let the 10 year old walk to school. Not far really but I take her in the morning and her mother or dad picks her up.

I started letting my daughter walk to school by herself when she was 10. I watched her till she was out of sight, then between the houses next door till I saw her. School is literally around the corner. But actually it happens less now then when I was a kid and probably when you were. But when I was a kid it wasn't really talked about if it happened or at least not around kids, and next to never would it show up in the paper or radio/tv unless it was a case like this.

Girls are different from boys.

No one is blaming the parents, but had they made wiser decisions things might be different. We are all accountable for our actions, as troubling as it may be.

Yes, yes they are. Boys have a penis, girls have a vagina. And some predators like one or the other, and others aren't picky. But at that age physical ability there isn't that much difference. Girls on average beat boys in strength and speed till about 11-12, starting then it starts to reverse.

No one is blaming the parents? Sure seems quite a few on here (including myself) think someone is. Does this line sound familiar? "Apparently the "parents" of those poor girls thought the same way. And here we are..." I wonder what that person meant by the quotation marks around parents? Perhaps you could tell me?

If a dedicated predator wants to take a child, he can and there's almost nothing that a parent can do about it unless they are just going to never let them out of the house. The odds of your child being killed with the gun you keep at home are infinitely higher than the odds of this sort of thing happening.

Questioning the wisdom of these parents is in my opinion the exact sort of mentality which says that the risks of having guns are too great, and that has led to current generations who can't function without mommy or daddy as adults.

Yep I can think of couple that were taken out of their own bed, or out of their yard without trying. And in one it was someone they knew and had invited in for the night.

Crime statistics show that violent crimes have decreased versus past decades. I think our 24/7 news cycle and instant reporting on incidents from all over the world have skewed our perception.

Edit: I think part of the reason violent crime has lessened is because we have wished up as a society. Just 25 years ago I would walk to school by myself. I'd never let my kids do that now. Does this mean my parents were bad parents? Nope, simply a different era.

Can't forget the internet and especially social media. I can share an article about this and it will be seen in I'm not sure how many states or cities and at least a couple foreign countries.

Gotcha, I'm an anti-gunner because I wouldn't allow my 13 year old daughters to walk the streets or the trails unsupervised.

A dedicated predator goes where they can find prey. In this case it was two unsupervised 13 year old girls. They aren't there and the predator has no prey.

Nope. But I'd say you have a similar mindset which is what was posted I believe. Where I live they would generally be safe, we've probably had more lightning striking a person than anything near this. Not sure about where you live, but in my "city" there have been 4 murders in the 15 years I've lived here. One was a guy that shot his ex and her new boyfriend in the parking lot where they worked on lunch. The other a teen boy "snapped" and killed his mother and sister with a knife. From what I heard it was a very nasty scene. That one hit close to home, she was a friend of my niece. Now do you think my wife and I would be "parents" if we let our daughter go over to her friends house if they had a late teen boy living there and the mom was the only other adult? How about a parent elsewhere? Do you let your kid(s) go to friends houses if they have an older sibling?

And yep, if they weren't there they might have been the next place he looked, perhaps in the yard of one of their houses, or even in the bedroom.

If you really think that a parent can keep their 13-year-old daughter from ever being in a place where a predator could take them, I don't really know that there is a point in continuing here. Never mind that the vast majority of sexual predators are people the parents know and trust...

You mean like her own bed at night sleeping? Or maybe playing in the yard??

 

[FWP9MM]

I agree with those who have said this may be a repeat offender. News articles have stated that they were found 50 feet from the bank of Deer Creek. I have a feeling that the murder wanted them to be found or why wouldn't he have put them in the water to cover up evidence or make it look like a drowning? With that said, I do not know how deep or wide Deer Creek is so I may be off base. It was also mentioned that the trails were a hangout for teens. I would think that the murder is either a local who knows the area or someone who had been casing the area in advance. I am not sure if police were able to track the murders trail from the crime scene, however I would be checking local gas station and restaurants to see if their camera may have caught the murder earlier in the day. Maybe he got gas or a pack of smokes prior to or shortly after the murders or used the restroom to clean up? As the image isn't good and it appears he has a hat or hoodie on, maybe other video footage from the area on that day could give a potential break if the type of clothing was similar and the individual had the hat or hoodie removed.

