If you had this option would you take it?

[oldfb]

Anyone that fails to plan has the potential to harm us all. Shouting doesn't make your inability to see this any less obvious!

I don't sell any products but when I did hardly anyone wanted to see reality either which is why they forced social security down our throats.

So ignore me all you want but enjoy getting butt slammed if something happens to you if you are someone that doesn't cover all their bases.

I did plan for all contingency outcomes and still found myself and family hurting.

Please understand I am not in favor of social security. I'm just telling people that complaints don't pay the bills and neither does SSDI or SS retirement.

Sorry if it hurts you but it needed to be said!

;-)

Just ignore him, he's trying to sell insurance and he's pissed off that no one wants to buy it. Basically, he has a product that no one wants and somehow it's THEIR fault when in fact HE'S the one selling a crappy product.

I was going to purple-ize this but screw it. No sugar coating here.

Look, oldfb, I see your point with all the talk about planning etc. etc. Here's the deal. You think young people should pay into this system, for whatever reasons. I'm sure you have good intentions.

But what gives YOU the right to dictate how other people spend their money and how they do or do not plan for their own future?!

I take pretty much the same stance on every "issue" that people are fighting about be it this, gay marriage, abortion, whatever- If it doesn't directly involve YOU/YOUR FAMILY and does not cause you ONE DAMN BIT OF HARM- then it's NOT YOUR BUSINESS.

I appologize for coming out this way but I felt I had to say it. Take care.

 

[oldfb]

Dude! That only works if you survive til retirement before you need it so please cover your butt one-way or the other is all I really care about because retirement is only the benefit for savings and investment if nothing happens before it grows over time.I will stop beating this horse when everyone admits that something needs to be done rather than betting on it never happening to them.

Could definitely put my money to better use by saving or investing in very safe assets.
The way i see things i would not get back nearly what i put in any ways and what if i die the day after i start drawing or even if i would die before that money is gone sucka!
I say let me keep my money and let the old guy suffer that didnt plan ahead

 

[oldfb]

This should be the opt out clause.

I being of sound mind declare that the system is broken and I want nothing to do with it.

I will keep my money and use it to protect myself from becoming a burden to the common good of all citizens.

If I fail to plan for any potential happenstance I vow to kill myself before I accept any form of stolen or forced charity.

If no one will willingly support me before I reach my retirement fund payout through their own free will. I authorize everyone to leave me to die and my family to fend for themselves.

If myself or dependents attempt to steal or apply for welfare I authorize an organized death squad to eliminate them like the parasites they have become.

Everyone signs this to opt out and I've got no problem with you buying boogers instead of having the social security system or any other Program that is forced on us.

 

[powerstrokin]

My insurance statement was basically an analogy, oldfb. Not in the literal sense that you're still an insurance salesman.

You say you don't care if people want to opt out because you want yours- that's all fine and dandy and that's the point (I guess) of the thread- you do whatever you think is necessary- but everyone else shouldn't be forced into it.

You keep talking about this blood oath in lieu of opting in- I really don't understand where you're coming from on that one. I can tell you that I don't plan on being a "burden" to the rest of you in the event I need services.

I understand you trying to inspire us younger folks to make good decisions for ourselves based on ones you made in the past that might not have worked out. I for one appreciate the effort- but please leave it at a suggestion instead of trying to strongarm us.

Your mention of your 1st amendment is unnecessary here. You're preaching to the choir.

You said-
"Opt out please! Just plan better like you all proposed you would.
That way my tax dollars don't have to be used for welfare and I can keep more of our income towards our family if something happens to you."

That's precicely why I for one would prefer to opt out! So that I can keep more of my income for me and my family!! We agree on that part.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say about the taxes for rape crisis paragraph.

I am not trolling, nor am I trying to manipulate your words.

As for your last post about "unfair taxes affect everyone and everything"- You say I don't understand that, but I do. Oh I do.

