Coronavirus

[OurDee]

The Spanish Flu did not come from Spain. Check your history. Spain was the only country that was not all hush hush about it. So, got it named after them.

 

[T.Lex]

Is this virus worse than Spanish flu? Or do we have better medical care now so there will be less deaths? I know the Spanish flu killed heathy men fighting over in Europe

It depends on how how you define "worse."

People, societies and governments were different back then. It killed millions, and I currently don't think that this will reach those raw numbers.

In terms of mortality rate, my sense is that Spanish Flu was worse.

But, perhaps most importantly, as a proportion of population, Spanish Flu would be considered worse, I think. The world/affected populations are much bigger now, so even if COVID-19 killed the same number of people, it would still be a smaller proportion of the population.

 

[IndyBeerman]

Got my first negative rep since joining in 2008.

Not a single positive one for respirator hack by the doctor who coauthored the study on how to use one respirator for up to 4 patients either.

Done posting on INGO sorry.

Be well,be safe,you are loved.

Smokingman, don't let one "Richard" stop your postings, myself and others on INGO have valued and took heed to your advance heads up advice you have given over this time frame.

Unfortunately with a group as diverse as we have here, there is and always will be that handful that will be "the one" who feels they are right and everyone else is wrong.
You are keeping us on top of things, and I for one, am appreciative of the information you have shared to us.

 

[t-squared]

US/Canada non-essential border crossings are now closed down....

 

[OurDee]

One hypothesis is that the virus strain originated at Fort Riley, Kansas, in viruses in poultry and swine which the fort bred for food; the soldiers were then sent from Fort Riley around the world, where they spread the disease.

To maintain morale, wartime censors minimized early reports of illness and mortality in Germany, the United Kingdom, France, and the United States.[SUP][9][/SUP] Papers were free to report the epidemic's effects in neutral Spain (such as the grave illness of King Alfonso XIII).[SUP][10][/SUP] These stories created a false impression of Spain as especially hard hit,[SUP][11][/SUP] giving rise to the pandemic's nickname, "Spanish flu". ,wikipedia

More recently, experts have proposed a third hypothesis: The Spanish flu originated somewhere in northern China in late 1917 and swiftly moved to western Europe with the 140,000 Chinese laborers the French and British governments recruited to perform manual labor to free up troops for wartime duty.

 

[ghuns]

...we cannot give in to fear. Fear is the language of slaves.

My 70 year old, diabetic father said the same thing after my wife berated him yesterday for going to both Meijer and WalMart in search of a gallon of Dean's chocolate ice cream.

 

[T.Lex]

@OurDee - Whew. I thought that post was talking about COVID-19 at first!

 

[ditcherman]

I will continue to post. I admit being called a fear mongering idiot got to me. This PM is why I will continue to keep posting honestly.
The information I have given has helped others mentally and physically to prepare. That is and has always been my goal.

"I am in charge of inpatient and retail pharmacies in a rehab facility in marion county. We deal with traumatic brain injuries, strokes, spinal injuries, and other misc (transplant,dialysis, etc).We are entertaining processes for taking overflow from larger acute care facilities. Most non-essential therapies have ceased, and my pharmacies are closed gate mail order only.

From your warnings last month, I ordered 2000 n95 masks before the shortage. The masks have been contained in pharmacy to prevent them from walking, and we still remain in preservation mode"

So knowing that I indeed have helped someone prepare means much more to me than a bruise to my ego,and frustration of people who simple do not get it.
As well as I understand normalcy bias it still frustrates me greatly at times. So thank you for the pm. I hope to continue to help when and where I can.

Here is some information from Texas.

Just received confirmation on this from Dallas @JudgeClayJ
chief of staff -- patients who have coronavirus and are in their 20s and 30s being treated now at Dallas hospitals are in critical condition and have no underlying conditions.

Dr. Diana Cervantes, the chief epidemiologist at the state level during the ebola response in 2014, says we, as a country, might react differently to this coronavirus than people in China, Italy, France, etc

“This is the first time we’re seeing this introduced into our population...In the United States, we also have different distributions of diseases and different factors that play into how we might see overall the clinical picture for the population.”
@DCHHS
tells me of the nine new cases reported today, five are hospitalized — and those five who are hospitalized are in their 20s, 30s and 60s. Three of those five are critical.

https://twitter.com/DCHHS/status/1240010150578192386

https://twitter.com/AllisonFox4News

This. Not that I understand normalcy bias all that well, it's newish to me, but this is a very strong force in our minds. It's kind of amazing how it works, I'm sure it serves some kind of purpose.

Smokingman, look at how the tone of this thread has changed. Somebody just asked "why don't we just all quarantine now" and to even suggest that we might consider this action 3-5 short days ago would get you severely rebuked and laughed at. Thank you for sticking your neck out there nearly 2 months ago.

 

[smokingman]

Banks lacked the capitol to borrow from the federal reserve repo window,as of 3/17/2020.

So how do you keep them from failing?