 

[BoilerWes]

I agree with those who have said this may be a repeat offender. News articles have stated that they were found 50 feet from the bank of Deer Creek. I have a feeling that the murder wanted them to be found or why wouldn't he have put them in the water to cover up evidence or make it look like a drowning? With that said, I do not know how deep or wide Deer Creek is so I may be off base. It was also mentioned that the trails were a hangout for teens. I would think that the murder is either a local who knows the area or someone who had been casing the area in advance. I am not sure if police were able to track the murders trail from the crime scene, however I would be checking local gas station and restaurants to see if their camera may have caught the murder earlier in the day. Maybe he got gas or a pack of smokes prior to or shortly after the murders or used the restroom to clean up? As the image isn't good and it appears he has a hat or hoodie on, maybe other video footage from the area on that day could give a potential break if the type of clothing was similar and the individual had the hat or hoodie removed.

I have had the exact same thoughts. I read where the land owner described the area where they were found. The killing itself may have been opportunistic, but this guy knew exactly where he was going. I hope they have scavenged though all area surveillance. I also had the thought that he may have used the river or deer creek as his escape route, i.e. Left in a boat.

 

[HoughMade]

Girls are different from boys.

No one is blaming the parents, but had they made wiser decisions things might be different. We are all accountable for our actions, as troubling as it may be.

So we're having the inane argument where someone suggests that there may have been ways of lessening the risk and then someone accuses them of blaming the victim?

Great. Let's never learn anything from any tragedy.

Whats the likelihood of a non-cop blasting someone that turns out to not be the right guy? I bet more than the likelihood of the cops doing it just because.

Well, this isn't L.A., so...

 

[nakinate]

So we're having the inane argument where someone suggests that there may have been ways of lessening the risk and then someone accuses them of blaming the victim?

Great. Let's never learn anything from any tragedy.

I initially said something in response to bwframe referencing the parents of the victims and putting the word parents in quotes. The implication was that they weren't really parents because this incident occurred on their watch. I don't disagree that there is much to be learned from this tragedy, but taking cheap shots at the parents when none of us have that much information really isn't helpful or appropriate.

 

[Birds Away]

I initially said something in response to bwframe referencing the parents of the victims and putting the word parents in quotes. The implication was that they weren't really parents because this incident occurred on their watch. I don't disagree that there is much to be learned from this tragedy, but taking cheap shots at the parents when none of us have that much information really isn't helpful or appropriate.

+1

 

[HoughMade]

I initially said something in response to bwframe referencing the parents of the victims and putting the word parents in quotes. The implication was that they weren't really parents because this incident occurred on their watch. I don't disagree that there is much to be learned from this tragedy, but taking cheap shots at the parents when none of us have that much information really isn't helpful or appropriate.

I would agree with that. look, I have a 13 year old (as well as a 17 year old, 19 year old and 11 year old). I'm not so sure I would drop the kids under about 17 off to walk a public trail by themselves, in fact I know I wouldn't. In fact, I would not be enthused about a pair of 17 year old girls going out. Larger groups, no problem. I don't say this to cause any grief and I certainly understand that different people raise their children differently, as is their right. Certainly, cheap shots are not appropriate and it's way too early to draw too many conclusions. Right now the parents need to be supported and cared for.

 

[bwframe]

Those parents will grieve for the rest of their lives over the what if's. We cannot change or fix that. There are plenty of people to comfort them.

In the meantime, we can learn from what they could have done differerently. Avoiding parental accountability "for the grieving parents" does not educate other naive parents or save their poor kids from being vulnerable to monsters.

Predators have always existed and always will. Acting like they do not or are so rare that they aren't a threat is foolish (in this case fatal.)

