Fight for $15...

[Vigilant]

Good workers work fast food as a stop between real jobs or their first job.

This wins the interwebz! And is exactly the point, good workers don't stay at minimum wage, they move on to better! Paying better FF wages isn't going to keep a good worker from moving on to better themselves, but it will keep a bad worker there until someone else says they don't make enough and we should raise the minimum again!

 

[Robjps]

One last point, and I will try to shut up! Everyone loves bashing Walmart for it's low wages. I posit, from PERSONAL, first hand experience, that if you work for Walmart more than a few years, and still make barely above minimum, YOU just might be the problem! I worked for them for a few years in the mid 90's, was paid well, EARNED advancement, and when I graduated college, left them making ~$30K, and had about $60K in stock(thanks to the GI Bill allowing me to divert as much salary into the matching stock program as possible, but that's another story!). I made minimum wage for about 6 mos. before being promoted, and after 1.5 was in their management training program. My store manager made 6 figures! Initiative will work WAAY better than b******g about low wages and not doing something to better yourself!

I worked at Wal-Mart when i was 20. Another good example of people that have no place being employed ruining the pay for the people that actually work. I worked overnight stocking and out of the GM side 5 guys 2 girls did all the work while a bunch of other people collected pay checks.

My assistant managers took good care of me in a year and a half i received $3.50 in raises and that was a decade ago. But imagine if those 7 workers actually got paid to sum of the 20.

 

[Robjps]

This wins the interwebz! And is exactly the point, good workers don't stay at minimum wage, they move on to better! Paying better FF wages isn't going to keep a good worker from moving on to better themselves, but it will keep a bad worker there until someone else says they don't make enough and we should raise the minimum again!

And you skipped the rest of my post. They would stay if you paid them. Company would save money customers would get a better product/service. You just have to be willing to fire failures.

 

[Vigilant]

I worked at Wal-Mart when i was 20. Another good example of people that have no place being employed ruining the pay for the people that actually work. I worked overnight stocking and out of the GM side 5 guys 2 girls did all the work while a bunch of other people collected pay checks.

My assistant managers took good care of me in a year and a half i received $3.50 in raises and that was a decade ago. But imagine if those 7 workers actually got paid to sum of the 20.

Are you saying that you were NOT one of those seven good workers, but advanced anyway?

 

[Vigilant]

And you skipped the rest of my post. They would stay if you paid them. Company would save money customers would get a better product/service. You just have to be willing to fire failures.

I didn't skip it, my point is good workers will ALWAYS move on to better themselves, whether it be up in fast food to management or ownership, or on to better things more suited for them after they got "entry level" job experience!

 

[Kutnupe14]

I didn't skip it, my point is good workers will ALWAYS move on to better themselves, whether it be up in fast food to management or ownership, or on to better things more suited for them after they got "entry level" job experience!

This is false.

 

[Robjps]

Are you saying that you were NOT one of those seven good workers, but advanced anyway?

I was, and my bosses took care of me by doing what they could to keep me as long as possible. Changed primary and secondary job codes, merit raises, max yearly, promotion. But you are missing (dodging) the point. If I'm doing all work i want the whole pie not just a larger slice.

 

[Vigilant]

And you skipped the rest of my post. They would stay if you paid them. Company would save money customers would get a better product/service. You just have to be willing to fire failures.

My wife serves at a large chain restaurant for $2.13 an hour. She worked 8 hours Saturday, 5 hours Sunday, and 4 hours Monday, so, 17 hours total and brought home $480 cash! That's $28.24 per hour without the $2.13 all for being a good employee and working! Another server who put in more hours, but is a lackluster performer made about $180. It's about what you personally put in, not about what someone gives you to do it!

 

[Vigilant]

I was, and my bosses took care of me by doing what they could to keep me as long as possible. Changed primary and secondary job codes, merit raises, max yearly, promotion. But you are missing (dodging) the point. If I'm doing all work i want the whole pie not just a larger slice.

