Steven Crowder v Daily Wire

[KLB]

The line is advocacy of the communist NGO agenda.

Which Shapiro is all too excited to help push, even if he does so quietly and under the table.

If you aren't getting banned and deplatformed, it's because you're helping their agenda.

That's silly. If you are deplatformed, you're not exactly getting your word out there much, are you? Most of them play the game by walking the line very tightly. You can say the right things, without getting kicked off.

These are businesses we are talking about, not crusaders. I'm not investing $50M in someone to have them go and say something stupid so that they can't generate money for me.

 

[wtburnette]

I was going to say the same thing. They run a business, they aren't a F'n charity. They push the message of free markets and working hard and making money. Like KLB previously posted, if you don't like the deal, you negotiate or just don't take the offer. Freaking A.

 

[Tombs]

I was going to say the same thing. They run a business, they aren't a F'n charity. They push the message of free markets and working hard and making money. Like KLB previously posted, if you don't like the deal, you negotiate or just don't take the offer. Freaking A.

There's more to being a conservative than worshiping money. If not, we might as well fold up shop and start flying the chinese flag.

 

[Tombs]

That's silly. If you are deplatformed, you're not exactly getting your word out there much, are you? Most of them play the game by walking the line very tightly. You can say the right things, without getting kicked off.

These are businesses we are talking about, not crusaders. I'm not investing $50M in someone to have them go and say something stupid so that they can't generate money for me.

Saying something stupid? You mean like that men are men and women are women?
That men can't get pregnant?
That marriage is between a man and a woman?

Once again, there's more to being a conservative than worshiping money.

 

[HoughMade]

Kinda sad to see this play out IMO.

I expect both sides to push hard for the terms that they want and to walk away if they can't get together.

That this is happening publicly shows me that ego is more important than the cause. I blame Crowder for making this public....and yes, he has a significant ego, but the DW people could have chosen not to engage.

This is just a dumb thing to do in public.

 

[1nderbeard]

I've been a subscriber to DW for several years. Shapiro's take on the 2a got me when everyone was talking about banning everything after one of the publicized mass shootings.

I think Crowder made it personal in releasing the phone call. That crossed the line.

The contact didn't offend me, and neither does the business model of the DW. They're in the game to make money, and change the culture of the country over the next several decades. They also sued the govt over the vaccine mandates. All that takes money.

I think Crowder is entertaining, but I haven't ever paid for his content. It's pretty clear he's on the path to building his own company. He's playing the victim "I'm just like one of you people" card to do that.

 

[wtburnette]

There's more to being a conservative than worshiping money. If not, we might as well fold up shop and start flying the chinese flag.

Agreed, but when you run a business money is pretty important. They're trying to offer an alternative platform to the constant Left wing narrative, but they need money to do it. Broke people aren't going to run a successful conservative company and keep it successful, without being beholden to someone else.

 

[Tombs]

Agreed, but when you run a business money is pretty important. They're trying to offer an alternative platform to the constant Left wing narrative, but they need money to do it. Broke people aren't going to run a successful conservative company and keep it successful, without being beholden to someone else.

And basing your business model on only being able to be milquetoast on big-tech platforms instead of creating your own where you have the freedom to actually express conservative philosophy, is going to fail.

You might make a lot of money, but you'll accomplish nothing in the way of changing hearts and minds.

And if your goal is only to make money, that's called being a grifter.

The best model is to have a limited amount of content on big tech, that directs you to your own platform where you can express your full views. Using big tech solely as a fishing pond.

this just dropped:

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

If you don't like the offer, you don't take it. Pretty simple concept. If he thinks he can do better, he is free to go on his own and try.

Was there a provision that said if they made less off of him that his salary was cut, other than because he was responsible for being deplatformed?

Agreed. The point was to counter DW’s tears.

 

[jamil]

The line is advocacy of the communist NGO agenda.

Which Shapiro is all too excited to help push, even if he does so quietly and under the table.

If you aren't getting banned and deplatformed, it's because you're helping their agenda.

WTF? This is probably one of the oddest binaries I've seen on INGO. IF you're not getting banned and deplatformed, you're a communist sympathizer?

Why hasn't Crowder been kicked off of Youtube yet? Yeah. He's had some strikes. Some suspensions. But hey. Until he gets permabanned, he may as well be Stalin. Am I right?

 

[jamil]

I've been a subscriber to DW for several years. Shapiro's take on the 2a got me when everyone was talking about banning everything after one of the publicized mass shootings.

I think Crowder made it personal in releasing the phone call. That crossed the line.

The contact didn't offend me, and neither does the business model of the DW. They're in the game to make money, and change the culture of the country over the next several decades. They also sued the govt over the vaccine mandates. All that takes money.

I think Crowder is entertaining, but I haven't ever paid for his content. It's pretty clear he's on the path to building his own company. He's playing the victim "I'm just like one of you people" card to do that.

I subscribe to both youtube channels, but I'm not a Mug Club subscriber, and I don't do DW+. So I'm not giving either of them any of my money. I tend to think Crowder is making more of it than there is. I don't think DW is completely right either. I don't think they offered enough money for their expectations. The $50M was for a packaged deal. So Crowder's income from that $50M is dependent on how much he spends making his content. Includes payroll, and any other expense. I think the characterization that DW made that this is basketball contract money is a ridiculous comparison. I think that's a disingenuous claim.

But, there are disingenuous claims all the way around. Crowder's main claim, "big con" is a pretty big accusation without big evidence of its existence other than the contract and Crowder's word. The contract, itself, while kinda crappy, is not a con job.

