"Acquiring" Items

[DadOfFour]

A couple of thoughts...

1.) Indiana, especially Rural Indiana, has a fairly high percentage of Combat Arms Veterans mainly Army and Marines...
2.) Indiana has a pretty decent population of SOCOM Veterans...
3.) Persons attempting to "acquire" from me and mine will be dealt with very swiftly...
4.) Just an FYI, most persons in the first two notes, don't really advertise what they may be capable of doing...

So bring it if you think Me and Mine might be easy meat. I can always use your Gear...

Check the unnecessary bravado. I never talked about taking from somebody else for pete's sake. The only reason I would even contemplate doing that would be a last resort, no other choice, ie I try to take from you or my children starve, in which case, if I don't come back the kids are no worse off then they were before I left.

To the OP,

What are your skills? Can you make guaranteed one shot kills out to 350 yards? I may have a place for you and your kids. I'll be looking for GOOD perimeter protection. No room for looters around here. Your kids know how to run a shovel right?

I've already got a group, but thanks. (Not to jack my own thread lol, but I'd also argue there's no such thing as a guaranteed one shot kill, doesn't matter what caliber lead you're slinging, doesn't matter how accurate a shooter you are.....but that's besides the point)


I guess this thread didn't do what I was intending it to do, which is make people think about what steps they will be willing to take after the balloon goes up. Am I prepared to kill to keep my kids alive, yep, I'll lie, cheat, steal, and burn too if it means my kids survive. All of these things are things which right now I find morally abhorrent, however, if the balloon goes up then I loose the ability to be comfortable with my morals and I have one goal, and ONLY one goal, stay alive and keep my kids alive, EVERYTHING else is secondary to that!

 

[knoxace]

Wow reading all these posts was interesting . Lets face it we will all run out of preps sometime , some b4 others .
the law will always be present . Its enforcement will depend on the good in people , to ensure it is upheld . If we dont come to the aid of our neighbors when they are in need we will be next . If you steal from a dead man , yes you stole . shame on you . IF you steal from a family ( thats in the same **** storm as you ) you should be shot .

 

[DadOfFour]

Wow reading all these posts was interesting . Lets face it we will all run out of preps sometime , some b4 others .
the law will always be present . Its enforcement will depend on the good in people , to ensure it is upheld . If we dont come to the aid of our neighbors when they are in need we will be next . If you steal from a dead man , yes you stole . shame on you . IF you steal from a family ( thats in the same **** storm as you ) you should be shot .

I gotta disagree, in a true TEOTWAWKI situation man will revert to survival of the fittest, it will literally be kill or be killed. Like I said earlier, the only reason I would steal from a family (or anyone else who's just trying to survive) would be because it was a last ditch effort to save my children's lives, and I would fully expect the person that I was attempting to take from to attempt to stop me....

 

[jeremy]

Check the unnecessary bravado. I never talked about taking from somebody else for pete's sake. The only reason I would even contemplate doing that would be a last resort, no other choice, ie I try to take from you or my children starve, in which case, if I don't come back the kids are no worse off then they were before I left.

There is no Bravado just stating Facts. You are the one already advocating "Acquiring" stuff. I am just making you aware of some very unique hiccups in your idea...

 

[bwframe]

...I have one goal, and ONLY one goal, stay alive and keep my kids alive, EVERYTHING else is secondary to that!

If this is truly your goal, you should listen to those telling you that your plan is flawed.

 

[knoxace]

Maybe banding together would be a better idea ? Helping oneanother can go a long way . bartering and trading services . Instead of killing to live you could hunt to live . People will need meat , most cant hunt . People have things they are good at some sew , others garden , and we cant forget the horders .
Sounds like you would be a good hunter , trade that for what you need . Your kids will be better off for it .

 

[Ted]

I don't need a law to tell me what's right and what's wrong. A thief is a thief, regardless of the conditions.

I imagine that is entirely dependent upon how one would define thievery.

According to a particular book held in veneration by a large group of people: If a man would come into one's garden and immediately eats what he picks, it is not considered theft.

But if he leaves the garden with the food, it demands either punishment or compensation.....even in the form of slavery, until the debt is paid.

 

[DadOfFour]

There is no Bravado just stating Facts. You are the one already advocating "Acquiring" stuff. I am just making you aware of some very unique hiccups in your idea...

Maybe you need to work on your reading skills? Did you somehow miss the multitude of posts where I specifically said I wasn't talking about taking things from individuals?

If this is truly your goal, you should listen to those telling you that your plan is flawed.

Only one post addressed what I was actually talking about, everyone else has been talking about moral issues with what I was talking about, and as already stated, the luxury of morals is something we won't have when the balloon goes up.

Maybe banding together would be a better idea ? Helping oneanother can go a long way . bartering and trading services . Instead of killing to live you could hunt to live . People will need meat , most cant hunt . People have things they are good at some sew , others garden , and we cant forget the horders .
Sounds like you would be a good hunter , trade that for what you need . Your kids will be better off for it .

Actually, I'm already involved in a group, we have "hunters", gatherers, current and ex military, a doctor, two nurses, a mechanic, and a couple home makers.