I agree, that's why I started my own business now the pie is mine unless I don't work it, and the reason I want the government out of my business and my wallet! I'm not dodging, bad workers are bad workers, paying them more, makes them more expensive bad workers!

 

[Vigilant]

This is false.

I disagree, a good worker will always move to better themselves, whether it be up or out!

 

[oldpink]

Cm, this is an old article. I don't have time to do my D&D to see if it is still ongoing. They started doing this back in 2003 or 2004.......... http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/11/technology/11fast.html?_r=0


BTW........Is a multi-plex machine the one that tries to make it as it is ordered? Drops the cup and conveyors it around? Them seem to always mess up at my McDonalds......looks like it takes a lot of human interaction to keep them functioning.

I used to service commercial beverage equipment, primarily for McD's (but also for Donato's, Boston Market, and Chipotles), including those machines, and you have your terminology a bit confused.
The machine called a Multiplex is the system (made by Manitowoc) in the back of the store that carbonates the water, chills the water and syrup (they run through separate lines and mix at the nozzle on the dispenser), and recirculates the carbonated water to keep it chilled.
The other machine that you're talking about, the one that automatically dispenses the drinks, is called an ABS (Automated Beverage System...made by Cornelius, btw), and it does indeed get the order electronically, first pulling down a cup to be filled, then dropping the ice (or not if no ice is requested), pouring the drink, then indexing it the front for the employees to put a lid on it and hand it out the window.
They must be recalibrated for the syrup/carbonated water mix ratio either every six or four months for each of the drinks that it can dispense, which generally took me about ten minutes if I could do it uninterrupted, or thirty minutes if I had to deal with a difficult manager.
The ABS is actually a very reliable machine that, while very expensive (somewhere north of 50 bills), is easily the single biggest money maker in the whole store, since McD's makes 70%-80% of their profits from soft drinks, and at least 70% of that goes right through the driveup window that the machine serves.
It's because of the money that the ABS generates that the managers are super particular about it, and they don't like even a minute of downtime, even when it's getting its essential routine service, a constant source of heartburn for guys who do what I had to do.
It also replaces a couple of employees...no one calling in "sick" because he wanted to go run around with his friends and such.
I generally only had to occasionally replace the little spring fingers that held the cups in their tubes, the rubber finger grips, or (rarely) the nozzle.
Manitowoc is based in Sellersburg, btw.

 

[Kutnupe14]

I disagree, a good worker will always move to better themselves, whether it be up or out!

Some very, very good worker simply lack the drive to better themselves. I've seen it, you've seen, we've all seen it. A good employee doesn't always want to better themslves; wage doesn't really factor into that belief. You've never worked with a guy/gal that does an excellent job, and could probably excel in a position with more responsibility, but they forgo it because they lack confidence, or are simply happy not being responsible for more than they already have?

 

[Vigilant]

Some very, very good worker simply lack the drive to better themselves. I've seen it, you've seen, we've all seen it. A good employee doesn't always want to better themslves; wage doesn't really factor into that belief. You've never worked with a guy/gal that does an excellent job, and could probably excel in a position with more responsibility, but they forgo it because they lack confidence, or are simply happy not being responsible for more than they already have?

Touché, but that is more the exception than the rule! I myself was in that position a few years ago because of comfort level. Went to work one day to open, and the locks were changed, so I took out my laptop, started calling customers, and now if I make minimum or no wage this week or next, it's my fault, but the employees still get paid!