 

[Birds Away]

I was once in a situation, which I won't go into now, that led to the death of my best friend. It's a period of my life that I will never forget. It has little to do with the situation being discussed but I remember distinctly the Monday morning quarterbacking, 20/20 hindsight, righteous indignation, however you want to characterize it. Of course, none of these people were there and, like in this case, they were more than happy to reach these conclusions on snippets of information, rumors and innuendo. It was not constructive for the widow nor for me or my family. For the families of these two young girls, well, all I feel for these poor, poor people is sympathy. I don't know enough to pass any kind of judgment and probably wouldn't if I did. All I can offer to them is prayers for their healing and the hope that one day the pain will recede at least to some degree. Everyone will decide for themselves the lessons to be gleaned from this terrible tragedy. For anyone to say that they simply must publicly condemn these people so that others might learn from their mistakes is self aggrandizing at best. We don't know who is reading this and we don't know what messages are being passed along. I would hate for anything here to add one tiny bit to these people's burden. But, that's just my opinion.

 

[Expat]

I was once in a situation, which I won't go into now, that led to the death of my best friend. It's a period of my life that I will never forget. It has little to do with the situation being discussed but I remember distinctly the Monday morning quarterbacking, 20/20 hindsight, righteous indignation, however you want to characterize it. Of course, none of these people were there and, like in this case, they were more than happy to reach these conclusions on snippets of information, rumors and innuendo. It was not constructive for the widow nor for me or my family. For the families of these two young girls, well, all I feel for these poor, poor people is sympathy. I don't know enough to pass any kind of judgment and probably wouldn't if I did. All I can offer to them is prayers for their healing and the hope that one day the pain will recede at least to some degree. Everyone will decide for themselves the lessons to be gleaned from this terrible tragedy. For anyone to say that they simply must publicly condemn these people so that others might learn from their mistakes is self aggrandizing at best. We don't know who is reading this and we don't know what messages are being passed along. I would hate for anything here to add one tiny bit to these people's burden. But, that's just my opinion.

QFT

 

[indiucky]

I have not posted in this thread yet...I wanted to but I couldn't....I have a beautiful 13 year old daughter on the Autism Spectrum....I hope this doesn't sound wrong but with Autism there is no physical sign my daughter may be different and see the world differently....The worry of something like this happening to my daughter is something we deal with every day....It could happen to any child but that little hurdle the Lord blessed her with makes it seem (to me) that she has a special vulnerability that could be exploited..

On Mondays I wait for the bus to drop her off (and it is like clockwork)....One Monday the bus drove on by....My heart jumped into my throat and I began chasing the bus to no avail....I called the school and no answer...Called the bus garage and got a machine....I am freaking out....I was still standing out front when the bus came back by, the door opened and my little angel stepped off....The bus driver apologized and said he didn't realize she was still on the bus....

The worse 10 minutes of my life...

Prayers to the families involved, strength to the officers investigating, wisdom to the prosecutors of the case, and swift justice to the ******** who would harm a child...

This is just sickening.....

 

[Timjoebillybob]

From an interview with the Delphi CoP today it sounds like they do/may have DNA and it's being processed as fast as possible. He never actually said it though.
Carroll County sheriff discusses Delphi murder investigation, says DNA evidence ?fast-tracked? | Fox 59

So we're having the inane argument where someone suggests that there may have been ways of lessening the risk and then someone accuses them of blaming the victim?

Well, this isn't L.A., so...

Hough this is what started it. And yes dangers exist everywhere.

I will contend otherwise. The fact that we have to discuss this shows that parenting isn't "a given."

No parenting is not a given, but there are places I'd let my kids go at that age that would be considered remote and secluded by some. That area isn't really considered "remote and secluded" or at least not very by quite a few people in that area. From what I understand it's a relatively popular hangout spot for teens and a popular spot for senior year/wedding/etc. pictures. It's not like it sounds on the news, out in the middle of HNF. There is a road off to the side of where they were found and one of the girls lived a mile or so down it off to the side. Think of a rural, rustic, nice, park version of the Monon trail. Here is a link to the google map of the trail they were on.

Apparently the "parents" of those poor girls thought the same way. And here we are...

