Felony?

[jsharmon7]

im saying from what im seeing right now yes he is wrong. if theres more to it then lets see it. what they are saying is hes right because there might be more to it that nobody has seen yet. get it?

I get it, I don't think you do though. I haven't seen anyone say what he did was right, just that we don't know anything about this incident beyond this short clip. Is there more to the story? Maybe, maybe not. I'm not going to pass judgment on somebody from the comfort of my chair based on a few seconds of video, but that's obviously your choice. See my earlier post about the treatment some Vietnam vets got when they returned home, a few seconds of video doesn't always show the whole story. Based on what I've seen of your opinion of the police though, I think you made a decision before you even saw the video.

To be honest with you, it looks bad from the video. But, I wasn't there and I'm not going to say he did the right thing or that he messed up. I don't know.

 

[groovatron]

Yep. I have a video, which I posted in the first post, which shows an officer hitting a tiny woman with a baton who was obviously not doing anything illegal, who was never convicted of anything with respect to this incident, etc. What's not self-explanatory about that fact?

Okay......may I ask you what difference it makes that she was a "tiny" and a "woman?" What if she was a fat bald guy? Would that make a difference?

Watching this video at first, favored the lady. Then I watched it 10 more times. She clearly states something along the lines of "f**king do it again." While she says this, she clearly makes a movement towards the LEO. Almost as if she was provoking him.

And like all the others have brought up......"Where is the other footage? " There had to be tons of cameras there. I would be a fool to believe everything I saw only 15 seconds of.

I ask you this DZ......If this was all the evidence presented in a court of law, don't you think it would be judged inconclusive?

 

[downzero]

Do you have evidence of this felony you keep yapping about?

No sir. The heavily edited video you posted is propaganda, not evidence. Now, if all you wish is to try to get others to share your frothing hatred of police officers, that's your business. Given your failure to provide those "other sources" you were blathering about, I suspect this is your true goal. However, an aspiring attorney should have more honor, and more respect for the law, than to continue making claims that he cannot support with fact.

So, do you have evidence of the claims you are making? None of the rest of us can tell what truly happened from the propaganda video you posted, and neither can you. So.... evidence?

It is an undisputed fact that this woman was struck by a police officer's baton. It is obvious from the video. Nobody has made any effort to hide it.

It is also indisputable that this woman was never convicted of any crime for any of her conduct that day.

These are facts. If you decide to interpret them differently when deciding whose conduct was criminal, then so be it.

But there's no propaganda there. You can think the video is skewed, and I might even agree with you. But to me it's irrelevant as to what happened before and after that cop struck the woman with the baton, because if I'd done the same to a domesticated animal, I'd be behind bars--whereas he is (more than likely) still on the force.

I really wonder why nobody is angry about the police doing this even when they are justified in doing so, because every single one of these incidents is a PR loss for a police department. Nothing good can come from such a demonstration of force unless it's absolutely necessary. And surely every single one of them perpetuates a fear and distrust of policing that undermines the credibility of every cop on the street--one that is largely unwarranted, I'd admit.

 

[Joe Williams]

It is an undisputed fact that this woman was struck by a police officer's baton. It is obvious from the video. Nobody has made any effort to hide it.

It is also indisputable that this woman was never convicted of any crime for any of her conduct that day.

snip.

None of which is evidence of the felony you continue to claim the officer committed. Do you have evidence to back up your repeated claims?

 

[hornadylnl]

Joe, do you trust the ATF as much as you trust the FBI?

 

[Joe Williams]

Joe, do you trust the ATF as much as you trust the FBI?

No. They have a long record of breaking the law. You know full well that I have no problem calling out the police when they are out of line. I see nothing in this thread sufficient to make an informed judgement one way or the other, and do not judge the police to automatically be wrong. See, while I'm willing to call cops out when they behave badly, I'm also perfectly willing to call out the cop hating bigots who consistently try to form lynch mobs over every move cops make.

 

[jbombelli]

How some of you think you can tell what happened before the video clip starts is beyond me. so you was there and know what he did was right? if we dont know what happened before the video clip how do you?

Can you read? Are you smarter than a 5th grader? If so, you might want to go back and read my post again, and this time TRY TO UNDERSTAND WHAT I SAID.

But in case you're NOT, let me clear it up for you. I DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENED PRIOR TO THE START OF THE VIDEO CLIP. I SAID AS MUCH IN MY POST.


And not knowing what happened prior that may be relevant to the the situation at hand, I can't make an informed judgment one way or the other as to who is right.

Nobody can watch a redacted video like THAT and form a REASONABLE conclusion as to what happened.

 

[groovatron]

snip

if I'd done the same to a domesticated animal, I'd be behind bars--whereas he is (more than likely) still on the force.

snip

LEO's can do many things that citizens cannot.

They can draw a weapon much more freely than a citizen. If I drew on a person like a cop may find necessary, I would go to jail.

They are allowed to speed and run red lights.

They can pull you over for speeding. Try doing that to someone, I bet you get in a bit of trouble.

They are allowed to "reasonably" detain you.

My point is, LEO's are afforded many actions that an average citizen is not. It is neccessary in order to fullfill the responsibilities of their job.

