Ignoring gender?

[Dead Duck]

I'm so confused

 

[ModernGunner]

So which are you-- a scientist or a doctor?

You don't need to be either to recognize a delusion.

You don't need to be either to have an opinion, but that's what it is-- an opinion.

But that's the point, Snap. It IS opinion. It's ALL opinion, even if that opinion comes from "a scientist or a doctor".

Quite often, all too often, really, people cite opinion as fact. They'll cite some 'study' or other, even though that 'study' is simply the opinion (or the agenda) of the author of the study. While such an error is prevalent, it's still unacceptable.

There is no empirical (2 apples + 2 apples = 4 apples) evidence or 'proof' of the issue. Nor is there any "complete agreement" or even "consensus", not even from scientists and / or doctors. The issue isn't 'proven' because it can't be proven.

It's the opinion of some, but only of some. They may be "Joe Lunchbox" folks (of which I consider myself, so nothing disparaging in that), or scientists, or doctors. But that does not mean they're correct. They're just providing their opinion on the matter.

Scientists and doctors are just as wrong, and just as often, as any and all other specified groups. Therefore, ALL opinions are equally valid.

Similarly, there's the equal possibility that someone DOES understand the issue and still 'mocks' it for their own, personal reason(s). That's equally as valid, as well.

 

[Redtbird]

Wow... A lot of the messages in this thread mirror the comments one sees when an article on Transgender people is published on the 'Net.

But if I were to add anything else to this message the tread would be closed and I would be booted off INGO.

I'm going to go look at something else.

Nite all!

 

[femurphy77]

never mind

 

[Snapdragon]

If I remember correctly, there are 5 factors used to determine gender.

1. Chromosomes
2. External anatomy (penis/vagina)
3. Hormone types
4. Internal anatomy (uterus/prostate)
5. Gonads vs. ovaries

Human beings are born with a variety of combinations of these factors. Boiling it down to your 'plumbing' or your chromosomes is over-simplifying the issue.

Additionally, I think that there is a sixth factor: emotions and personality. Knowing that people can be born with any combination of 1-5, is it really so unbelievable that a man could be born with the emotions, personality, and preferences of a woman?

As a Christian, it would be simpler for me to say "No, that's not possible". But knowing that mixing up #1-5 is possible, I'm not sure I can make that argument.

Wish I could rep you.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Belongs in the "facepalm" thread.

Catering to mental illness, that's cute.

 

[Snapdragon]

Belongs in the "facepalm" thread.

Catering to mental illness, that's cute.

Mental illness? Are you ****ing serious?

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Mental illness? Are you ****ing serious?

Yes, I consider "gender identity" situations to be mental illness. That's my opinion.

Just a bunch of Tumblrista/SJW narcissists.

Edit: And maybe we're talking about different things. I read the first page, then I skipped the next 8 pages. I'm talking about the "today I consider myself a woman. Tomorrow I consider myself Bi. The next day I'm a man. The next day I think I'm a wolf-kin" sort of mentality.

 

[chezuki]

Wish I could rep you.

Got him for ya. I think we're in the minority here, but I'm not really surprised given the topic.

 

[gstanley102]

"Evidence suggests that people who identify with a gender different from the one they were assigned at birth may do so not just due to psychological or behavioral causes, but also biological ones related to their genetics, the makeup of their brains, or prenatal exposure to hormones.[SUP][1]" Heylens, G; De Cuypere, G; Zucker, K; Schelfaut, C; Elaut, E; Vanden Bossche, H; De Baere, E; T'Sjoen, G (2012). "Gender Identity Disorder in Twins: A Review of the Case Report Literature". The Journal of Sexual Medicine 8 (3): 751–757. doi:10.1111/j.1743-6109.2011.02567.[/SUP]

It's more than just a delusion.

Can't be any more than a delusion.

Any feminist will tell you males and females are identical in every respect.

 

[Vigilant]

All this intellectual posting has thrown me into menopause! . . . Don't judge me!!

Wait, what? With you, wouldn't it be MINIpause!? Ya know, midget strippers and such?

 

[AA&E]

Agree or disagree with the policy, but please don't mock the gender identity issue itself simply because you don't understand it.

I'd suggest at the ages involved with the Girl Scout enrollment, these children don't understand it either.

 

[AA&E]

Unless an individual is born with some type of physical ambiguity, they are what their "plumbing" says they are.
If they suffer from the DELUSION that they're the opposite gender, they need help in the same way that all other types of delusions are dealt with, not the rest of us making believe with them that their delusion is reality.
This world has lost it's mind!

Amen. These children are being lead to this conclusion in some form or another. You can't convince me children that haven't even reached PUBERTY yet.. and therefore lack the hormonal makeup that separates men and women, are figuring out all on their own that they were really supposed to be a "whatever"...

 

[AA&E]

You don't need to be either to have an opinion, but that's what it is-- an opinion.

As is yours..

 

[Birds Away]

This thread could become a target rich environment for the trusty banhammer.

 

[chezuki]

I'd suggest at the ages involved with the Girl Scout enrollment, these children don't understand it either.

At what age did you understand your gender?

 

[AA&E]

A male born child with male genetalia being clinically altered to prevent this male from going through puberty and becoming a man......seems legit.....and ethical.....

And we call Islamic practitioners savages for female mutilations? I don't have an issue with someone reaching adulthood and making these decisions after they've had the opportunity to grow and make rational decisions. Children are not rational beings. They should not be entrusted to make life altering decisions of this magnitude.

 

[Birds Away]

At what age did you understand your gender?

I don't really understand either gender.

 

[Snapdragon]

And we call Islamic practitioners savages for female mutilations? I don't have an issue with someone reaching adulthood and making these decisions after they've had the opportunity to grow and make rational decisions. Children are not rational beings. They should not be entrusted to make life altering decisions of this magnitude.

The topic in the OP is not reassignment surgery. It's gender identification.

 

[AA&E]

At what age did you understand your gender?

Understand it? I knew I was born a boy early on. But is that enough of an understanding to make such an enormous change in your life? It goes far beyond that. To be chemically altering someone's hormonal makeup before their bodies even have the opportunity to come into it's own... strikes me as medically unethical. Kids have all kinds of phases they go through in life. I knew a girl that experimented with homosexuality in junior/senior high school. Today she is happily married and has 2 children and zero attraction to women. Life altering and possibly permanently damaging choices should not be something we allow youth to jump into without the maturity levels required to make rational decisions. Some of these children are preteen for god's sake...