In my opinion, Sir, YOU are the one on the high horse here. I'm not calling for you to dismount, but damn man.

Please note, again, I am not trying to start a war with you. I'm sure in a face to face conversation this would go smoother as text doesn't transmit emotion very well.

 

[oldfb]

You say you don't plan to be a burden.

Without a plan for you and your family you will be a burden if anything you didn't cover.

Actually that wasn't an analogy about the insurance bit.
That was a genuine attempt to discredit me in absence of a valid point that my previous statement is valid.

I'm brow beating everyone because even the people of my generation and before haven't planned either which is why we even have this ugly beast.

This is why I failed in insurance sales because no one wants to hear that fact.

So again opt out or in but fix the damn system.

You see I believe instead of air bags being mandatory there should be a highly honed and sharpened spike attached to the center of steering wheels.
I bet seatbelts would be worn then and people would start driving much safer.

This of course explains my penchant for the blood oath.

Finally anyone that knows me from here knows that I don't do purple for sarcasm.

Obviously because I leave it up to the discretion of you the reader. If something I say pisses you off. Just assume it was in purple font color.

Trust me it will be much easier on us both. And I won't have to keep coming back to thrash you.

My insurance statement was basically an analogy, oldfb. Not in the literal sense that you're still an insurance salesman.

You say you don't care if people want to opt out because you want yours- that's all fine and dandy and that's the point (I guess) of the thread- you do whatever you think is necessary- but everyone else shouldn't be forced into it.

You keep talking about this blood oath in lieu of opting in- I really don't understand where you're coming from on that one. I can tell you that I don't plan on being a "burden" to the rest of you in the event I need services.

I understand you trying to inspire us younger folks to make good decisions for ourselves based on ones you made in the past that might not have worked out. I for one appreciate the effort- but please leave it at a suggestion instead of trying to strongarm us.

Your mention of your 1st amendment is unnecessary here. You're preaching to the choir.

You said-
"Opt out please! Just plan better like you all proposed you would.
That way my tax dollars don't have to be used for welfare and I can keep more of our income towards our family if something happens to you."

That's precicely why I for one would prefer to opt out! So that I can keep more of my income for me and my family!! We agree on that part.

I'm not sure what you're trying to say about the taxes for rape crisis paragraph.

I am not trolling, nor am I trying to manipulate your words.

As for your last post about "unfair taxes affect everyone and everything"- You say I don't understand that, but I do. Oh I do.

In my opinion, Sir, YOU are the one on the high horse here. I'm not calling for you to dismount, but damn man.

Please note, again, I am not trying to start a war with you. I'm sure in a face to face conversation this would go smoother as text doesn't transmit emotion very well.

 

[oldfb]

Btw I got mine literally because I was forced to apply by my insurance carrier before they would pay my long term disability claim.

Which is why I originally stated that everyone complains about it but when something goes wrong they scramble to get theirs which is the only tangible outcome without your own personal policy not one through work. Which falls under ERISA laws if you know the difference between private group and corporate group plans.

Corporate plans are wicked easy to be denied since you cannot Sue them directly without going through federal courts.

So imagine buying Long term disability insurance for 50% of your income and having to pay a lawyer a third just to get them to pay what they contracted for.

 

[kjf48197]

Lmao I want to see how well you have managed what you do get to keep.

Sorry but unless you have all your ducks in a row and are prepared for ever eventuality you are one injury away from being a welfare slob too.

Of course people disabled generally don't get welfare they collect from a forced system and whatever personal insurance they have purchased, planned and sacrificed for.

Many while raising a family and working their elbows off.

That attitude is why I say ignorance is bliss.

Ignorance is not planning ahead for anything. I do have all of my ducks in a row. As far as attitute goes, it is my money the fed lives on and WE all should have more of a say on what, who, and how it is spent instead of the give it to whoever wants some gets some way we are doing it now. Haven't you heard we are in debt because of entitlements more than any other reason.