 

[Vigilant]

I used to service commercial beverage equipment, primarily for McD's (but also for Donato's, Boston Market, and Chipotles), including those machines, and you have your terminology a bit confused.
The machine called a Multiplex is the system (made by Manitowoc) in the back of the store that carbonates the water, chills the water and syrup (they run through separate lines and mix at the nozzle on the dispenser), and recirculates the carbonated water to keep it chilled.
The other machine that you're talking about, the one that automatically dispenses the drinks, is called an ABS (Automated Beverage System...made by Cornelius, btw), and it does indeed get the order electronically, first pulling down a cup to be filled, then dropping the ice (or not if no ice is requested), pouring the drink, then indexing it the front for the employees to put a lid on it and hand it out the window.
They must be recalibrated for the syrup/carbonated water mix ratio either every six or four months for each of the drinks that it can dispense, which generally took me about ten minutes if I could do it uninterrupted, or thirty minutes if I had to deal with a difficult manager.
The ABS is actually a very reliable machine that, while very expensive (somewhere north of 50 bills), is easily the single biggest money maker in the whole store, since McD's makes 70%-80% of their profits from soft drinks, and at least 70% of that goes right through the driveup window that the machine serves.
It's because of the money that the ABS generates that the managers are super particular about it, and they don't like even a minute of downtime, even when it's getting its essential routine service, a constant source of heartburn for guys who do what I had to do.
It also replaces a couple of employees...no one calling in "sick" because he wanted to go run around with his friends and such.
I generally only had to occasionally replace the little spring fingers that held the cups in their tubes, the rubber finger grips, or (rarely) the nozzle.
Manitowoc is based in Sellersburg, btw.

Manitowoc is based in Manitowoc, WI as a matter of reference, they have manufacturing in Sellersburg. And Florida for the parent company

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Also true. Half the story, but true. There are no free lunches.

True. There are many reasons a company might decide to automate. Eliminating high costs associated with certain labor is definitely one. Others might include: the ability to get ready/reliable labor at all (ask the farmers); removing humans from hazardous jobs; ability to improve quality; improving productivity; are among the ones I can think of off the top of my head.

The other half of that equation is you are ALWAYS competing against automation. Technology only gets cheaper and more reliable. Ask the forklift operators and order pickers. Look at the MASSIVE change that resulted from farm machinery.

Automation can be an answer to a problem. There are some jobs it is easier and cheaper to use manual labor. It can cost a lot of money to make model year product changes to automation. With manual labor, you can change the job instruction, coach the guy/gal up a little, give them a new screwdriver, and get back into business. It's when the cost of that labor (and it doesn't necessarily mean just their hourly rate) gets high enough can you justify millions of dollars in fixture changes, plant rearrangements, purchasing and setting up of spare parts, facility renovations, etc. (Admittedly, often times the business case is strengthened by quality and productivity improvements but "removing heads" is always a key metric.

Just wait for the changes self driving cars will have on those who work in the transport industry.

It probably won't be all that long after self driving cars become common, that will start to become illegal to drive a car manually.

There is a certain amount of inevitability in all of this. Technology gets better, it displaces workers, there are fewer jobs, availability of labor goes up, wages go down, etc. etc. Artificial restraints on technology are counterproductive and simply leave those who implement them at a disadvantage against those who don't. The question is, how do we allow people to work and support themselves when more and more of the traditional fields for 'average' workers dry up and disappear. I'll now wait for someone to bring up "buggy whip makers".

One help would be to remove the government hindrances that keep people from creating their own work (businesses) and scaling back the programs that encourage people to not get going...necessity is the mother of invention. More government is usually not necessary, it can stifle innovaton, but no question when it comes to increasing the cost of doing business, it does drive ingenious ways to mitigate and avoid those costs.

 

[Robjps]

My wife serves at a large chain restaurant for $2.13 an hour. She worked 8 hours Saturday, 5 hours Sunday, and 4 hours Monday, so, 17 hours total and brought home $480 cash! That's $28.24 per hour without the $2.13 all for being a good employee and working! Another server who put in more hours, but is a lackluster performer made about $180. It's about what you personally put in, not about what someone gives you to do it!

You are making my case for me. Imagine if the cooks was paid to be fast and make quality food. Food quality and speed goes through the roof and the store gets more customers and your wife makes more money. If all your willing to pay is the minimum expect the bottom of the barrel.