 

[serpicostraight]

I get it, I don't think you do though. I haven't seen anyone say what he did was right, just that we don't know anything about this incident beyond this short clip. Is there more to the story? Maybe, maybe not. I'm not going to pass judgment on somebody from the comfort of my chair based on a few seconds of video, but that's obviously your choice. See my earlier post about the treatment some Vietnam vets got when they returned home, a few seconds of video doesn't always show the whole story. Based on what I've seen of your opinion of the police though, I think you made a decision before you even saw the video.

To be honest with you, it looks bad from the video. But, I wasn't there and I'm not going to say he did the right thing or that he messed up. I don't know.

thats my point i wasnt there i dont know what all happened but everybody wants to vindicate the cop on what they didnt see and just make up every excuse in the book on what might have happened. im not going on what might have happened or what could have happened im going on what i see. and btw are you a vietnam vet? did you see or experience the behaviour you are talking about? i was at scott afb in 1973 and welcomed home several vets and pows and i never seen any of that there. not saying it didnt happen just that i didnt see it myself. if you have personal experience i would love to hear it.

 

[Benny]

I see nothing in this thread sufficient to make an informed judgement one way or the other, and do not judge the police to automatically be wrong. See, while I'm willing to call cops out when they behave badly, I'm also perfectly willing to call out the cop hating bigots who consistently try to form lynch mobs over every move cops make.

Damn, I'm out of rep...My sentiments exactly.

My point is, LEO's are afforded many actions that an average citizen is not. It is neccessary in order to fullfill the responsibilities of their job.

Why is this so hard to comprehend?

 

[downzero]

My point is, LEO's are afforded many actions that an average citizen is not. It is neccessary in order to fullfill the responsibilities of their job.

No, it's not necessary. We're just brainwashed into believing that's the case. There's no reason for a different standard. Police officers should be allowed to respond to force with force, just as anyone else. There's no reason to allow them to use any more force to get the job done than you would.

If anything, the standards should be higher for them because they know better. They're expected to.

None of which is evidence of the felony you continue to claim the officer committed. Do you have evidence to back up your repeated claims?

I'm pretty sure that I've thoroughly responded to your claims. I'm not saying reasonable minds can't differ, but if you can't understand my point, it's not me, it's you.

 

[Joe Williams]

snip
I'm pretty sure that I've thoroughly responded to your claims. I'm not saying reasonable minds can't differ, but if you can't understand my point, it's not me, it's you.

So... the answer is no?

 

[public servant]

Grind that axe.

 

[jbombelli]

So... the answer is no?

Correct. The answer is no. He can't back them up.

 

[hornadylnl]

No. They have a long record of breaking the law. You know full well that I have no problem calling out the police when they are out of line. I see nothing in this thread sufficient to make an informed judgement one way or the other, and do not judge the police to automatically be wrong. See, while I'm willing to call cops out when they behave
badly, I'm also perfectly willing to call out the
cop hating bigots who consistently try to
form lynch mobs over every move cops
make.

You are lambasting cop hating bigots yet you
condemn an entire agency for the actions of
a few bad ATF agents. I bet if one were to do a study on the percentage of bad ATF agents vs police departments, FBI, etc, the numbers wouldn't be much different.

I've seen what you said about the ATF on here in the past. Not every ATF agent was at Waco, Ruby Ridge, etc but that is enough for you to condemn an entire agency. Then you come here to trash the charactor of anyone who dares question the police. Consitency. Try it some time.

 

[groovatron]

Grind that axe.

But dad.....I just joined the party

 

[Benny]

I've seen what you said about the ATF on here in the past. Not every ATF agent was at Waco, Ruby Ridge, etc but that is enough for you to condemn an entire agency. Then you come here to trash the charactor of anyone who dares question the police. Consitency. Try it some time.

That was the entire agency's decision to go into Waco, Ruby Ridge, etc...Joe is talking about individual instances here.

Clearly there are bad apples in all walks of life, so we shouldn't expect LEOs to be any different, but it wasn't just one bad ATF agent that broke the law in the instances you mentioned, it was the agency that stuck there nose where it didn't belong.

 

[hornadylnl]

That was the ENTIRE agency's decision to go into Waco, Ruby Ridge, etc...Joe is talking about individual instances here.

Clearly there are bad apples in all walks of life, so we shouldn't expect LEOs to be any different, but it wasn't just one bad ATF agent that broke the law in the instances you mentioned, it was the agency.

So in states where they make it illegal to video traffic stops, we can hate on every cop who happens to work in that state?

I'm sure it was somebody higher up than the ATF who decided to send them in there.

 

[jsharmon7]

thats my point i wasnt there i dont know what all happened but everybody wants to vindicate the cop on what they didnt see and just make up every excuse in the book on what might have happened. im not going on what might have happened or what could have happened im going on what i see. and btw are you a vietnam vet? did you see or experience the behaviour you are talking about? i was at scott afb in 1973 and welcomed home several vets and pows and i never seen any of that there. not saying it didnt happen just that i didnt see it myself. if you have personal experience i would love to hear it.

Who is vindicating any cops? Who is making excuses on his behalf? All I see are people saying that there MAY be more to it than what is in that short video clip. And if you'd read the previous post I was alluding to, you wouldn't be asking the Vietnam question. You get an "F" for reading comprehension, for this whole thread.

 

[Whosyer]

Hey DZ, how 'bout them there links to "other media sources"? I find it odd that you have ignored repeated requests, from several individuals, for this enlightening information.