State Police Getting Rid of Glock 21s?

[dmarsh8]

exactly

 

[Davis0023]

I am very pro-leo , and this is a yet another waste of tax payer money. I understood and supported the upgrade from Beretta, but this their 2nd Glock model. SMH! There is nothing I can say that hasn't really already been said.

However I can I am surprised the Troopers aren't the most upset. They need this money on their checks. I saw their pay matrix..I was not impressed. They should be treated better and funds should not wasted on new guns when they already are carrying the best.

 

[in625shooter]

I am very pro-leo , and this is a yet another waste of tax payer money. I understood and supported the upgrade from Beretta, but this their 2nd Glock model. SMH! There is nothing I can say that hasn't really already been said.

However I can I am surprised the Troopers aren't the most upset. They need this money on their checks. I saw their pay matrix..I was not impressed. They should be treated better and funds should not wasted on new guns when they already are carrying the best.

I agree and while some of us might have our "pet" calibers or makes if the Glock 17's were working (which they were having favorable reviews in all the after action reviews when they were used and did in fact stop the bad guys) then why mess with something that aint broke?

 

[Dobber]

(which they were having favorable reviews in all the after action reviews when they were used and did in fact stop the bad guys) then why mess with something that aint broke?

To be the Devil's Advocate, doubt instills fear. The moment they had negative outcomes or unwanted usage scenarios that gun was doomed with LE....as it should be. Positive AARs be what they are I'd never want me, my buddies, or any other public servant to be the guy submitting the AAR where the weapon repeated previous failures. Regarding why those weapons are being replaced (reality): because the ISP doesn't want any sort of liability inherent with a gun that had trained or operated in the real world with unintended outcomes. I wouldn't even be shocked if their insurance company didn't mandate the replacement of all of those weapons.

-Dobber

 

[in625shooter]

To be the Devil's Advocate, doubt instills fear. The moment they had negative outcomes or unwanted usage scenarios that gun was doomed with LE....as it should be. Positive AARs be what they are I'd never want me, my buddies, or any other public servant to be the guy submitting the AAR where the weapon repeated previous failures. Regarding why those weapons are being replaced (reality): because the ISP doesn't want any sort of liability inherent with a gun that had trained or operated in the real world with unintended outcomes. I wouldn't even be shocked if their insurance company didn't mandate the replacement of all of those weapons.

-Dobber

What I'm saying is the 9mm model 17's worked fine so why mess with it. They had issues at first with the 40 cal model 22's. Then they went with the 9mm model 17's which they had ZERO issues with. Then THEY whoever THEY are (and why do THEY only talk to one person) decided they needed the 45 cal model 21.

 

[f'nstar]

I wouldn't call the 21 the best if it were the best why is there a high malfunction rate. The newer 17 they had also had issues one class had to send a lot of their guns back because of issues. I don't care what they get but I think they deserve a gun that works.

 

[SpaldingPM]

Most glocks I've ever shot don't freely drop the stock weighted polymer mag. Seems like they're almost too light. Simple solution... find out a way to make them heavier without obstructing function.
I'm a Beretta and SIG man anyways.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

The magazine drop wasn't the only issue. I don't know if it was a bad batch of the MIM firing pins or what, but per a few Troopers I talked to recently once the round count got to about 1k, the firing pins were mushrooming in the Glock 21.

 

[VUPDblue]

I spoke to a trooper just now at work and he told me they were officially told yesterday that they were switching to a Sig-Sauer .45

 

[sparkyfender]

Sig is a standard whipping boy for lots of folks. Wonder what will be found wanting with those?

What next? H&K?

 

[PaulF]

When I was younger I was a reserve police officer, and my department carried Glock 21s. I liked the platform, and never had an issue with mine while I was carrying it. Later, I bought a gen3 for my personal use (due to my previous, positive experiences), but something was different with that one...

I had several FTF issues (DanielOcean03 saw this happen).

