OC Black Friday Meet and Lunch 11/26/10 Discussion Thread

[ATF Consumer]

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You must have mod power they don't have

 

[Que]

Like with anything, it takes one positive influence to change the hearts and minds of many. Because SJ has demonstrated a level of professionalism that causes me to understand his concern for those attending, I wouldn't mind walking in future events that he organizes. He's a leader who inspires others to follow him and he will become even better, IMO. On the other hand, some desire to lead by bullying and guilting others into action. I still disagree with the purpose of this event (education), so that is why I am not attending. I don't want anything to happen and I only desire the walk to be free of incidents of any kind.

It's my personal belief this walk was formed because of what happened to ATF at the "Cookie Lunch", but for some reason that is not being said. If that were the case, I would feel it were my duty to be there. What happened to him was not a lawful act, but for now, it is not the impetus for any form of action.

Because this walk is not tied to the abuse of any fundamental 2A issue, I have no duty to attend. I have no reason to walk without a purpose. I can care less that others don't realize what their rights are, just as long as they don't infringe on mine or those of other gun owners/carriers. Many people can care less about their rights and are too lazy to find out what they are. Now, I enjoy owning, carrying, and shooting guns and would like others to enjoy this way of life, so someday I do plan to organize some education sessions to teach others about the joys of gun ownership.

I'm not sure of the purpose of the other two events, but I believe those too were done without a legitimate or necessary purpose (e.g., violation of the 2A in any form). If anyone can point me to an AAR of those events which notes the purpose and achievement of that stated purpose -- other than just being able to do it -- I will openly admit my error.

 

[sj kahr k40]

Guys please let's keep on task, this is not helping

 

[ATF Consumer]

Like with anything, it takes one positive influence to change the hearts and minds of many. Because SJ has demonstrated a level of professionalism that causes me to understand his concern for those attending, I wouldn't mind walking in future events that he organizes. He's a leader who inspires others to follow him and he will become even better, IMO. On the other hand, some desire to lead by bullying and guilting others into action. I still disagree with the purpose of this event (education), so that is why I am not attending. I don't want anything to happen and I only desire the walk to be free of incidents of any kind.

It's my personal belief this walk was formed because of what happened to ATF at the "Cookie Lunch", but for some reason that is not being said. If that were the case, I would feel it were my duty to be there. What happened to him was not a lawful act, but for now, it is not the impetus for any form of action.

Because this walk is not tied to the abuse of any fundamental 2A issue, I have no duty to attend. I have no reason to walk without a purpose. I can care less that others don't realize what their rights are, just as long as they don't infringe on mine or those of other gun owners/carriers. Many people can care less about their rights and are too lazy to find out what they are. Now, I enjoy owning, carrying, and shooting guns and would like others to enjoy this way of life, so someday I do plan to organize some education sessions to teach others about the joys of gun ownership.

I'm not sure of the purpose of the other two events, but I believe those too were done without a legitimate or necessary purpose (e.g., violation of the 2A in any form). If anyone can point me to an AAR of those events which notes the purpose and achievement of that stated purpose -- other than just being able to do it -- I will openly admit my error.

Sorry you feel that way because you are wrong...we would have had this walk whether my incident happened or not. It IS about education, but you are free to tell yourself otherwise.

 

[Cru]

It's my personal belief this walk was formed because of what happened to ATF at the "Cookie Lunch", but for some reason that is not being said. If that were the case, I would feel it were my duty to be there. What happened to him was not a lawful act, but for now, it is not the impetus for any form of action.

I thought this was exactly the reason for this walk. That's why I was planning on attending. Maybe I missed it somewhere and someone said it isn't

I'm not trying to discredit anyone, I am just stating that my belief that the cookie lunch is EXACTLY why this event was organized.

 

[Joe Williams]

snip
It's my personal belief this walk was formed because of what happened to ATF at the "Cookie Lunch", but for some reason that is not being said. If that were the case, I would feel it were my duty to be there. What happened to him was not a lawful act, but for now, it is not the impetus for any form of action.

snip.