 

[oldfb]

Ignorance is not planning ahead for anything. I do have all of my ducks in a row. As far as attitute goes, it is my money the fed lives on and WE all should have more of a say on what, who, and how it is spent instead of the give it to whoever wants some gets some way we are doing it now. Haven't you heard we are in debt because of entitlements more than any other reason.

Kj, that was never in question about everything you said above. I have agreed with that adnauseum.

What is in contention is the gaping hole left if for some reason the person gets sick enough that they are unable to keep funding their own personal plan to retirement in the beginning which is a high enough potential for reality.

In the three game of life you have your long gun and shotgun but when the zombies get in close you reach for your trusted pistol and find out that you only have one magazine to last the match.

Until every swinging knuckle dragger that I meet concedes the point of this glaring oversight I must keep reminding them because I am acting as the safety officer /score keeper.

Why?

Because I don't want anyone else to find out all of this after it is too late.

Instead of becoming argumentative over my alleged love of the system. I hope some people wise up and find the holes in their plans before it is too late.

Too often we say there isn't enough income to do this while we spend more than we should on one part and neglect the other because the odds aren't high enough.

Death is 100% guaranteed and I heard every excuse not to buy life insurance by guys that had enough money to pour lead down range with a hose. So there was no way I was even going to get in the door let alone sell him disability insurance.

Then he blows out his knee shoveling the driveway and loses his house because he couldn't work for six months so he lost his health insurance because he couldn't pay the cobra payment when he found out he had to keep paying all of those deductions even while off work.

If this is totally inconceivable to anyone then that is on them.

Except it isn't because that person will then be scrambling for every entitlement they can get which overtaxes the already crappy system.

Fair enough?

Clear as mud?

 

[oldfb]

Oh and an apology from whomever called me a slob that has never worked harder than he had on his paper route.

Because he lumped me in with the welfare people that don't want to work instead of couldn't work due to illness or injury.

Broad strokes from misinformed folks really frost my nuts.

Good luck people!

Be well!

 

[powerstrokin]

If everyone pays $100 for life insurance, and everyone is guaranteed to die eventually, and life insurance pays out $150 per person, how is that sustainable? Where is the money coming from? Am I missing something?

The entire monetary system is flawed. Every single thing. It's all BS. If the entire world had a monetary value of $100, and a single loan was made with interest, then the entire world would be in debt forever because the "interest" never existed in the first place since the entire world only had $100 to begin with.

If I choose not to have insurance and something happens and I cannot afford more care, then I will not GET more care. If I die, I don't need life insurance. Whoever wants my crap can have it and sell it or do whatever they want. It won't be necessary to pay for completely stupid services such as funeral, burial, or cremation because it's unnecessary. Drive me out to the woods somewhere and dump my body. Mother nature will reclaim me and plants and wild life will benefit from my decomposing body and the cycle will start all over. That's the way it was all intended to work. The best part is that it would be extremely cheap/free. See, I'm thinking about making life easier for my survivors already!

The mess we are all in came about thousands of years ago when man decided to trade meaningless shiny metal for things of real value such as food and water.

When the SHTF and we've all got guns and ammo, and you've got gold, and I've got food, you'll be going hungry if you try to trade me your worthless shiny metal for my life sustaining food. You can purchase my food with your hard work helping me grow more food and shoot more tasty animals.

Anyways, I probably won't be purchasing any insurance today Sir. I'd rather have fun while I'm young and TRY to enjoy life right now. If I die young because I get sick and die, at least I'll have had fun doing it. No sense in trying to live as long as possible and not having all the fun you can because eventually, we all die anyways.

Peace.

 

[oldfb]

Lmfao

That shiny metal stuff in your pocket was salt in Roman times.

The investments made by insurance companies is how they sustain the death benefits.

That $100 scenario is exactly how we ended up with the federal reserve system that is so complicated and corrupted.