I have read that the Glock 20/21 platform was meant for the higher chamber pressures that are produced by the 10mm Auto round, and that it can be ammo-sensitive. This makes sense to me since the department used only top-shelf duty ammo, and I used whatever I could afford.

Personally, I'm not sure I trust the 21 anymore...at least for EDC.

THe Sig227 looks like a fine choice, but it has different controls...some additional training my be useful for the Troopers.

I'll buy one...but I am a certified SigWhore.

 

[TLHelmer]

I received the "official" email today that we are switching to the Sig 227 not the FN FNX. I think I will like the 227 much better than the FNX. At least you can find holsters for the 227. They have the same frame size as the 226/220.

 

[drillsgt]

I received the "official" email today that we are switching to the Sig 227 not the FN FNX. I think I will like the 227 much better than the FNX. At least you can find holsters for the 227. They have the same frame size as the 226/220.

I guess somebody needs to try out a new untested pistol, might as well be the taxpayers. What happens when these don't work?

 

[in625shooter]

I guess somebody needs to try out a new untested pistol, might as well be the taxpayers. What happens when these don't work?

I see what your saying but in the cas eof SIG I actually believe they can pull it off. I have never heard of any major problems with the 220-229 series. The 220 I used for duty ran and ran and ran. Hope ISP gets a good one this time, they deserve it.

 

[NDhunter]

I guess somebody needs to try out a new untested pistol, might as well be the taxpayers. What happens when these don't work?

There is a lot more that goes into these decisions than most people realize.

Think of it this way: How much is it worth for a large, well-known agency to carry a certain company's gun? Or in this case, how much is it worth to a company for a new weapon from the company to be adopted by a large well known agency?

Guns deals aren't always black and white, there is a lot of gray. This includes prices agencies may/may not pay for pistols and leather.

 

[f'nstar]

I guess somebody needs to try out a new untested pistol, might as well be the taxpayers. What happens when these don't work?

Yeah I am sure that the factory has never tested the pistol. They just release a new gun and let the buyers try them out. I'm sure that if a problem arises Sig would stand behind their product.

 

[Robjps]

Yeah I am sure that the factory has never tested the pistol. They just release a new gun and let the buyers try them out. I'm sure that if a problem arises Sig would stand behind their product.

You are correct no firearm has ever been produced that had a problem.

 

[drillsgt]

Yeah I am sure that the factory has never tested the pistol. They just release a new gun and let the buyers try them out. I'm sure that if a problem arises Sig would stand behind their product.

Wow, obviously you don't know anything about new gun releases because they never have issues right? I'm sure Glock fired a few rounds through the pistols they sent to ISP that caused this mess as well. Standing behind the product doesn't do much good when it's already in hand and you need to carry it daily.

 

[drillsgt]

I see what your saying but in the cas eof SIG I actually believe they can pull it off. I have never heard of any major problems with the 220-229 series. The 220 I used for duty ran and ran and ran. Hope ISP gets a good one this time, they deserve it.

We'll see, I love 220's as well and would have been the smart choice. Has ISP even had any 227's for T&E yet? It sounds like they aren't even going to bother. It just sounds very unconventional to adopt a brand new pistol that is not even available yet?

 

[in625shooter]

We'll see, I love 220's as well and would have been the smart choice. Has ISP even had any 227's for T&E yet? It sounds like they aren't even going to bother. It just sounds very unconventional to adopt a brand new pistol that is not even available yet?

Most likely SIG has some T&E versions of the 227 made and tested. Most agency protocal is to infact test a model before commiting. the only issue I could see is the same that faced Browning about 23-5 years ago with the BDM, The Secret Service commited to adopting it to replace the model 13 revolvers and Browning could not deliver within the time constrains and SIG stepped up with their 228.

I have no doubt SIG will hold up their part they are more about agency adoption than individual handgun purchases. In the unlikley event that some problems come to light (that sometimes happen when you start issuing/adopting over 1,000 new handguns to an agency) then looks like they can either got to a 220 or less likely 226 in 40, 357 or 9mm.