I thought I was personally pretty clear that that incident is why I'm participating in this walk, or at least why I'm participating in the manner I am. Normally, I wouldn't walk around downtown with a rifle, it's heavy and silly. I wouldn't walk around without ID, there's really no reason not to carry it, it can in fact be a PIA.

What those officers did, and the failure of their fellow officers during or after the event to correct the issue, demands a lawful response from citizens interested in preserving our rights. People like those particular officers need to remember that they are dealing with citizens, not subjects, and that WE ultimately hold the power. It doesn't hurt to rub their face in it from time to time. That's the education I'm looking for from this walk, and it can be achieved by something as simple as Officer Highsmith's superiors tasking him with protecting our group, and keeping his mouth shut while doing so. A man can dream...

 

[sj kahr k40]

Que truthfully what happened to ATF was part of the reason I decided to plan an event downtown, but it's not in response to that, it's partly that I attended that event to educate with flyers and we just had lunch and enjoyed the Colts rally which is fine too.

 

[ATF Consumer]

Que truthfully what happened to ATF was part of the reason I decided to plan an event downtown, but it's not in response to that, it's partly that I attended that event to educate with flyers and we just had lunch and enjoyed the Colts rally which is fine too.

Note: I didn't enjoy the Colts rally...at least not the Colts part...the scenery was nice though.

 

[SavageEagle]

I thought this was exactly the reason for this walk. That's why I was planning on attending. Maybe I missed it somewhere and someone said it isn't

I'm not trying to discredit anyone, I am just stating that my belief that the cookie lunch is EXACTLY why this event was organized.

In a way, it kinda is. How many LEO's are just finding out that what we're doing is actually legal and they have no right to stop it? It's not DIRECTLY responsible for this event, I don't think, but it is a reason. It's not like we're lashing out against IMPD or anything. Just trying to educate them and the general public.

That's what, I always thought, was the reason for doing this. Education.

 

[Cru]

Que truthfully what happened to ATF was part of the reason I decided to plan an event downtown, but it's not in response to that, it's partly that I attended that event to educate with flyers and we just had lunch and enjoyed the Colts rally which is fine too.

You might have enjoyed the colts rally, I didn't. I hate the colts. I don't mind their cheerleaders.

 

[SavageEagle]

Que truthfully what happened to ATF was part of the reason I decided to plan an event downtown, but it's not in response to that, it's partly that I attended that event to educate with flyers and we just had lunch and enjoyed the Colts rally which is fine too.

Beat me to it.

Note: I didn't enjoy the Colts rally...at least not the Colts part...the scenery was nice though.

I'm very sorry I had to miss it too.

 

[Cru]

BTW I'll be wearing a Patriots hat if I am able to make it

 

[ATF Consumer]

I can care less that others don't realize what their rights are, just as long as they don't infringe on mine or those of other gun owners/carriers. Many people can care less about their rights and are too lazy to find out what they are.

I really think that is the wrong way to think about rights...
Those that don't realize what their rights are are part of the sheeple that go along with what they are told, not what is right.
You want them to remain in the dark and some day vote against one of the rights you hold as the most important right that protects the rest?
I am making it part of my responsibility to help educate others of their rights our forefathers gave their blood for.

 

[Que]

Guys, we are a diverse group in many ways. We meet over the internet, which is not a good way to learn each other's personalities. I don't know why, but I'm just the kind of person who needs I's dotted and T's crossed. In just three minutes or so, we have three saying what happened to ATF is the reason or part of the reason for the walk, while one is saying it's not, and another saying it is and it's not. This is confusing and if SJ is leading, why does it matter what others say? Is he not the leader?

This goes to the point that so many others have made concerning handling the media and the talking points during the event. So, if Joe and CRU are interviewed, will they talk about what happened to ATF? When SJ is interviewed, will he talk about educating the public on gun rights? When SE is interviewed will he talk about educating LEO's?