I would agree with that. look, I have a 13 year old (as well as a 17 year old, 19 year old and 11 year old). I'm not so sure I would drop the kids under about 17 off to walk a public trail by themselves, in fact I know I wouldn't. In fact, I would not be enthused about a pair of 17 year old girls going out. Larger groups, no problem. I don't say this to cause any grief and I certainly understand that different people raise their children differently, as is their right. Certainly, cheap shots are not appropriate and it's way too early to draw too many conclusions. Right now the parents need to be supported and cared for.

I have a 11 yr and a 22 yr old, I'll let her go across the street with a friend to play on the playground there by herself but or walk the dog around the block, not too much more than that. Where I live it's not uncommon to see kids that age walking around with their friends. I've seen 13 yr olds with friends or younger sibling at the park with no parental supervision who had walked almost as far as these girls had to go on their "hike" without parents. And spend a good several hours up to most of the day. True the park isn't the same as where these girl were but there is a secluded area or two where something like this could have happened or at least been taken from for this to happen. I don't live in Delphi but close, where they were found is less than 20 mi by road from my driveway, closer to 15. The town is a bit under 3000 people and the trail for the most part runs through agricultural land. One thing that confuses me, which is why the girls would have had to been dropped off to go on their hike. I've heard but can't confirm that the one girls backyard borders the trail. I can see being picked up at the end of it, but not the beginning. If I lived down there and my daughter was 13-14 and her and a friend wanted to walk down it, I might have let them. And I'm a bit paranoid since I have close experience with scumbags who like little kids.

I was once in a situation, which I won't go into now, that led to the death of my best friend. It's a period of my life that I will never forget. It has little to do with the situation being discussed but I remember distinctly the Monday morning quarterbacking, 20/20 hindsight, righteous indignation, however you want to characterize it. Of course, none of these people were there and, like in this case, they were more than happy to reach these conclusions on snippets of information, rumors and innuendo. It was not constructive for the widow nor for me or my family. For the families of these two young girls, well, all I feel for these poor, poor people is sympathy. I don't know enough to pass any kind of judgment and probably wouldn't if I did. All I can offer to them is prayers for their healing and the hope that one day the pain will recede at least to some degree. Everyone will decide for themselves the lessons to be gleaned from this terrible tragedy. For anyone to say that they simply must publicly condemn these people so that others might learn from their mistakes is self aggrandizing at best. We don't know who is reading this and we don't know what messages are being passed along. I would hate for anything here to add one tiny bit to these people's burden. But, that's just my opinion.

First my sincere condolences. Second +1 QFT etc. I could have and almost made a couple sarcastic remarks, but luckily I took the time to rethink. I would have regretted it sincerely. They wouldn't have been aimed at you, but still might have had an effect on you which I wouldn't want to do.

 

[CindyE]

I was once in a situation, which I won't go into now, that led to the death of my best friend. It's a period of my life that I will never forget. It has little to do with the situation being discussed but I remember distinctly the Monday morning quarterbacking, 20/20 hindsight, righteous indignation, however you want to characterize it. Of course, none of these people were there and, like in this case, they were more than happy to reach these conclusions on snippets of information, rumors and innuendo. It was not constructive for the widow nor for me or my family. For the families of these two young girls, well, all I feel for these poor, poor people is sympathy. I don't know enough to pass any kind of judgment and probably wouldn't if I did. All I can offer to them is prayers for their healing and the hope that one day the pain will recede at least to some degree. Everyone will decide for themselves the lessons to be gleaned from this terrible tragedy. For anyone to say that they simply must publicly condemn these people so that others might learn from their mistakes is self aggrandizing at best. We don't know who is reading this and we don't know what messages are being passed along. I would hate for anything here to add one tiny bit to these people's burden. But, that's just my opinion.

I can't rep you, but you stated this very well.

 

[Fargo]

So we're having the inane argument where someone suggests that there may have been ways of lessening the risk and then someone accuses them of blaming the victim?

Great. Let's never learn anything from any tragedy.


.