In steps the US Treasury. Giving money to the Federal Reserve for banks to use as collateral at the repo window.

https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/sm945

You can not make this crap up...unless you are a part of government,the fed,or a bank of course.

And just yesterday someone tried to tell me I was the one who did not understand fractional reserve monetary systems.

Apparently I understood them way better than they did.

If banks where not failing why did the US Treasury just have to put up capitol for them to use as collateral to get loans from the fed?

 

[T.Lex]

The focus is on liquidity at this point.

This is a crisis that demands liquidity at every level of our economy, from consumers buying too much toilet paper to companies paying employees for work that isn't being done, to banks making good on deposits and debt service.

Yes, some of this will be unprecedented (which is why the markets are reacting like they are - there's no clear way to price this into the valuations) but it seems to me to be better than the alternative. That being a free fall of our economy, probably worse than the great depression.

That's not fearmongering, but recognizing that post-2008 we have more tools and more knowledge to try and mitigate the economic disaster.

 

[smokingman]

This. Not that I understand normalcy bias all that well, it's newish to me, but this is a very strong force in our minds. It's kind of amazing how it works, I'm sure it serves some kind of purpose.

Smokingman, look at how the tone of this thread has changed. Somebody just asked "why don't we just all quarantine now" and to even suggest that we might consider this action 3-5 short days ago would get you severely rebuked and laughed at. Thank you for sticking your neck out there nearly 2 months ago.

I said we should close all international flights a long time ago. Probably early January when we closed down flights from China I mentioned it.

Sadly much of what I thought would happen has. Things like trying to prepare people for the "new normal" and that their life would not be the same very soon.

My post back on 2/6/2020 talking about where I thought we where headed has started to arrive in full force now.

Some thought it alarmist back then(some still do). My posts about phases of truth was also a good point. What I was criticized for is now within weeks being proved,and accepted as truth.

I have tried to stay ahead of where I thought we where heading to help my family,my self and as many others as I could.

Some have thanked me. I did not post the name of the person that works at the Marion county rehab center that ordered mask more than a month before the panic,but knowing they have them and will use them while helping covid-19 patients makes it all worth it to me. I adjusted my mentality months ago. Try to accept the reality of our situation and where we are headed. That said I have been attacked directly many times. Not even so much on INGO,but in personal emails and places like twitter as being alarmist. I have started to receive apologies now as well.

It is not easy being "the guy" trying to sound the alarm for months(I am not the only one either,that helps). It got to me a bit yesterday honestly. I had to switch it off and get back to logic,reason,and understanding why they felt the way they do,something I myself predicted would be the response in posts here and elsewhere.

Deep breath. Logic,reason,science,math,and a big dose of love. We will get through this.

 

[Dead Duck]

On a good note.
Those who are trying to lose a little weight, this is your chance.

On a bad note.
Start rationing what you have now or you may not make it through this.

 

[T.Lex]

Re: banking (partially in response to a message delivered via rep - and thanks for that)

Because I'm a cynic, it has occurred to me that one way to prop up a bank's reserve/liquidity is to send money to the people depositing it, at a time when they probably feel the need to save money.

People might deposit it and sit on it, which improves the bank's holdings. Or they spend it, which has other benefits for the economy.

 

[smokingman]

Re: banking (partially in response to a message delivered via rep - and thanks for that)

Because I'm a cynic, it has occurred to me that one way to prop up a bank's reserve/liquidity is to send money to the people depositing it, at a time when they probably feel the need to save money.

People might deposit it and sit on it, which improves the bank's holdings. Or they spend it, which has other benefits for the economy.

You will get your helicopter money in less than 2 weeks promise.

 

[Alpo]

I can see the printing presses running full time to print up the $200 billion needed for the $1,000 for every adult. I would assume that there is a large segment of the population that will hang on to cash during a period of uncertainty. Some will have to be spent to replace lost wages, but the presses will be busy.

 

[JettaKnight]

I can see the printing presses running full time to print up the $200 billion needed for the $1,000 for every adult. I would assume that there is a large segment of the population that will hang on to cash during a period of uncertainty. Some will have to be spent to replace lost wages, but the presses will be busy.

Like I said in the other thread - if I get money, I can't really do anything with it now to help the economy.


More likely, it will help dry up all the rain when the sun does come out.

 

[smokingman]

On a little side note.

Crude is back to early 1990s prices.
22.10

Who could have seen that coming back in January? Probably the guy that warned about it ME.I was not alone either,not even back then.


https://oilprice.com/

 

[smokingman]

I can see the printing presses running full time to print up the $200 billion needed for the $1,000 for every adult. I would assume that there is a large segment of the population that will hang on to cash during a period of uncertainty. Some will have to be spent to replace lost wages, but the presses will be busy.

I think it will be more like $2000-4000 given out minimum and probably more than once.

 

[melensdad]

So shale oil/fracking is now priced out of the market and the companies, which are highly leveraged, will be collapsing, merging and filing for bankruptcy.

 

[ditcherman]

ETA sorry so small.