CIVIL RELIGIOUS DISCUSSION: All things Christianity

[ArcadiaGP]

And now.

A joke.

Jack, a renown Atheist, dies.

...and to his utter surprise ends up in hell where he's greeted by Satan himself.

Completely shocked he talks to the devil and says: "Welp, I've been wrong all my life and I guess I'm now to pay the price for my lack of faith"

Satan laughs and replies: "Awh it's not so bad down here, let me give you the tour so you can see for yourself"

He then proceeds to escort Jack through a beautiful lush green plain with flowers, scattered here and there there's a bunch of houses where other "damned" live.

As they pass through each house the inhabitants recognize Satan and invite them inside for a drink and a chat, request that's always granted by the two.

Every time they stop to a house Satan never fails to display how much of a lovely guy he really is by telling amazing stories, singing, cracking jokes and just generally being a great person.

At sunset the devil sees that Jack was very tired and decides to show him the house he'll be spending the rest of eternity into.

As they walk to Jack's new house the two pass close to a huge wall and Jack asks: "What's behind there?"

Satan: "Oh, nothing that should concern you, pay it no mind"

Despite his curiosity Jack thought better not to bother Satan with further questions and just followed him to his new house where Satan promised he'd be back the following morning to show him the recreational center before finally bidding him a goodnight after a long day.

That night however Jack kept thinking back at the whole situation he's in and how surreal everything was until his thoughts eventually jumped to the wall he saw earlier in the day.

After a few minutes trying to guess what could there be behind that wall that Satan couldn't even tell him he decided he should investigate, as such he took a deep breath and dived into the night walking back to the place where the wall was.

Once there he searched for some clues until he saw some faint light coming from a spot in the wall; upon closer inspection he saw that there was a hole and the light was coming from behind the wall.

Jack took a deep breath and scrounged up the courage to look into the crack on the wall and what he saw was a spectacle much alike what he always thought hell would be.

On the other side of the wall huge flames were scattered all over a burnt and scalding hot ground and much to his horror he saw other souls inside that nightmare being eternally burned and never consuming, screaming and pleading for help.

Jack rushed back into his place where he just quietly sobbed and cried all night for he was sure now that the Devil was just toying with him to give him a bit of hope right before tossing him into eternal despair.

The following morning Satan showed up once again and told Jack to come with him.

Jack pleaded: "PLEASE! PLEASE! Don't take me to hell, I'll do anything just let me stay here, I don't wanna burn for all eternity!"

Satan: "What are you talking about??? I'm just gonna show you the recreational center like I told you yesterday"

Jack: "Don't lie to me, I saw what was going on behind the giant wall!"

Satan: "Ooooh you saw that! Don't worry that's not for you, that's the Christian hell"

Jack: "The christian hell? Why would the christian hell be like that?"

Satan: "I don't know either man, they just want it that way"

 

[Ziggidy]

What church do you attend?

Assembly of God
https://ag.org/Beliefs/Statement-of-Fundamental-Truths#top

 

[Expat]

I can do nothing to make God love me any more and I can do nothing to make Him love me any less.

 

[Ziggidy]

I can do nothing to make God love me any more and I can do nothing to make Him love me any less.

I agree totally; however that does not mean hell does not exist for those who reject Him (Jesus Christ as their Savior).

 

[T.Lex]

I can do nothing to make God love me any more and I can do nothing to make Him love me any less.

I think that's an answer to a different question. How much does God love us?

But - and this question comes from a place of curiosity, not confrontation - does sin not separate us from God?

 

[Ziggidy]

I think that's an answer to a different question. How much does God love us?

But - and this question comes from a place of curiosity, not confrontation - does sin not separate us from God?

Let’s not forget, Christ died for us while we were sinners. He loves us so much that He gave up His life as a way out of our sins. We choose to accept that love or not.



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[GodFearinGunTotin]

I agree totally; however that does not mean hell does not exist for those who reject Him (Jesus Christ as their Savior).

Because God loves us too much to force us into his presence for all eternity. Forcing someone, against their will, to be with you is not love.