I listened to timcast as much as I had time for. If Crowder explained why he's doing what looks a lot more like an email harvesting scam, it wasn't during the time I watched. And that's really one of the things he needed to do to make me more amenable to his thinking. The other, of course, was for him to make a better case that there is a big con that needs fighting.

 

[jamil]

And basing your business model on only being able to be milquetoast on big-tech platforms instead of creating your own where you have the freedom to actually express conservative philosophy, is going to fail.

Some good points Crowder made was that you could go to platforms like Rumble and say what you want. The problem there is that doing let's you say what you want, but it doesn't do anything to change culture. It just creates information bubbles.

You might make a lot of money, but you'll accomplish nothing in the way of changing hearts and minds.

Youtube IS the platform right now. Most of the people on Rumble now are either conservative or at least favorable towards traditional Western values. They aren't the ones who *need* to see conservative content. Who is going to change hearts and minds on Rumble? Hmm? Rumble is where red-pilled people go to talk about how ****ed up the world is now. Youtube is where the world finds content. would love for Rumble to replace them, but that's just not what it is now.

And if your goal is only to make money, that's called being a grifter.

Uh. No. That's NOT what a grifter is.

The best model is to have a limited amount of content on big tech, that directs you to your own platform where you can express your full views. Using big tech solely as a fishing pond.

Yes. I agree with that. Both DW and Crowder do that. They all pretty much do that. They do their show on Youtube, and then tell people to go behind their paywall to hear things they can't say on Youtube. I mean. If making money is the definition of grifter, that's pretty grifty too in my book. Tease peolple, and then say, now pay us money if you want to hear the real stuff.

 

[Tombs]

WTF? This is probably one of the oddest binaries I've seen on INGO. IF you're not getting banned and deplatformed, you're a communist sympathizer?

Why hasn't Crowder been kicked off of Youtube yet? Yeah. He's had some strikes. Some suspensions. But hey. Until he gets permabanned, he may as well be Stalin. Am I right?

I'm saying that unless you say and advocate things youtube approves of, sooner or later you are demonitized, temporarily banned, or if you don't have enough of an audience, you get disappeared.

 

[jamil]

I'm saying that unless you say and advocate things youtube approves of, sooner or later you are demonitized, temporarily banned, or if you don't have enough of an audience, you get disappeared.

Okay. I agree with this. If you were saying that all along I would have expected the communist **** wouldn't be there like it's not here.

The demonetization issue is a contract thing. I can see where, if DW is saying that they need some protection of their investment, that's a valid point. Who takes the risk? Who *should* be expected to take the risk? If DW is paying for the ability to monetize youtube videos, and they can't, that's their loss. Crowder shares none of the risk for his content. I think a fair contract would split the risk. The penalties in the term sheet were way too one sided, and I'd hope anyone wanting to do a contract with DW would negotiate a fairer deal.

 

[jamil]

this just dropped:

Been watching this. I like Rekieta, he was great during many of the controversial trials playing out over the last year. But a complaint I have is that he doesn't always pay attention to what's being said as he comments on stuff, and then mistakes what was said. At 17:11 Rekieta says "that's a ****ing lie!" about how Boring was characterizing the "ownership" part of the contract.

Boring explained it pretty much like Rekieta did though. Stuff made during the 4 year term belongs to DW, forever. That's what Boring said too. Boring did make a statement just prior that referred to the stuff that Crowder made before the 4 year term would revert to Crowder after the contract expires. He was contrasting the two parts of ownership. The "before" stuff reverts to Crowder after the contrct. The "during" stuff stays with DW in perpetuity at their discretion.

 

[Tombs]

Okay. I agree with this. If you were saying that all along I would have expected the communist **** wouldn't be there like it's not here.

The demonetization issue is a contract thing. I can see where, if DW is saying that they need some protection of their investment, that's a valid point. Who takes the risk? Who *should* be expected to take the risk? If DW is paying for the ability to monetize youtube videos, and they can't, that's their loss. Crowder shares none of the risk for his content. I think a fair contract would split the risk. The penalties in the term sheet were way too one sided, and I'd hope anyone wanting to do a contract with DW would negotiate a fairer deal.

The risk liability seems awfully baffling to me. Taking a pay cut and surrendering a lot of rights, while also taking on massive financial liability he does not currently have.

 

[fullmetaljesus]

Based on what I've seen so far I agree with Ben though I would like to see them work it out to where crowder joins the daily wire.

 

[jamil]

The risk liability seems awfully baffling to me. Taking a pay cut and surrendering a lot of rights, while also taking on massive financial liability he does not currently have.

Well, like I said, it might make better sense if DW offered him a lot more money. Rekieta seemed to think Crowder would have taken a pay cut with that deal. Hard to know who was coming out on top without knowing what the merch and Mug Club membership numbers are. But I think the penalties were pretty one sided.

 

[Tombs]

Well, like I said, it might make better sense if DW offered him a lot more money. Rekieta seemed to think Crowder would have taken a pay cut with that deal. Hard to know who was coming out on top without knowing what the merch and Mug Club membership numbers are. But I think the penalties were pretty one sided.

The main issue I take away from Rekeita's video is that I'm not understanding what DW is presenting as a benefit for Crowder.

It looks like they reap all the benefits of his work and him establishing a brand/loyal base, while he gets..... what?

Unless there's some secret huge financial mess with mug club, I'm not seeing anything he would benefit from.

 

[jamil]

Based on what I've seen so far I agree with Ben though I would like to see them work it out to where crowder joins the daily wire.

I don't think DW can afford Crowder. I think he likely does more than $12.5M/year with mug club, merch, advertising, etcetera.