The (Current year) General Political/Salma Hayek discussion Thread Part V

[nonobaddog]

Trump was a dumocrap in 2001 and turned Republican in 2009. So obviously he has learned a lot about the political world since that book and especially since 2016. I don't think anything from 2000 is remotely applicable anymore.

 

[Jludo]

So Trump changed his ideology when? At the ripe old age of 60? He got a copy of 'the road to serfdom' for his 58th birthday and the rest is history. Or is it more likely he saw an opening as a Republican and his politics have followed what he needs to say to get elected.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Trump was a dumocrap in 2001 and turned Republican in 2009. So obviously he has learned a lot about the political world since that book and especially since 2016. I don't think anything from 2000 is remotely applicable anymore.

And he was a Repub in 1987, then an Ind, then Reform party, then back to Dem in 2001, then Rep in 2009, then Ind, then back again to Rep. (I may have missed a swap or two.

Oh and that book was published in 2000, when he wasn't a Dem, so...

 

[T.Lex]

Wives and principles: 2 things that Trump can't commit to.

 

[Kutnupe14]

So Trump changed his ideology when? At the ripe old age of 60? He got a copy of 'the road to serfdom' for his 58th birthday and the rest is history. Or is it more likely he saw an opening as a Republican and his politics have followed what he needs to say to get elected.

This!

 

[Ingomike]

So Trump changed his ideology when? At the ripe old age of 60? He got a copy of 'the road to serfdom' for his 58th birthday and the rest is history. Or is it more likely he saw an opening as a Republican and his politics have followed what he needs to say to get elected.

And he was a Repub in 1987, then an Ind, then Reform party, then back to Dem in 2001, then Rep in 2009, then Ind, then back again to Rep. (I may have missed a swap or two.

Oh and that book was published in 2000, when he wasn't a Dem, so...

Time and time again throughout history men have stepped forward and done great things beyond their past. For the religious among us, God has used many sinners, and at times even evil men to do his work.

Trump is is a man for the times because he is willing to take on open borders, one world government, and open trade with communist governments. His predecessors set the bar so low he looks great.

If you believe in open borders, one world government, and open trade with communist governments Trump is obviously not your man...

 

[Ingomike]

So Trump changed his ideology when? At the ripe old age of 60? He got a copy of 'the road to serfdom' for his 58th birthday and the rest is history. Or is it more likely he saw an opening as a Republican and his politics have followed what he needs to say to get elected.

Wives and principles: 2 things that Trump can't commit to.

Really? This presupposes the parties themselves have not changed or even we ourselves have not changed, nor the situation on the ground has changed. We have, they have and so has he.

He is rising to the desperate need to keep this country on the same constitutional path it was started on.

 

[T.Lex]

For that matter, if you believe in truth, morality, and coherent thought, Trump is obviously not your man, either.

 

[Ingomike]

So Trump changed his ideology when? At the ripe old age of 60? He got a copy of 'the road to serfdom' for his 58th birthday and the rest is history. Or is it more likely he saw an opening as a Republican and his politics have followed what he needs to say to get elected.

For that matter, if you believe in truth, morality, and coherent thought, Trump is obviously not your man, either.

I will say it again:

Time and time again throughout history men have stepped forward and done great things beyond their past. For the religious among us, God has used many sinners, and at times even evil men to do his work.

At this point in history in American politics I couldn't care less about words, they are worth less than feces. What I do care about is deeds, what have you done. I took a chance on DJT because of what HRC had done. I am pleased with most of what has been done...

 

[BugI02]

The trouble is many of them owe $100K and still need an education.

If they majored in blah-blah-studies they do not have much for useful knowledge or skills. This makes free **** look pretty good to them. Their 'best-thinking' got them into that predicament and now they are going to use that same 'best-thinking' to decide who to vote for.

A Liberal Arts education from a rigorous school used to be valued as evidence that the job applicant was bright, trainable and a demonstrated generalist. With the addition of junk degrees such as you mentioned, it now is more indicative of how well an applicant can memorize and regurgitate their indoctrination not that they might be able to actually think. Unfortunately for the woke, truly rewarding careers require more specialized skills and technical chops than ever

 

[BugI02]

That's confusing, you either have to be a Trumpster or a socialist? I'm happy being neither.

Are you a millennial, then? Because *****ing about the present with no plan for the future or how to make things better is pretty much a hallmark of the tribe

 

[BugI02]

What would we say if Trump came out with universal healthcare, Trumpcare? Would twist a lot of people into a pretzel. The political lines have already been drawn so I doubt it happens but there's no ideological reason he'd be opposed to it, If he thought it would make him more popular I could see him getting behind it.

This is the part that always amazes me; the attempts to paint the man as small minded, motivated by small reasons while ignoring what he has given up in order to do the job he feels he was elected to do - and then make a big deal out of his desire to respond in kind when attacked personally or over his ideals (a flaw his critics so obviously share)

We're not better than that, and neither are you - you just suffer from the same blind spot you wish to attribute to Trump

 

[Jludo]

I will say it again:

Time and time again throughout history men have stepped forward and done great things beyond their past. For the religious among us, God has used many sinners, and at times even evil men to do his work.

