Coronovirus III

[tbhausen]

Third study finds vitamin D deficiency in covid-19 patients.



https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.24.20075838v1

Somewhere along the line I got the idea to start taking a D3 + K2 supplement… Might’ve been you.

 

[Dead Duck]

There used to be a Carly Simon song...I'm trying to think of the name...

You are absolutely right.

"You Know What To Do" - 1983
"The Right Thing To Do" - 1972


Wait - Oh I know....
"Nobody Does It Better" - 1977

[video=youtube;SaV-6qerkqI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaV-6qerkqI[/video]

 

[smokingman]

Somewhere along the line I got the idea to start taking a D3 + K2 supplement… Might’ve been you.

I take D,K,C,L-arginine,L-citrulline,l-tyrosone,CoQ10,resveratrol and a multi daily.
Taking extra C could not hurt anything. I posted awhile back a study about how this destroys red blood cells causing them to release toxic levels of iron into your blood.

Vitamin C is a great anti oxidant that helps mitigate that reaction. It also recommended for treatment of sepsis. If I do end up in the hospital with this I will ask for IV vitamin C. It was being used in China for almost all cases requiring hospitalization by mid February.


From Harvard Medical.
The idea that high-dose IV vitamin C might help in overwhelming infections is not new. A 2017 study found that high-dose IV vitamin C treatment (along with thiamine and corticosteroids) appeared to prevent deaths among people with sepsis, a form of overwhelming infection causing dangerously low blood pressure and organ failure. Another study published last year assessed the effect of high-dose vitamin C infusions among patients with severe infections who had sepsis and acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS), in which the lungs fill with fluid. While the study's main measures of improvement did not improve within the first four days of vitamin C therapy, there was a lower death rate at 28 days among treated patients. Though neither of these studies looked at vitamin C use in patients with COVID-19, the vitamin therapy was specifically given for sepsis and ARDS, and these are the most common conditions leading to intensive care unit admission, ventilator support, or death among those with severe COVID-19 infections.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/treatments-for-covid-19

 

[tbhausen]

You are absolutely right.

"You Know What To Do" - 1983
"The Right Thing To Do" - 1972


Wait - Oh I know....
"Nobody Does It Better" - 1977

[video=youtube;SaV-6qerkqI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaV-6qerkqI[/video]

Holy ****! What a voice, what a performance!

 

[tbhausen]

Taking extra C could not hurt anything. I posted awhile back a study about how this destroys red blood cells causing them to release toxic levels of iron into your blood.

Vitamin C is a great anti oxidant that helps mitigate that reaction. It also recommended for treatment of sepsis. If I do end up in the hospital with this I will ask for IV vitamin C. It was being used in China for almost all cases requiring hospitalization by mid February.


From Harvard Medical.
The idea that high-dose IV vitamin C might help in overwhelming infections is not new. A 2017 study found that high-dose IV vitamin C treatment (along with thiamine and corticosteroids) appeared to prevent deaths among people with sepsis, a form of overwhelming infection causing dangerously low blood pressure and organ failure. Another study published last year assessed the effect of high-dose vitamin C infusions among patients with severe infections who had sepsis and acute respiratory distress syndrome (ARDS), in which the lungs fill with fluid. While the study's main measures of improvement did not improve within the first four days of vitamin C therapy, there was a lower death rate at 28 days among treated patients. Though neither of these studies looked at vitamin C use in patients with COVID-19, the vitamin therapy was specifically given for sepsis and ARDS, and these are the most common conditions leading to intensive care unit admission, ventilator support, or death among those with severe COVID-19 infections.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/diseases-and-conditions/treatments-for-covid-19

I’m also taking a vitamin C supplement… Might’ve been you on that one, too. Both the supplements I’m taking are from Solaray. I’m also taking the Men’s One multivitamin from Rainbow Light. All good stuff.

Edit: you just have to not mind pissing the color of Mountain Dew.

 

[Dead Duck]

Ahhh....
Nothing like transparency.




"Up to 60 bodies found in U-Haul trucks outside NYC funeral home"


https://www.foxnews.com/health/dozens-of-bodies-found-u-haul-trucks-outside-nyc-funeral-home

 

[dusty88]

https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...u-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/

Interesting article about how flu deaths are compiled

Just one more illustration of how this is clearly worse than a typical flu

 

[nonobaddog]

https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...u-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/

Interesting article about how flu deaths are compiled

Just one more illustration of how this is clearly worse than a typical flu

So it is the flu deaths that are grossly exaggerated every year.
That almost makes me not trust the government.

 

[Ingomike]

I’m also taking a vitamin C supplement… Might’ve been you on that one, too. Both the supplements I’m taking are from Solaray. I’m also taking the Men’s One multivitamin from Rainbow Light. All good stuff.