We carry money or a standard of currency because it is too hard to carry a days labor in your pockets and you might not need more labor but you might need brass, copper, gunpowder, tobacco, alcohol or fresh snot that mommy can wipe from your nose for you.lol

Finally you admitted that it is all too complicated and you'd rather have beer and pizza (guns) than be totally responsible for yourself.

That's ok thanks to that attitude we have social security which is mandatory and Sucky while being overburdened.

Atta boy chief big smoke!

Party on Garth!

A most excellent discussion and exercise in futility.

We stopped chucking bodies everywhere because of diseases and as a way for the undertakers to make a living as well.

 

[powerstrokin]

What is your point? You think that just because your monetary affairs will be in a different state then mine, you're somehow better than me?

I would appreciate it if you didn't talk down to me like I'm six years old. I can and do take care of myself. What's good for you may not be good for me or anyone else.

Just because I don't buy into the way society is like you do, does not mean that I'll take advantage of every program there is and rob you of yours. That's not who I am.

People seem to think that just because it's 2012, we have shiny new electronics, and we wear fancy clothes that we're somehow above it all. We are animals. We are no better than any other group of people on Earth, or any other animal species. I'd be willing to bet everything that people down in South America who wear loin cloths and have no contact with the rest of the world live a happier and more fulfilling life than we do.

I'm sure you think I'm just some bum who would do anything to screw over someone if it meant I'd gain something. That's absolute BS.

That's all I've got. I have no reason to explain myself any further to you. It's clear to me that you do not care.

 

[oldfb]

What is your point? You think that just because your monetary affairs will be in a different state then mine, you're somehow better than me?

I would appreciate it if you didn't talk down to me like I'm six years old. I can and do take care of myself. What's good for you may not be good for me or anyone else.

Just because I don't buy into the way society is like you do, does not mean that I'll take advantage of every program there is and rob you of yours. That's not who I am.

People seem to think that just because it's 2012, we have shiny new electronics, and we wear fancy clothes that we're somehow above it all. We are animals. We are no better than any other group of people on Earth, or any other animal species. I'd be willing to bet everything that people down in South America who wear loin cloths and have no contact with the rest of the world live a happier and more fulfilling life than we do.

I'm sure you think I'm just some bum who would do anything to screw over someone if it meant I'd gain something. That's absolute BS.

That's all I've got. I have no reason to explain myself any further to you. It's clear to me that you do not care.

Wow! Seriously! Seriously?
Those are your last plays?

Playing butt hurt.
Taking your marbles and going home.

Man if you really got that I think anything other than whom you have portrayed yourself to be here.

Ok then my fellow human being I leave you with this small notion for you and anyone else that believes that we are no different than any other animaI.
I leave you with this fact.

We can beg for mercy and give mercy.

This is why we are, not only different but better than any other animals on this planet.

Which I offer you now.

 

[kjf48197]

Kj, that was never in question about everything you said above. I have agreed with that adnauseum.

What is in contention is the gaping hole left if for some reason the person gets sick enough that they are unable to keep funding their own personal plan to retirement in the beginning which is a high enough potential for reality.

In the three game of life you have your long gun and shotgun but when the zombies get in close you reach for your trusted pistol and find out that you only have one magazine to last the match.

Until every swinging knuckle dragger that I meet concedes the point of this glaring oversight I must keep reminding them because I am acting as the safety officer /score keeper.

Why?

Because I don't want anyone else to find out all of this after it is too late.

Instead of becoming argumentative over my alleged love of the system. I hope some people wise up and find the holes in their plans before it is too late.

Too often we say there isn't enough income to do this while we spend more than we should on one part and neglect the other because the odds aren't high enough.

Death is 100% guaranteed and I heard every excuse not to buy life insurance by guys that had enough money to pour lead down range with a hose. So there was no way I was even going to get in the door let alone sell him disability insurance.