Time and time again throughout history, egotistical, self serving men have said and done whatever it takes to get their name up in lights.

If the argument is that Trump is all those things but hes saying and doing what I want to get reelected, that's fine. Just dont pretend Trump is doing it out of some sense of duty to anyone but himself.

Put this way Trump wouldn't sacrifice any bit of himself or his wealth for the greater good of the country. However if climbing the latter of status and wealth just so happens to be accomplished by saying or doing the right thing, that's what he'll do.

If Trump had seen an opening as a Dem he would've just as easily hopped on that side of the fence to achieve his goal, that is furthering his brand.

 

[Ingomike]

Time and time again throughout history, egotistical, self serving men have said and done whatever it takes to get their name up in lights.

If the argument is that Trump is all those things but hes saying and doing what I want to get reelected, that's fine. Just dont pretend Trump is doing it out of some sense of duty to anyone but himself.

Put this way Trump wouldn't sacrifice any bit of himself or his wealth for the greater good of the country. However if climbing the latter of status and wealth just so happens to be accomplished by saying or doing the right thing, that's what he'll do.

If Trump had seen an opening as a Dem he would've just as easily hopped on that side of the fence to achieve his goal, that is furthering his brand.

Absolutely true. Again, I couldn't care less about the plow used, just that the field gets plowed....

I hope he makes boat loads of money, just like his predecessors...

 

[Jludo]

Really? This presupposes the parties themselves have not changed or even we ourselves have not changed, nor the situation on the ground has changed. We have, they have and so has he.

He is rising to the desperate need to keep this country on the same constitutional path it was started on.

Im not sure I've heard that one before, a constitutional argument for Trump?
Maybe if the argument is that people will be so scared of Trump being elected they'll reign in executive power back to constitutional levels.
There are very few politicians in Washington with actual concern over, or even knowledge of, the constitution. Trump is not one of them.

 

[T.Lex]

Absolutely true. Again, I couldn't care less about the plow used, just that the field gets plowed....

And Trump sure has plowed many a field....

 

[BugI02]

Trump in his 2000 book, the America we deserve.

[FONT=&amp]I’m a conservative on most issues but a liberal on health. It is an unacceptable but accurate fact that the number of uninsured Americans has risen to 42 million. Working out detailed plans will take time. But the goal should be clear: Our people are our greatest asset. We must take care of our own. We must have universal healthcare.[/FONT]Our objective [should be] to make reforms for the moment and, longer term, to find an equivalent of the single-payer plan that is affordable, well-administered, and provides freedom of choice. Possible? The good news is, yes. There is already a system in place-the Federal Employees Health Benefits Program-that can act as a guide for all healthcare reform. It operates through a centralized agency that offers considerable range of choice. While this is a government program, it is also very much market-based. It allows 620 private insurance companies to compete for this market. Once a year participants can choose from plans which vary in benefits and costs.

https://www.ontheissues.org/Archive/America_We_Deserve_Health_Care.htm

I'm guessing Trump has seen the light since that book?

So you skipped right over the parts about private insurance companies allowed to compete for the market (like Medicare Advantage, one would assume) and a system based around employment (Federal Employees Health Benefits Program)? Doesn't seem like he's advocating anything more than increased access under which people can pay for what they want but cannot be excluded

He's specifically says (... find an equivalent of the single-payer plan that is affordable, well-administered, and provides freedom of choice)

Do you think that (m)any of us would balk at a plan where people were free to have as good a health plan as they were willing to pay for and perhaps saw costs across the board incremented some small and reasonable amount to ensure access for those with a pre-existing condition (after seeing our costs decline from no longer forcing such programs to provide birth control, abortion, sex-change operations etc etc)

Your high opinion of us is noted

 

[nonobaddog]

Put this way Trump wouldn't sacrifice any bit of himself or his wealth for the greater good of the country.

And yet that is exactly what he is doing. He does not take the Presidential salary. Could you imagine somebody like obummer doing the same thing? No, I can't either, the thought is hilarious.

 

[printcraft]

And Trump sure has plowed many a field....

And?

 

[Jludo]

And yet that is exactly what he is doing. He does not take the Presidential salary. Could you imagine somebody like obummer doing the same thing? No, I can't either, the thought is hilarious.

The 400k a year salary is peanuts compared to what presidents stand to make with decisions in office and after office. Do you think Trumps net worth will be less after these years of sacrificing the presidential salary? It was a calculated political bit to get elected, knowing full well the wealth in the presidency isn't in the salary. I would be willing to bet the Trump family net worth will have climbed substantially as part of this stint in office.

Even Obama, with no business knowledge, managed to turn the presidency into a tens of millions of dollars payday.

The money isn't even most important to Trump, it's having his name on TV every day and millions of adoring fans. Think of it this way, if Trump could have best served the country as a no-name bureaucrat working on US trade deals in the shadows and making a huge impact but never getting recognition, do you think he would have ever done it?