Edit: you just have to not mind pissing the color of Mountain Dew.

Increase your water intake...

 

[foszoe]

Senate has like 6 people there.

OK, I'll pretend I was talking about the house. (In reality I didn't know that)

 

[ditcherman]

I have never been a germophobe.

One thing this disease has revealed clearly are talking points,media,and political influence on individuals opinions and thought processes.

You can clearly see opinions form when the latest headline is released.

Nothing has changed since I started warning everything that you considered normal was about not to be back in early February...other than the message being given to the public and the reactions from it.

Blame is still rampant. Fear of opening or staying closed. Knee jerk reactions to problems and a complete lack of clarity of our real situation.

What about things like the USA already being in a recession in Q4 of 2019? It was. To understand that all you have to do is look at the money velocity released by the Federal Reserve.

Many understand tiny pieces of the problems we face,and place blame at what ever source they think caused the problem.

It would be nice if politics where not involved,but of course that is now the driving force behind choices at most levels(politics and money).

I do not know what to say to someone who thinks this is the flu anymore. That is not the reality of the disease.

Time will correct that view I am certain,so it is no longer worth arguing.

It hasn’t been for a long time now, about 2 threads, 10,000 posts.

 

[ditcherman]

So it is the flu deaths that are grossly exaggerated every year.
That almost makes me not trust the government.

You’re catching on.

 

[smokingman]

remdesivir had no impact on viral load

I posted the first clinical trial of remdesivir that showed no clinical difference between it and placebo.

We saw Dr. Fauchi speak about it 4/29/2020 saying it did some good for patients in a clinical study.(about that https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...velation-of-gilead-drug-results-idUSKBN22C0KX)


I have now reviewed that study and am not sure why he thinks that.

https://emcrit.org/pulmcrit/wang-remdesivir/

"The most notable finding here might be the lack of any impact on viral load. Remdesivir’s mechanism of action is supposedly to reduce viral replication. If remdesivir is having any biological impact, this should be most easily detectable in terms of reduced viral titers (figure below). Lack of a signal here suggests that remdesivir has no biologically meaningful impact in these patients."

So we know another drug that does not work.If it does do anything it is doing so in a way we can not measure.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31022-9/fulltext


Here is John Hopkins view on case fatality rate,and a breakdown of it by age.

The CDC CFR break down of March data
Age Fatality rate
>85 10-27%
65-84 3-11%
55-64 1-3%
20-54 <1%
Current estimates suggest COVID-19 is ~6-10x worse than seasonal influenza but has a steep age gradient.

https://www.hopkinsguides.com/hopki.../540747/all/Coronavirus_COVID_19__SARS_CoV_2_

We have more drugs in clinical trials hopefully one of those will be more effective.


Indiana is sadly 4th in the USA in the percentage of increase in cases(through 4/29/2020). It is partly due to more testing to be sure.

 

[Thor]

Here's a good article on why we can't compare the Kung Flu to the regular flu. Actual counted cases of flu deaths (vs statistical chicanery) are less than 10k per year.

"The question remains. Can we accurately compare the toll of the flu to the toll of the coronavirus pandemic?



To do this, we have to compare counted deaths to counted deaths, not counted deaths to wildly inflated statistical estimates. If we compare, for instance, the number of people who died in the United States from COVID-19 in the second full week of April to the number of people who died from influenza during the worst week of the past seven flu seasons (as reported to the CDC), we find that the novel coronavirus killed between 9.5 and 44 times more people than seasonal flu. In other words, the coronavirus is not anything like the flu: It is much, much worse.



From this perspective, the data on coronavirus and flu actually match—rather than flying in the face of—our lived reality in the coronavirus pandemic: hospitals in hot spots stretched to their limits and, in New York City in particular, so many dead that the bodies are stacked in refrigerator trucks. We have never seen such conditions."

https://blogs.scientificamerican.co...u-deaths-is-like-comparing-apples-to-oranges/

 

[drillsgt]

remdesivir had no impact on viral load

I posted the first clinical trial of remdesivir that showed no clinical difference between it and placebo.

We saw Dr. Fauchi speak about it 4/29/2020 saying it did some good for patients in a clinical study.(about that https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...velation-of-gilead-drug-results-idUSKBN22C0KX)


I have now reviewed that study and am not sure why he thinks that.

https://emcrit.org/pulmcrit/wang-remdesivir/

"The most notable finding here might be the lack of any impact on viral load. Remdesivir’s mechanism of action is supposedly to reduce viral replication. If remdesivir is having any biological impact, this should be most easily detectable in terms of reduced viral titers (figure below). Lack of a signal here suggests that remdesivir has no biologically meaningful impact in these patients."