C,mon Hough, I know you are a civil guy but I also know you have been around more than long enough to know much better.

All this pontification about being "wiser" and being able to absolutely protect your children is pie in the sky BS which ignores the reality of how children get preyed on.

For example, off the top of my head I can think of multiple local children preyed upon by their biological parent. From dad who needs BJ's from his adolescent daughter, to mom who films the dog with her small children, to mom who rents her daughter out, to dad who engages in a long term sexual relationship with his H.S. aged daughter because they are in love... It happens way more than people realize or want to realize. Hell, every local child murder In my memory was by a biological parent

Add in cousins and uncles, and I'm not even going to start the list.

Add in stepparents and new significant others and we have covered the probably a majority of the cases.

The remainder are mostly all teachers/pastors/family friends/etc.

Then lets address the cases where kids were taken in public. Ooops, we've got none. Not even any kids alone. Not even any real young kids alone.

The reason this case is a huge deal is because it is a REALLY nasty outlier among outliers. How many cases do you think the FBI BAU works a year?

Percentagewise, kids are vastly more likely to be preyed on by a biological parent than taken off a path. Nevermind, relatives/friends/school/church etc.

However, there will always be folks like Bwframe who really really don't want to believe it could ever happen to their children, so they sit here taking potshots at other parents who have lost kids because they can't stomach the idea that that could ever be them.

Its really strange though; I have had to meet with or been present for victim statements of a good number of good parents whose kids got preyed upon. People who did the right things and supervised their children and didn't let them go hiking.

They all say the same damn thing:

"I never imagined that anything like this could ever happen to us; we watched our kids, we took care of them, we never let them go with anyone we didn't trust. We were good parents."

Acting like there is some big lesson here than you will prevent your kids from being victims by not letting them walk without a parent is nothing more than encouraging people to ignore the very REAL threats that are out there and INFINITELY more likely.

Bwframe's claim that he made sure his kids could never be taken advantage of demonstrates the exact attitude which leads people to be terrified they might get hit by lighting while they are happily swimming in a school of pirhanas. I don't say that because I doubt that he was a good parent and did his best, but in reality that level of control does not exist and the idea that anyone has it is fantastical thinking. I guarantee you the bulk of the folks I quoted above felt the same way.

No one is saying not to mitigate risk or try to learn from tragedies but this knee-jerk "wiser parent" stuff is factually complete bull****.

 

[Trigger Time]

C,mon Hough, I know you are a civil guy but I also know you have been around more than long enough to know much better.

All this pontification about being "wiser" and being able to absolutely protect your children is pie in the sky BS which ignores the reality of how children get preyed on.

For example, off the top of my head I can think of multiple local children preyed upon by their biological parent. From dad who needs BJ's from his adolescent daughter, to mom who films the dog with her small children, to mom who rents her daughter out, to dad who engages in a long term sexual relationship with his H.S. aged daughter because they are in love... It happens way more than people realize or want to realize. Hell, every local child murder In my memory was by a biological parent

Add in cousins and uncles, and I'm not even going to start the list.

Add in stepparents and new significant others and we have covered the probably a majority of the cases.

The remainder are mostly all teachers/pastors/family friends/etc.

Then lets address the cases where kids were taken in public. Ooops, we've got none. Not even any kids alone. Not even any real young kids alone.

The reason this case is a huge deal is because it is a REALLY nasty outlier among outliers. How many cases do you think the FBI BAU works a year?

Percentagewise, kids are vastly more likely to be preyed on by a biological parent than taken off a path. Nevermind, relatives/friends/school/church etc.

However, there will always be folks like Bwframe who really really don't want to believe it could ever happen to their children, so they sit here taking potshots at other parents who have lost kids because they can't stomach the idea that that could ever be them.

Its really strange though; I have had to meet with or been present for victim statements of a good number of good parents whose kids got preyed upon. People who did the right things and supervised their children and didn't let them go hiking.

They all say the same damn thing:

"I never imagined that anything like this could ever happen to us; we watched our kids, we took care of them, we never let them go with anyone we didn't trust. We were good parents."