 

[Ziggidy]

Because God loves us too much to force us into his presence for all eternity. Forcing someone, against their will, to be with you is not love.

Amen


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[foszoe]

LOVE.

As time goes by I believe that is the crux of all my disagreements with U.L.I.P.

T not so much

Because God loves us too much to force us into his presence for all eternity. Forcing someone, against their will, to be with you is not love.

 

[Dead Duck]

Because God loves us too much to force us into his presence for all eternity. Forcing someone, against their will, to be with you is not love.

Ruler Nun would disagree...

 

[breakingcontact]

Let’s not forget, Christ died for us while we were sinners. He loves us so much that He gave up His life as a way out of our sins. We choose to accept that love or not.



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From what non-sinful part of my innately sinful being, can I make such a choice?

 

[breakingcontact]

I would limit that to Baptists. It's not as prevalent among other Protestant Groups. I think Methodists and Lutherans start with a creedal formula. Remember the first line of most creeds is I believe in God...a statement of faith.

As evidenced in ecclesiastical polity.

 

[T.Lex]

From what non-sinful part of my innately sinful being, can I make such a choice?

While I think I understand the comment you are replying to, I'm really not sure I understand your comment.

As an explanation why this thread is important to me, this conversation between the 2 of you reflects an approach so far removed from what I'm used to, that I think there's a huge set of data that I'm just missing.

Like, my first reaction was "free will." But then I thought of mentioning our soul - that part of God that is present in everyone. That part that does yearn to be reunited with God. It is sometimes manifested in our conscience.

Or am I completely missing the mark on this?

 

[breakingcontact]

The second item I have advocated for often is to leave quit thinking of sin as a crime and punishment scenario. I commit a crime, I need forgiveness. <Insert mechanism here>. I am forgiven. That is medieval, reformation theology.

I'm sure you have read much of what the reformers have written.

You call them medieval but surely you read how many of them refer back to 3rd and 4th century saints such as Augustine.

I sure wish you'd advocate for your Orthodox tradition more and attack the faith traditions of others less.

 

[T.Lex]

I'm sure you have read much of what the reformers have written.

You call them medieval but surely you read how many of them refer back to 3rd and 4th century saints such as Augustine.

I sure wish you'd advocate for your Orthodox tradition more and attack the faith traditions of others less.

Whu what?

 

[breakingcontact]

While I think I understand the comment you are replying to, I'm really not sure I understand your comment.

As an explanation why this thread is important to me, this conversation between the 2 of you reflects an approach so far removed from what I'm used to, that I think there's a huge set of data that I'm just missing.

Like, my first reaction was "free will." But then I thought of mentioning our soul - that part of God that is present in everyone. That part that does yearn to be reunited with God. It is sometimes manifested in our conscience.

Or am I completely missing the mark on this?

Yeah, us reformed folks are pretty radical compared to mainstream modern protestant Christianity.

What I love about the reformed tradition is that it is so much about God and not me.

I am hopeless without God's grace. I am not capable of saving myself or choosing salvation for myself.

 

[T.Lex]

Yeah, us reformed folks are pretty radical compared to mainstream modern protestant Christianity.

What I love about the reformed tradition is that it is so much about God and not me.

I am hopeless without God's grace. I am not capable of saving myself or choosing salvation for myself.

Sooooo.... you don't make choices? Like, you're on autopilot?

I don't mean to be facetious with this. I just don't understand the implication.

 

[breakingcontact]

As far as the view of sin mentioned earlier, we are not sinners because we sin, we are born into sin.

 

[breakingcontact]

I didn't do good works and earn God's choosing.
I didn't walk an isle and somehow choose to accept God.
I didn't perfectly adhere to some set of rules.
God, out of his mercy and out of nothing special in me, saved me.

 

[T.Lex]

I didn't do good works and earn God's choosing.
I didn't walk an isle and somehow choose to accept God.
I didn't perfectly adhere to some set of rules.
God, out of his mercy and out of nothing special in me, saved me.

I'm not arguing about any of that.

Do you not make choices in your life?