It seems these could be the discussion points in this thread instead of the other twists, turns, and infighting about stuff that will not help this event achieve success.

 

[sj kahr k40]

Que just like any other group everyone has different reasons for attending the event, my main purpose as the organizer is to educate, I am working on talking points that will be gone over prior to the walk, but I'm not going to tell anyone what they can say.

 

[ATF Consumer]

Guys, we are a diverse group in many ways. We meet over the internet, which is not a good way to learn each other's personalities. I don't know why, but I'm just the kind of person who needs I's dotted and T's crossed. In just three minutes or so, we have three saying what happened to ATF is the reason or part of the reason for the walk, while one is saying it's not, and another saying it is and it's not. This is confusing and if SJ is leading, why does it matter what others say? Is he not the leader?

This goes to the point that so many others have made concerning handling the media and the talking points during the event. So, if Joe and CRU are interviewed, will they talk about what happened to ATF? When SJ is interviewed, will he talk about educating the public on gun rights? When SE is interviewed will he talk about educating LEO's?

It seems these could be the discussion points in this thread instead of the other twists, turns, and infighting about stuff that will not help this event achieve success.

Ok, as we can see, there is more than one purpose behind the walk, but the overall message is about education...cops can't tread on us and our informing the public of their rights...what is wrong with that?
Are all of the Tea Party participants all there in support for the same message? Not in the slightest, but they unify as one to send a message that they have had enough. Where is the rule that says we can only have one message, and why is it a bad thing to have more than one. I think it would actually be beneficial to have multiple reasons for the walk...would it not reinforce the walk altogether?

 

[lovemachine]

Guys, we are a diverse group in many ways. We meet over the internet, which is not a good way to learn each other's personalities. I don't know why, but I'm just the kind of person who needs I's dotted and T's crossed. In just three minutes or so, we have three saying what happened to ATF is the reason or part of the reason for the walk, while one is saying it's not, and another saying it is and it's not. This is confusing and if SJ is leading, why does it matter what others say? Is he not the leader?

This goes to the point that so many others have made concerning handling the media and the talking points during the event. So, if Joe and CRU are interviewed, will they talk about what happened to ATF? When SJ is interviewed, will he talk about educating the public on gun rights? When SE is interviewed will he talk about educating LEO's?

It seems these could be the discussion points in this thread instead of the other twists, turns, and infighting about stuff that will not help this event achieve success.

Que has a point. After reading the last page, I am getting mixed signals from everyone. I have no idea what this event is about now. I'm not going to name names, but there are guys in this thread that has the wrong attitude for this kind of event. THIS is one reason why I am not going to attend.

You all need to get your priorities straight. You have to have ONE main reason for this. Like Que mentioned, you get a reporter interviewing one guy, and another guy is saying something totally different. Everyone has to have the same reason and story. And you get all this negative attitude going on, THAT is what is going to cause something to go wrong.

And I think that is a HUGE reason why there are guys who are against this event. But again, this is all my

 

[ATF Consumer]

Que has a point. After reading the last page, I am getting mixed signals from everyone. I have no idea what this event is about now. I'm not going to name names, but there are guys in this thread that has the wrong attitude for this kind of event. THIS is one reason why I am not going to attend.

You all need to get your priorities straight. You have to have ONE main reason for this. Like Que mentioned, you get a reporter interviewing one guy, and another guy is saying something totally different. Everyone has to have the same reason and story. And you get all this negative attitude going on, THAT is what is going to cause something to go wrong.

And I think that is a HUGE reason why there are guys who are against this event. But again, this is all my

I think we saw Tea Party members with different messages, and that was a good thing.

 

[ATF Consumer]

Use the urinal and stop pissing on our parade.

 

[lovemachine]

Use the urinal and stop pissing on our parade.

Was this directed at me????