Acting like there is some big lesson here than you will prevent your kids from being victims by not letting them walk without a parent is nothing more than encouraging people to ignore the very REAL threats that are out there and INFINITELY more likely.

Bwframe's claim that he made sure his kids could never be taken advantage of demonstrates the exact attitude which leads people to be terrified they might get hit by lighting while they are happily swimming in a school of pirhanas. I don't say that because I doubt that he was a good parent and did his best, but in reality that level of control does not exist and the idea that anyone has it is fantastical thinking. I guarantee you the bulk of the folks I quoted above felt the same way.

No one is saying not to mitigate risk or try to learn from tragedies but this knee-jerk "wiser parent" stuff is factually complete bull****.

with your experiences in these matters what would you recommend to parents in regards to vetting or verifying that close family or friends aren't predators? We have taught my daughter to always come tell us if someone even suggests something inappropriate and we use actual words for genatelia and such as to not have any misunderstandings about things if it happens. We learned this from a police officer that travels to the schools and does presentations.
So basicly what I'm asking is, was there anything that could have been done by these parents to prevent their children from being victimized by people they knew? I'm not trying to blame the parents I'm just trying to learn from their bad experiences so that it doesn't happen to my kid. If I found out before the police i think the only thing that would keep me from breaking the law and killing someone would be knowing my daughter would need me and her mother together to help her through the process of it all. I would have to give up vengeance in order to put my daughter first.
These things make me sick even thinking about them. But we have to in order to protect our kids from these cowardly losers

 

[GLOCKMAN23C]

Those parents will grieve for the rest of their lives over the what if's. We cannot change or fix that. There are plenty of people to comfort them.

In the meantime, we can learn from what they could have done differerently. Avoiding parental accountability "for the grieving parents" does not educate other naive parents or save their poor kids from being vulnerable to monsters.

Predators have always existed and always will. Acting like they do not or are so rare that they aren't a threat is foolish (in this case fatal.)

We always could have done things differently, hind sight is 20/20. My daughter is a little younger than these two. Letting them venture is part of letting them grow. Would I have dropped them off and left, probably not, let them venture off by themselves, with me nearby, probably.

I cannot blame the parents, with the information I have. I can and will pray that their burden is eased, and that the sick **** that did this is caught.

 

[CHCRandy]

What I really want to know is who owns that bridge they keep showing? I can see a big lawsuit there someday! That thing looks scary, 60 feet in the air, broken ties, no rails.........I am amazed CSX(if they still own) would allow people to come on that bridge and even more amazed that Delphi uses it as a trail! They made our park pour new sidewalks because of a trip hazard, can't imagine anyone insuring the owner of this property.

This guy is a dead man walking.....if he has any sense he will kill himself before someone else does.

 

[Fargo]

with your experiences in these matters what would you recommend to parents in regards to vetting or verifying that close family or friends aren't predators? We have taught my daughter to always come tell us if someone even suggests something inappropriate and we use actual words for genatelia and such as to not have any misunderstandings about things if it happens. We learned this from a police officer that travels to the schools and does presentations.
So basicly what I'm asking is, was there anything that could have been done by these parents to prevent their children from being victimized by people they knew? I'm not trying to blame the parents I'm just trying to learn from their bad experiences so that it doesn't happen to my kid. If I found out before the police i think the only thing that would keep me from breaking the law and killing someone would be knowing my daughter would need me and her mother together to help her through the process of it all. I would have to give up vengeance in order to put my daughter first.
These things make me sick even thinking about them. But we have to in order to protect our kids from these cowardly losers

IMO, a crucial first step that is often overlooked is that Mom and Dad have to sit down and come to an understanding that they are going to have to be rude/offend some people, and that many/most of those people will be fine folks. For example, we have a general rule that our kids don't do sleepovers; the default answer is no and there doesn't have to be any stated reason. We also don't generally let our kids play at other kids houses unless we have accompanied them there enough times that we are in agreement that all is well. This is undoubtably offensive in some regard, especially to really good people who would never dream of doing wrong.

