Tucson, We Have a Problem

[88GT]

I'm not passing the buck. Your talking about getting rid of search warrants for certain crimes...I think? They had one and found what they were looking for. So then your asking for what? Your going to say he is dead for weapons, body armor, parts of a police uniform ect. I think he is dead because he pointed a gun at the officers.

In plainer English, I was asking how a search warrant is grounds for the killing of a man by LE.

How do you know he was in a defensive position?

You told us so.

 

[Keyser Soze]

That's still unverified. All we have is the word of that particular police department, and as this incident has shown, there word is not worth much at all.

Someone else said something similar a few pages back. If we cant take the article for fact then there is nothing left to talk about.

 

[Keyser Soze]

In plainer English, I was asking how a search warrant is grounds for the killing of a man by LE.


You told us so.

When your executing a search warrant and someone points a gun at you that's grounds for killing them. When your going to the bathroom and someone points a gun at you thats grounds for killing them to. If I am mowing my yard and someone points a gun at me. Thats grounds for killing them. Do not point a gun at anything you do not intend to destroy.

 

[88GT]

Someone else said something similar a few pages back. If we cant take the article for fact then there is nothing left to talk about.

So what of the "fact" that the neighbors claim LE rolled up silently and never announced entry?

What of the "fact" that the wife claimed "men with guns" not "LEO" were approaching her home?

What of the "fact" that the wife denies her husband said "I've got something for you" to LE? (And what if he did? Makes sense if he thought they were common thugs intent on depriving him of his rightful claims.)

What of the "fact" that we still have no warrant to show that they hit the correct home?

What about those facts?

 

[88GT]

When your executing a search warrant and someone points a gun at you that's grounds for killing them. When your going to the bathroom and someone points a gun at you thats grounds for killing them to. If I am mowing my yard and someone points a gun at me. Thats grounds for killing them. Do not point a gun at anything you do not intend to destroy.

So Guerena would have been justified in killing the LEOs? THey were pointing guns at him.

 

[lashicoN]

They did so because he was pointing a gun at them. We can go back and forth another 50 pages. The shooting was legally justified. They were there lawfully, and the use of force was justified. A reasonable person would believe there life was in danger if someone pointed a gun at them.

So the homeowner reasonably believed his life was in danger, because they were pointing their guns at him, which justifies his action of arming himself. You just said it, ANY reasonable person would fear for their life.

Now, if only our country could give you guys some more money so you can afford to buy Department Police cars, that way, you don't have to gun a man down in his home, even if you have a warrant for his arrest. You would simply be able to zoom around town, in your gasoline fueled automobile machine, and catch the bad guys that way. Sure, it isn't as fun as blasting 70 rounds into a house, but pulling people over who have outstanding warrants to make an arrest isn't so bad. And we'd all be a whole heck of a lot more appreciative, instead of making us all worry you'll get the wrong house, kill us, refuse to show the warrant, and make us look like the bad guy.

 

[PatriotPride]

So Guerena would have been justified in killing the LEOs? THey were pointing guns at him.

DING DING DING! We have a winner! Following his logic, Guerena should have killed every LEO since they pointed a firearm at him.

 

[Keyser Soze]

So what of the "fact" that the neighbors claim LE rolled up silently and never announced entry?

What of the "fact" that the wife claimed "men with guns" not "LEO" were approaching her home?

What of the "fact" that the wife denies her husband said "I've got something for you" to LE? (And what if he did? Makes sense if he thought they were common thugs intent on depriving him of his rightful claims.)

What of the "fact" that we still have no warrant to show that they hit the correct home?

What about those facts?

Well the PD claimed some different "facts". Obviously someone is wrong. Only time will tell. Unless there are some new developments I side with law enforcement.

 

[MinuteMan47]

Unless there are some new developments I side with law enforcement.

Are you law enforcement?

 

[88GT]

Well the PD claimed some different "facts". Obviously someone is wrong. Only time will tell. Unless there are some new developments I side with law enforcement.

No, ****, Sherlock. That's my point.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Are you law enforcement?

I'm not siding with LE just for that reason. From reading the article, as it reads, I side with LE.

 

[lashicoN]

When your executing a search warrant and someone points a gun at you that's grounds for killing them. When your going to the bathroom and someone points a gun at you thats grounds for killing them to. If I am mowing my yard and someone points a gun at me. Thats grounds for killing them. Do not point a gun at anything you do not intend to destroy.

How about a dark wallet or a cell phone? Would you kill someone who pointed those things at you, lunatic?

I've read stories from NYC about cops shooting little kids who were holding combs, candy bars, and all sorts of other dark objects that they "thought" were guns being pointed at them. You have to have a pretty guilty conscience to think everyone is trying to gun you down in the street. Maybe we should have term limits and elect our local officers. State troopers could be appointed by the Governor. If you're opening fire at the first sign of something being pointed at you, maybe it's time to quit the stressful job?

 

[Keyser Soze]

So Guerena would have been justified in killing the LEOs? THey were pointing guns at him.

Short answer no.

 

[Keyser Soze]

How about a dark wallet or a cell phone? Would you kill someone who pointed those things at you, lunatic?

I've read stories from NYC about cops shooting little kids who were holding combs, candy bars, and all sorts of other dark objects that they "thought" were guns being pointed at them. You have to have a pretty guilty conscience to think everyone is trying to gun you down in the street. Maybe we should have term limits and elect our local officers. State troopers could be appointed by the Governor. If you're opening fire at the first sign of something being pointed at you, maybe it's time to quit the stressful job?

LOL I see what your trying to do there. Politics at the local level are nothing more than popularity contest. It would be chaos. I never said I opened fire the first time something was pointed at me. I said gun..you read gun..im not going there.

 

[MinuteMan47]

I'm not siding with LE just for that reason. From reading the article, as it reads, I side with LE.

How long have you been on the force?

 

[Keyser Soze]

How long have you been on the force?

Not to long 4.5 years.

 

[Benny]

Are you law enforcement?

LOL, **** no.

 

[88GT]

When your executing a search warrant and someone points a gun at you that's grounds for killing them. When your going to the bathroom and someone points a gun at you thats grounds for killing them to. If I am mowing my yard and someone points a gun at me. Thats grounds for killing them. Do not point a gun at anything you do not intend to destroy.

Short answer no.

I can't wait for you to explain this contradiction.

 

[Keyser Soze]

I can't wait for you to explain this contradiction.

Grab a snickers.

 

[lashicoN]

Not to long 4.5 years.

DEA or ATF?