I had family members asking me why i was willing to deliver pizzas. I walked them through the math i made $20 after taxes $15 a hour after factoring in Gas/insurance/maintenance etc... Not a bad job. No benefits tho. Me and a high school friend made bank while others made nothing because they didn't want to run them or wanted to leave early and not work weekends. Obamacare kicked in a i lost 25% of my hours and orders dropped off so i quit.

I had at length discussions with area and district managers about my manager to crew ratio's and unbelievably high average hourly cost per employee. My answers were always simple. I made labor didn't I? My times were good weren't they? And i make them managers so i can pay them more and they will stay.

 

[Vigilant]

You are making my case for me. Imagine if the cooks was paid to be fast and make quality food. Food quality and speed goes through the roof and the store gets more customers and your wife makes more money. If all your willing to pay is the minimum expect the bottom of the barrel.

I had family members asking me why i was willing to deliver pizzas. I walked them through the math i made $20 after taxes $15 a hour after factoring in Gas/insurance/maintenance etc... Not a bad job. No benefits tho. Me and a high school friend made bank while others made nothing because they didn't want to run them or wanted to leave early and not work weekends. Obamacare kicked in a i lost 25% of my hours and orders dropped off so i quit.

I had at length discussions with area and district managers about my manager to crew ratio's and unbelievably high average hourly cost per employee. My answers were always simple. I made labor didn't I? My times were good weren't they? And i make them managers so i can pay them more and they will stay.

At this particular chain, the cooks are compensated very well. Very few employees there make minimum wage, unless they want to, then, only for a few weeks.

 

[Vigilant]

You are making my case for me. Imagine if the cooks was paid to be fast and make quality food. Food quality and speed goes through the roof and the store gets more customers and your wife makes more money. If all your willing to pay is the minimum expect the bottom of the barrel.

I had family members asking me why i was willing to deliver pizzas. I walked them through the math i made $20 after taxes $15 a hour after factoring in Gas/insurance/maintenance etc... Not a bad job. No benefits tho. Me and a high school friend made bank while others made nothing because they didn't want to run them or wanted to leave early and not work weekends. Obamacare kicked in a i lost 25% of my hours and orders dropped off so i quit.

I had at length discussions with area and district managers about my manager to crew ratio's and unbelievably high average hourly cost per employee. My answers were always simple. I made labor didn't I? My times were good weren't they? And i make them managers so i can pay them more and they will stay.

Paying someone $15 an hour to push pictures on a screen and ask if you would like fries, ISN'T going to make them better employees! Forcing an employer to pay more than a job is worth helps no one.

 

[Robjps]

Some very, very good worker simply lack the drive to better themselves. I've seen it, you've seen, we've all seen it. A good employee doesn't always want to better themslves; wage doesn't really factor into that belief. You've never worked with a guy/gal that does an excellent job, and could probably excel in a position with more responsibility, but they forgo it because they lack confidence, or are simply happy not being responsible for more than they already have?

Another reason which personally affected me was having a family to support I couldn't afford the normal monthish paycheck gap between jobs. Also i loathe most salary jobs once you factor hours to pay ratio its usually not an upgrade.

 

[Vigilant]

I had family members asking me why i was willing to deliver pizzas. I walked them through the math i made $20 after taxes $15 a hour after factoring in Gas/insurance/maintenance etc... Not a bad job. No benefits tho. Me and a high school friend made bank while others made nothing because they didn't want to run them or wanted to leave early and not work weekends. Obamacare kicked in a i lost 25% of my hours and orders dropped off so i quit.

And this makes my point for me, in more than one way! Number one, YOU made bank because YOU were willing to work, not because of what they paid you per hour. Number two, .gov forcing an employer to do something benefits no one, whether it be Ocare, or minimum wage. Raise min wage, less min wage jobs available because an employer is going to try and cut costs somewhere to make up.