However, our kids are our responsibility and we have decided that these precautions are much more important than someone getting butthurt. IME, practiced predators are incredibly good at preying upon people's unwillingness to offend. They present themselves as "aw shucks good folk" who you just hate to make feel bad, especially if they have a position of respect or authority at school/church/scouts/etc.

My rule of thumb, is that if someone gets offended it is a small red flag, but often just human nature. However, if they stay offended/won't let it go/push it it is a huge red flag to me. Anytime someone thinks that their feelings should actually influence how I raise my kids, they really won't get the time of day from me.

Another thing is to trust your intuition. By the time they have acted, immense damage has usually been done. If something doesn't feel right; my rule is to decline regardless of if I have any sort of hard proof. In fact, I often want my decline to be a bit offensive. If respect for my boundary is given, I will continue to evaluate. If there is blowback, see above.

Also, watch for signs among your community of friends and relations. Tons of incidents, hell probably most, are never or late reported for a variety of reasons. However, it is often pretty easy to pick up on when something is amiss between families. Disputes among adults are usually semi-public and make sense. Issues with children are generally not. Be careful when things seem off for no apparent reason.

Be careful when dealing with positions of authority. The vast majority are earned and good people, but these positions also attract scum posing as saints. Anytime a position of authority or honor is invoked as a reason to deviate from your rules, it is a red flag to me. I was exposed to 2 pedophiles in positions of authority as a child but by the grace of God was never a victim.

Beyond separating your children from predators, there are IMO a number of things you can do additionally that are equally as important. For example, despite being a homeschooled, no sleepovers, very cautiously parented kid with ample discipline; I nonetheless was alone with 2 now-proven pedophiles in positions of authority. IMO, the only reason nothing was tried with me was because they knew my father (USMC) would without hesitation kill them and that he would assuredly find out.

To that end, I sit down individually and alone with each of my kids frequently (I shoot for at least monthly) and ask them if there is anything wrong/bothering them/that they want to talk about. I make it clear that they can tell me anything and that they do not need to fear getting in trouble. I also impress upon them that there is no one that Dad is scared of or that can hurt Dad. (The most common threat predators use to keep kids quiet is that they will hurt Dad). They know I carry a gun because sometimes bad guys need shooting and they see me in the ring regularly. It is of the utmost importance to me that they be able to tell me anything without ever fearing for me.

I also try to make it clear in how I parent and I how I care for my kids that other people's wishes and feelings are meaningless in my decisions on their wellbeing. I want everyone I meet to understand that I would unhesitantly kill or die for my kids; much less hurt someones feelings.

I also try to foster independence in my kids. I want them to be self-reliant to where if they are faced with something evil they fight it and get help from me/mom/a trusted person. Never letting your kids walk the block IMO does nothing to prepare them for life and the evil the will undoubtably face.

That is a quick and dirty of how I do things in addition to all the usual good advice that Dep. Baird or whoever presents to your kids gives. At the end of the day, evil people are out there and will do evil but I try to make it as hard for them as possible. It is a terrible thing to say, but the weak in any herd get preyed upon the most. (foster kids, step-kids, kids of absentee parents, kids of drug addicts, fatherless kids etc) I do everything I can to help the weak, but I also make damn sure my kids aren't out looking like easy pickings. I want everyone to know that the price is going to be as painful and wretched as I can humanly make it.

 

[wagyu52]

What I really want to know is who owns that bridge they keep showing? I can see a big lawsuit there someday! That thing looks scary, 60 feet in the air, broken ties, no rails.........I am amazed CSX(if they still own) would allow people to come on that bridge and even more amazed that Delphi uses it as a trail! They made our park pour new sidewalks because of a trip hazard, can't imagine anyone insuring the owner of this property.

This guy is a dead man walking.....if he has any sense he will kill himself before someone else does.

That was the first thing I thought when I saw it too. I can tell you if I was the father/grandfather of one of these girls, that bridge would be on the ground shortly after the suspect(s) are dealt with. No doubt the murder(s) used that bridge as a trap.