So we know another drug that does not work.If it does do anything it is doing so in a way we can not measure.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31022-9/fulltext


Here is John Hopkins view on case fatality rate,and a breakdown of it by age.

The CDC CFR break down of March data
Age Fatality rate
>85 10-27%
65-84 3-11%
55-64 1-3%
20-54 <1%
Current estimates suggest COVID-19 is ~6-10x worse than seasonal influenza but has a steep age gradient.

https://www.hopkinsguides.com/hopki.../540747/all/Coronavirus_COVID_19__SARS_CoV_2_

We have more drugs in clinical trials hopefully one of those will be more effective.


Indiana is sadly 4th in the USA in the percentage of increase in cases(through 4/29/2020). It is partly due to more testing to be sure.

If you're less than 55yo go back to work, older than that use your best judgment.

 

[dusty88]

So it is the flu deaths that are grossly exaggerated every year.
That almost makes me not trust the government.

I think that is in sync with a large portion of us here

I do have enough friends with public health training to believe it's not any sort of intentional deception. It's a truly difficult area to estimate and there's not motivation to invest a lot of money into making it more accurate. It's really the trends that matter.

I suspect determining final death counts from this pandemic will be debated for months or years. You have the clearly "excess deaths" which is probably a close estimate to the unreported coronavirus deaths. But you also have the influence of less trauma (less driving, less work accidents) and the opposite influence of people who died at home from heart attacks because they were afraid to go to the hospital. And then you have the potential of increased suicides directly from the pandemic or indirectly from the social changes.

 

[chipbennett]

remdesivir had no impact on viral load

I posted the first clinical trial of remdesivir that showed no clinical difference between it and placebo.

We saw Dr. Fauchi speak about it 4/29/2020 saying it did some good for patients in a clinical study.(about that https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...velation-of-gilead-drug-results-idUSKBN22C0KX)


I have now reviewed that study and am not sure why he thinks that.

https://emcrit.org/pulmcrit/wang-remdesivir/

"The most notable finding here might be the lack of any impact on viral load. Remdesivir’s mechanism of action is supposedly to reduce viral replication. If remdesivir is having any biological impact, this should be most easily detectable in terms of reduced viral titers (figure below). Lack of a signal here suggests that remdesivir has no biologically meaningful impact in these patients."


So we know another drug that does not work.If it does do anything it is doing so in a way we can not measure.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31022-9/fulltext

Unless you're confused about which clinical trial Fauci was talking about yesterday, this is nothing more than fear-mongering.

The leaked (uncontrolled, informal, non-peer-reviewed) China study results (as reported in The Lancet) are worthless. The trial was aborted because it didn't reach its enrollment target. You can't draw any conclusions from it, and in particular, you cannot draw the conclusion that Remdesivir doesn't work.

Fauci was talking about the results from a different study - a study that was actually completed, with formal results, that are in the process of being peer-reviewed. And Fauci didn't just say that Remdesivir did "some good" (spin, much?). It did exceptionally well.

And Gilead disclosed preliminary results from yet another trial, that showed similarly positive results.

I have to conclude that you're simply confused about which trial Fauci was referencing, because I know that you are better than this.

 

[dusty88]

remdesivir had no impact on viral load

I posted the first clinical trial of remdesivir that showed no clinical difference between it and placebo.

We saw Dr. Fauchi speak about it 4/29/2020 saying it did some good for patients in a clinical study.(about that https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...velation-of-gilead-drug-results-idUSKBN22C0KX)


I have now reviewed that study and am not sure why he thinks that.

I haven't read the studies yet to see what the theoretical effect was, only that it reduced hospital stay a bit. Fauci emphasized that his enthusiasm was based on demonstrating that you can do something about the virus, and that means we are likely to find better treatments in the future. He compared it to early HIV research, rather than suggesting it as a great solution. At least that was how I interpreted his comments.

In regards to Indiana's growing cases vs increased testing, is there a way to track our % of positive tests? That seems to be a decent marker for identifying the trends.

Dr Box did emphasize they are also using hospitalizations and EMT runs as a marker for decision making.

 

[Leadeye]

News this morning said mayor stinky shoes was going to keep the city closed another two weeks after the governor's deadline. I don't see that earning him points with the locals, maybe he has his eye on a higher office.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

News this morning said mayor stinky shoes was going to keep the city closed another two weeks after the governor's deadline. I don't see that earning him points with the locals, maybe he has his eye on a higher office.

I didn't hear that (on WTHR anyhow). All they were talking about was that the governor was going to make an announcement tomorrow. Which news were you watching Leadeye? I'm sure there will be some that will be unhappy, but Marion County is pretty blue, so it might not be as unpopular among his fans as you might think.