Saw a "gun sense" booth today

[JetGirl]

I'm not saying or even suggesting that you're lying. But with all due respect, I'm 61 years old, and I've yet to meet one that wasn't the other. Or at the very least they have no use for guns, and could care less either way. In that case there is nothing to "convince".

Hello, my name is Annie and I was (for decades) a die-hard anti-gun person from an ND to a mugging and beyond. I've never supported socialism or liberalism. I just didn't want guns around me or mine, or anything to do with them.

 

[JeremiahJohnson]

The gun issue, especially in extreme forms (i.e. volunteering to man an anti-2A booth), reminds me of religious zealotry right here in the midwest. I'm not on either side of the religious zealotry issue so please don't throw me on either side, but I have made some observations. When a religious group pickets or marches on adult book stores (for instance) no one changes their minds. There's a lot of anger on both sides, but it doesn't appear anything changes.

My family has pentecostals, reprobates, catholics, you name it. We don't talk religion at family reunions. It's pointless. No one changes their minds. No one listens, they only talk or think of what they're going to say next.

I think the gun issue has become so fused with emotion it's on the level of religion. If someone is neutral or simply hasn't been exposed you have a chance of presenting data and a reasonable argument and they may make an informed decision. Once the emotion gets injected reason goes out the window.

 

[billt]

I find it interesting how we humans can be guilty of exactly what we accuse others of, and not recognize that fact.

The problem is that it is not an "accusation", it's proven fact. If you think it isn't, give me one single example of a socialist / communist government that has been a success? Capitalism built this country into the most successful, free nation yet devised by man. Socialism / communism has destroyed prosperous living everywhere it has ever been employed. That is not a political opinion. It is solid fact.

Just because liberal / socialists refuse to recognize it, does not make it any more true than Obama's excuses and lies about Benghazi, the IRS scandal, or Fast & furious. Or Clintons rant about how, "I did not have sex with that woman!" Or for that matter Nixon and Watergate. Truth is the truth, and a lie is a lie. It really is just as simple as that. It doesn't make it any more complex because liberals are too blind or stupid to see it.

 

[billt]

Hello, my name is Annie and I was (for decades) a die-hard anti-gun person from an ND to a mugging and beyond. I've never supported socialism or liberalism. I just didn't want guns around me or mine, or anything to do with them.

Those people, (what few of them exist), don't need me or anyone else to turn their steering wheel in the "right" direction. They'll be self correcting because they understand common sense. Susanna Hupp is a good example.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Another option might be to set up your own booth. Maybe set up a NRA recruiting center; hand out gun safety literature; sources for firearms training; information on how to obtain an Indiana LTCH; etc.

 

[JetGirl]

Those people, (what few of them exist), don't need me or anyone else to turn their steering wheel in the "right" direction. They'll be self correcting because they understand common sense. Susanna Hupp is a good example.

"Those" people?

 

[billt]

From what I'm seeing and reading here, we are giving way too much leeway to these people. At present, both liberals and Muslims are the greatest threat to this nation. We do not want to recognize that fact because we want to believe, "not all of them are bad". The fact of the matter is they don't have to be, anymore than the Japanese or Germans did. Just enough of them to destroy us.

That they seem to be accomplishing with smashing success. I give you Obama and Al Qaida as my bona fides. How many does one have to bankrupt, and the other kill before we understand that fact? Today we seem to find that it is politically incorrect to accept our enemies as just that. Obama has showed us that, if he's done anything.

 

[billt]

"Those" people?

Your example.

 

[JetGirl]

Those people

"Those" people?

Your example.

My example was myself.

From what I'm seeing and reading here, we are giving way too much leeway to these people.

Wow.

 

[jbombelli]

Here is a simple way to take almost any anti-gun person and convert them to pro-gun: beat them to death with a hammer. I guarantee you at some point during that beating they're going to wish they had a gun.

 

[Fletch]

The gun issue, especially in extreme forms (i.e. volunteering to man an anti-2A booth)...

So volunteering at a pro-2A booth is also extremism.

My family has pentecostals, reprobates, catholics, you name it. We don't talk religion at family reunions. It's pointless. No one changes their minds. No one listens, they only talk or think of what they're going to say next.

I think the gun issue has become so fused with emotion it's on the level of religion. If someone is neutral or simply hasn't been exposed you have a chance of presenting data and a reasonable argument and they may make an informed decision. Once the emotion gets injected reason goes out the window.

I'm only 43, but I've seen plenty of hearts and minds change on a wide variety of issues. It's not easy, the effort is at times excruciating, and it does require that one see one's opponents as human beings instead of monsters, but it is one of the most beautiful things that can happen among people.

All it takes is understanding that it's not your job to change their mind, and the inner peace to be able to say "namaste" (and mean it) even if nothing positive arises immediately from your encounter.

 

[billt]

My example was myself..........Wow.

"Wow" what? You seem to understand perfectly who I was talking about, regardless of the lingo I used. What's your beef other than political correctness, which I'll admit I totally lack. The reason is because it is as useless as liberals......or, "those people".