Then he blows out his knee shoveling the driveway and loses his house because he couldn't work for six months so he lost his health insurance because he couldn't pay the cobra payment when he found out he had to keep paying all of those deductions even while off work.

If this is totally inconceivable to anyone then that is on them.

Except it isn't because that person will then be scrambling for every entitlement they can get which overtaxes the already crappy system.

Fair enough?

Clear as mud?

Holes can only be filled by saving money and buying the right kind of insurance. My lump sum payment from the Fed would cover that and never paying into it again would help get me and mine to a debt free life soon. I then would be no burden on anyone and I can say that 99% of the people I know are in the same boat as me. And yes we all have kids wives hobbies and investments all of wich would be a lot better without that SS tax.
How's that for clear as mud!

 

[MMRUSH]

This is an unfair pole. At my younger age I would say F* you old people and opt out. How is it a fair option when we are 2 generations behind on the payments for SS.

Lmao no one is behind on payments our government stole the money. Your right you are young! I would opt out.

 

[oldfb]

Kj that would be the perfect solution and I commend you for it!

Few problems though.

That only works for people that have paid in enough to get the lump sum pay out.

And unfortunately there hasn't been any real money in the fund since Reagan stripped it out and shoveled in a bunch of iou's.

And lastly what will happen to all the fools who don't fund the plan with the pay out but instead buy whatever shiny baubles catch their eyes.

Which brings me back to the blood oath and death squads.

Because I do not want to feel guilty because of those fools.

I believe there even was a children's story about the little creature that had partied all summer instead of gathering supplies for the winter and ended up having to live with his friend or starve in the winter.

So I agree with you but hold very little hope of the masses doing what it takes to survive.

This has nothing to do with age, race or political bend but instead my knowledge and experience with human nature.

I am sure we could hammer out a plan that would work for us but unfortunately greed would win out with most of the country and inflation would sky rocket with the huge influx of worthless dollars flooding the economy.

 

[Bill B]

I am out. As a railroad employee I don't pay into ss, I pay into railroad retirement which means I pay more than I would in ss, but I get more back at the end. Oh, our system is solvent, and the taxes will change to keep it that way.

 

[oldfb]

Lmao no one is behind on payments our government stole the money. Your right you are young! I would opt out.

Don't do this! Don't tease him because he is right just a little confused about how it happened.

I have tried very hard not to insult people while pushing this talk or discussion in a direction that may just save a few families from disaster.

Don't just belittle someone over their age.

That just smacks of elitism.

This problem is going to take hard serious thinking to solve and commitment to a plan that works instead of a pie in the sky opt out and live for the day mentality.

Because the next forced plan could be much worse.

 

[oldfb]

I am out. As a railroad employee I don't pay into ss, I pay into railroad retirement which means I pay more than I would in ss, but I get more back at the end. Oh, our system is solvent, and the taxes will change to keep it that way.

People at inland thought their plan was solvent too and look where that got them with the PBGC and as for 401k's being robbed, don't you mean your 201k?

I don't doubt somewhere someone is frothing over getting their hands on those.

I hazard that the progressive left are literally juicing their panties over it.

 

[qmikep]

Lmfao

That shiny metal stuff in your pocket was salt in Roman times.

The investments made by insurance companies is how they sustain the death benefits.

That $100 scenario is exactly how we ended up with the federal reserve system that is so complicated and corrupted.

We carry money or a standard of currency because it is too hard to carry a days labor in your pockets and you might not need more labor but you might need brass, copper, gunpowder, tobacco, alcohol or fresh snot that mommy can wipe from your nose for you.lol

Finally you admitted that it is all too complicated and you'd rather have beer and pizza (guns) than be totally responsible for yourself.

That's ok thanks to that attitude we have social security which is mandatory and Sucky while being overburdened.

Atta boy chief big smoke!

Party on Garth!

A most excellent discussion and exercise in futility.

We stopped chucking bodies everywhere because of diseases and as a way for the undertakers to make a living as well.

No it is not.