Militia Takes Over Wildlife Refuge In Oregon

[Kutnupe14]

If you have an hour thirty eight minutes and still have an open mind ... worth the time to listen.

Ok, I'm really confused. Greg McWhirter, is an 11 year veteran of the MCSD, has (is?) Worked the road, and has been on their SWAT team. If he's was working before the merger for the MCSD, wouldn't he automatically go over to IMPD? So why is he still with the SD? And did the SD still have a SWAT team after the merger? I hope he's not calling "fugitive recovery" SWAT, because while SWAT will do that sort of thing, their skill sets are significantly more advanced.... and he really doesn't look all that fit to be SWAT anywhere in Marion County.

 

[voidsherpa]

"Deliberately?" That's putting forth a false, or at the very least, unverified narrative. Horiuchi was shooting at Harris (who was armed), as Harris entered the cabin. He struck Harris, and killed Weaver with the same round.

3 shot in the back, and one unarmed mother in the face. Cool story bro.

EDIT: You're trying to call him out for being disingenuous, yet you, Kut, are being just as disingenuous.

 

[Kutnupe14]

3 shot in the back, and one unarmed mother in the face. Cool story bro.

EDIT: You're trying to call him out for being disingenuous, yet you, Kut, are being just as disingenuous.

So, you are of the belief that the sniper purposefully shot a person behind a door, rather than the armed person he had previously engaged, and was running for cover through the doorway? Like I said, that seems like a false narrative..... and it IS, without question (if one chooses to apply common sense), a unverified narrative.

 

[IndyDave1776]

So, you are of the belief that the sniper purposefully shot a person behind a door, rather than the armed person he had previously engaged, and was running for cover through the doorway? Like I said, that seems like a false narrative..... and it IS, without question (if one chooses to apply common sense), a unverified narrative.

The worthless MFSB left me with the distinct impression that he would be happy to kill anyone he could draw a bead on.

 

[Kutnupe14]

The worthless MFSB left me with the distinct impression that he would be happy to kill anyone he could draw a bead on.

Of that, I'm sure. All I'm saying is that he purposefully tried to shoot someone else, and hit Vicki instead.

 

[voidsherpa]

Of that, I'm sure. All I'm saying is that he purposefully tried to shoot someone else, and hit Vicki instead.

Shoot someone else in the back* 200 yards away** whom was retreating*** into a building with children****. But those are the Facts. Glad you believe that piece of **** who had to plead the 5th during a senate judiciary subcommittee, because they refused to give him immunity. All I'm saying is you are being disingenuous.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Shoot someone else in the back* 200 yards away** whom was retreating*** into a building with children****. But those are the Facts. Glad you believe that piece of **** who had to plead the 5th during a senate judiciary subcommittee, because they refused to give him immunity. All I'm saying is you are being disingenuous.

I think you quite understand what I am addressing. I'm not contesting LH purposefully engaging some of the individuals at Ruby Ridge. However, I am contesting whether he purposefully targeted Vicki Weaver. She was standing BEHIND a door, and was shot as another person entered the doorway. What is disingenuous is to say, with confidence, that LH knew she was behind the door, holding a baby and he decides to shoot through the door, rather than engage the armed person running through the doorway. But hey maybe LH had those top secret xray glasses that allowed him to see Vicki and the kid, and try to take them out.... you know, for extra evil points.

And for the record, this isn't the old west, lots of people have been justifiably shot in the the back.

 

[voidsherpa]

And for the record, this isn't the old west, lots of people have been justifiably shot in the the back.

Hey if you think those kill on sight ROE were justifiable, that's your own prerogative.

You implying that Horiuchi was good to go because Harris "who was armed" is how you are being disingenuous. But you spin it however you want.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Hey if you think those kill on sight ROE were justifiable, that's your own prerogative.

You implying that Horiuchi was good to go because Harris "who was armed" is how you are being disingenuous. But you spin it however you want.

Unfortunately for you my "spin," as you call is GTG.... evidenced by fact that none of the agents involved received any jail time. And yes, the rules of engagement were ridiculous, however, the fact that the person LH was shooting at was armed, which has been cited countless times since the incident probably, just maybe, played a hand in him staying out of prison. Not disingenuous, just the way it is. Write a missive to Capitol Hill and complain to them....not me.

 

[Birds Away]

Because everyone on INGO knows that merely carrying a weapon makes you subject to deadly force.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Because everyone on INGO knows that merely carrying a weapon makes you subject to deadly force.

Actually the circumstances you involved when carrying that weapon, weighs heavily in the decision.

 

[Birds Away]

Nah, just rack 'em up. Everybody's guilty of something, right?

 

[IndyDave1776]

Unfortunately for you my "spin," as you call is GTG.... evidenced by fact that none of the agents involved received any jail time. And yes, the rules of engagement were ridiculous, however, the fact that the person LH was shooting at was armed, which has been cited countless times since the incident probably, just maybe, played a hand in him staying out of prison. Not disingenuous, just the way it is. Write a missive to Capitol Hill and complain to them....not me.

If we accept your explanation, we owe apologies and reparations regarding some Germans we ordered executed at Nuremberg. After all, we determined that 'just following orders' didn't wash as an excuse for engaging in clearly criminal behavior.

 

[voidsherpa]

..however, the fact that the person LH was shooting at was armed, which has been cited countless times since the incident probably, just maybe, played a hand in him staying out of prison.

Actually the circumstances you involved when carrying that weapon, weighs heavily in the decision.

Didn't the Fed ultimately pay Harris for the bullets he used in his self defense action of killing a US Marshall? Kevin Harris is/was an innocent man.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Didn't the Fed ultimately pay Harris for the bullets he used in his self defense action of killing a US Marshall? Kevin Harris is/was an innocent man.

Nope. They paid him so they didn't have to admit liability.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Wrong target? Do you really believe that Horiuchi would make such an amateurish mistake? The closest I would come to believing that he did not deliberately shoot Vicki Weaver is that he just didn't give a flying f**k about who he hit.

One other thing. Why did no one ever stand trial for establishing ROE which were a de facto extermination order? Are we going to simply excuse summary execution by administrative decision?

 

[Kutnupe14]

Wrong target? Do you really believe that Horiuchi would make such an amateurish mistake? The closest I would come to believing that he did not deliberately shoot Vicki Weaver is that he just didn't give a flying f**k about who he hit.

One other thing. Why did no one ever stand trial for establishing ROE which were a de facto extermination order? Are we going to simply excuse summary execution by administrative decision?

-I believe that to be true
-nobody in govt cared because if the type of people they were

 

[voidsherpa]

Nope. They paid him so they didn't have to admit liability.

So he killed a US Marshall, and they paid him out a settlement. How is that a "Nope"?

 

[HoughMade]

Had the internet been more widely available before April 19, 1995, I feel like I know what some of the posts in various forums would look like.

 

[IndyDave1776]

-I believe that to be true
-nobody in govt cared because if the type of people they were

Because of the type of people they were...you do realize that according to DHS, I am a terrorist in spite of my criminal activities being limited to traffic violations? So, should I consider it a reasonable expectation to suppose that Lon and I may find ourselves trading lead some day? If so, should I consider it right and proper because I am not a good little sheep and ingest their narrative? After all, when any ONE of being a veteran (which I am not), supporting adherence to the Constitution, supporting the Second Amendment, opposing illegal immigration, opposing abortion, or believing in the Second Coming of Christ (all the remainder of which apply) makes you a terrorist per DHS official documents.

The idea of summary execution for holding politically incorrect beliefs doesn't disturb you, especially given that what constitutes politically incorrect can be, well, fluid?