 

[billt]

If there is a standing crop of Elm trees, and I point and refer to them as, "those trees", please explain how that is any different than if I point to a group of Muslims or liberals and refer to them as, "those people"??? Other than the fact you're picking the fly $h!t out of the pepper.

 

[JetGirl]

"Wow" what?

"Wow" even though I said (in regards to guns/liberalism);

I feel it's important to point out that not all antis are "liberal/socialist"... .

You countered with...

I'm not saying or even suggesting that you're lying. But with all due respect, I'm 61 years old, and I've yet to meet one that wasn't the other. .

Not to mention Dan saying to you (and getting totally ignored - which says a lot);

Hello, my name is Dan, I'm a liberal. And I love my guns. Nice yo meet you.

I'm only 43, but I've seen plenty of hearts and minds change on a wide variety of issues. It's not easy, the effort is at times excruciating, and it does require that one see one's opponents as human beings instead of monsters, but it is one of the most beautiful things that can happen among people.

And he^ should know because you've all got him to thank (or blame) for me being what I am here today, in spite of the rabid anti-gun past.

 

[billt]

I'm only 43, but I've seen plenty of hearts and minds change on a wide variety of issues. It's not easy, the effort is at times excruciating, and it does require that one see one's opponents as human beings instead of monsters, but it is one of the most beautiful things that can happen among people.

That is true. Providing there is ANY chance in hell of it happening, period. In most cases there is not. As I mentioned earlier, I'm from Chicago. I voted in every election since I was 18, until I left the state at age 38. Tell me, what good did ANY of it do? Other than the time in the 70's I voted for Republican Phil Crane as my Congressman. Chicago, and Illinois in general has been run by socialists since the 50's. It will never change. They will go down in flames as socialists, just like Detroit has. It doesn't even matter if they elect a Republican governor in the state. Chicago socialists are far more politically entrenched, and will block their every move.

Sometimes you just have to face reality. Part of winning the war is being able to recognize when you're losing the battle. This way you can better apply your forces. I'm not going to waste my time voting for someone who is never going to have a chance, any more than I am going to waste my breath trying to convert a die hard anti gunner. It simply isn't worth the effort wasted. That is not a defeatist attitude, but rather a realistic one.

 

[JetGirl]

...any more than I am going to waste my breath trying to convert a die hard anti gunner. It simply isn't worth the effort wasted.

I'm glad Fletch never considered me a waste of breath or a waste of effort.

 

[sparkyfender]

This is all very enlightening. And it also explains to the Nth degree why more pro-2nd folks don't turn more antis around.

Because I don't see the point in getting into a toe to toe confrontation with a bunch of radicalized anti gunners?

Respectfully, I don't agree with your premise. It explains nothing, let alone to the "Nth degree."

 

[Fletch]

That is true. Providing there is ANY chance in hell of it happening, period. In most cases there is not. As I mentioned earlier, I'm from Chicago. I voted in every election since I was 18, until I left the state at age 38. Tell me, what good did ANY of it do? Other than the time in the 70's I voted for Republican Phil Crane as my Congressman. Chicago, and Illinois in general has been run by socialists since the 50's. It will never change. They will go down in flames as socialists, just like Detroit has. It doesn't even matter if they elect a Republican governor in the state. Chicago socialists are far more politically entrenched, and will block their every move.

I'm talking about engaging with people. Voting is the opposite of engaging. Voting to change the world only makes sense to people who can't do math.

 

[billt]

"Wow" even though I said (in regards to guns/liberalism);

You countered with...

Not to mention Dan saying to you (and getting totally ignored - which says a lot);

And he^ should know because you've all got him to thank (or blame) for me being what I am here today, in spite of the rabid anti-gun past.

So...... I take from all of this that there are a few liberals out there in gun land who like guns. You appear to all but be bragging you're one of them. You and "Dan". Yet they're / You're still liberals, correct? Which means they are most likely still out there voting for freedom robbing socialists / communists like Obama in most every election, correct? If they're liberals they sure as hell aren't voting for conservative Republicans are they? So please explain to me how is that an improvement of any kind? They've turned around their thinking in order to like something they're trying to eliminate with most every vote they cast. This is some kind of miraculous improvement over the run of the mill anti gunner how?

 

[Fletch]

So...... I take from all of this that there are a few liberals out there in gun land who like guns. You appear to all but be bragging you're one of them. You and "Dan". Yet they're / You're still liberals, correct? Which means they are most likely still out there voting for freedom robbing socialists / communists like Obama in most every election, correct? If they're liberals they sure as hell aren't voting for conservative Republicans are they? So please explain to me how is that an improvement of any kind? They've turned around their thinking in order to like something they're trying to eliminate with most every vote they cast. This is some kind of miraculous improvement over the run of the mill anti gunner how?

Are you even reading other peoples' posts here, or are you attempting to be an object lesson in your own worldview? Jetgirl clearly stated that she is NOT a liberal but WAS anti-gun. Dan said he IS a liberal but is also pro-gun. Stop trying to lump everybody into the the same category.