 

[bwframe]

...everyone else has been talking about moral issues with what I was talking about, and as already stated, the luxury of morals is something we won't have...

Gotcha, everyone else is wrong.

Actually, I'm already involved in a group, we have "hunters", gatherers, current and ex military, a doctor, two nurses, a mechanic, and a couple home makers.

What does the rest of your group think of your looting plans?

 

[shibumiseeker]

Gotcha, everyone else is wrong.

Yeah, I put a lot of thought into a response, wrote it out, looked at it several times, then decided he wouldn't understand it and this thread wasn't worth it. I may post it on another survival forum I'm on since I'm pretty pleased with the wordcrafting. OP, have fun doing whatever you're going to do. You're always going to be right with your actions regardless. You can have the satisfaction in knowing that anyone who disagrees with you in any way is completely wrong and you are completely right, I shall rain on your parade no further.

 

[DadOfFour]

Gotcha, everyone else is wrong.



What does the rest of your group think of your looting plans?

Yeah, I put a lot of thought into a response, wrote it out, looked at it several times, then decided he wouldn't understand it and this thread wasn't worth it. I may post it on another survival forum I'm on since I'm pretty pleased with the wordcrafting. OP, have fun doing whatever you're going to do. You're always going to be right with your actions regardless. You can have the satisfaction in knowing that anyone who disagrees with you in any way is completely wrong and you are completely right, I shall rain on your parade no further.

I never said that everyone else was wrong, I did however say that everyone else was addressing the moral issues of an action that I wasn't talking about. I was specifically talking about taking things from a defunct retail establishment and everyone got their panties in a twist about taking from individuals. I've stated more times than I care to count that that is NOT what I was talking about but people seem to be stuck on it.

Regardless, you prep your way, I'll continue to prep my way, and if I have to steal to supplement my preps and allow my kids to survive then that's what I'll do, and I'll sleep well that night, and when my time comes I'll stand before my God and let him judge me.

 

[strahd71]

I never said that everyone else was wrong, I did however say that everyone else was addressing the moral issues of an action that I wasn't talking about. I was specifically talking about taking things from a defunct retail establishment and everyone got their panties in a twist about taking from individuals. I've stated more times than I care to count that that is NOT what I was talking about but people seem to be stuck on it.

Regardless, you prep your way, I'll continue to prep my way, and if I have to steal to supplement my preps and allow my kids to survive then that's what I'll do, and I'll sleep well that night, and when my time comes I'll stand before my God and let him judge me.

tis true

jake

 

[jeremy]

Yeah, I put a lot of thought into a response, wrote it out, looked at it several times, then decided he wouldn't understand it and this thread wasn't worth it. I may post it on another survival forum I'm on since I'm pretty pleased with the wordcrafting. OP, have fun doing whatever you're going to do. You're always going to be right with your actions regardless. You can have the satisfaction in knowing that anyone who disagrees with you in any way is completely wrong and you are completely right, I shall rain on your parade no further.

Go ahead and post it, I would like to read it...

 

[jeremy]

Maybe you need to work on your reading skills? Did you somehow miss the multitude of posts where I specifically said I wasn't talking about taking things from individuals?

Maybe, I do need to work on my reading skills. I doubt it. I already pointed out the flaw in your thought of waltzing down to the local Wal-Mart and pilfering anything. Where are you thinking you are going to be "acquiring" the items you are looking for if not from individuals?!

 

[dukeboy_318]

to the OP, I think I get what you are driving at. However, I've not given it any thought, nor will I probably. That is a survival moment type question that each will have to decide on when and if it comes to that.

I'm not going to take a harsh line like some on here or pat you on the back either. I will however tell you that I am in a similar boat, tight budget and limited excess for preps, ammo etc. However, there are some things that you can do now.

I'm sure you already have some clothes from your children that they have out grown or toys they don't play with and are in good or decent condition, there are some stores around that will give you store credit for those items and you can use those to get clothes that they will grow into. For example, if your kid wears a size 4 shoe, use those credits to get a size 6 or a 7, store that long term and repeat the process. I'm not sure where you are located, theres a store in Columbus that does this exact thing, I can't seem to recall the name of it, my sister in law uses it all the time for her kids, I'll ask her tomorrow and PM you with the name. Keep in mind, it is a business so it might be a 2 for 1 type trade but at least its something.

Another option, one thing I have done is cut out fast food, not sure if you eat it or not, but I did, quite reguarly, I went cold turkey, stopped it all together, that 20-30 bucks a pay check I used to spend on Mcdonalds etc, is now being used to buy things like TP, can goods etc. its small, but its slowly growing.

As for stealing gas to get to a safe location, only if and I mean only if it was a last resort. My bugout plan for most anything requires no driving, my secondary location is 5 miles away by road, 3 miles through the tough terrain. I have some fuel stored in various caches as extra cash allows, its enough to get me 1000 miles or so, if I were to need it.

Also, as money is tight, I've made some of my own stuff out of used/recyled goods. For example, that clear glass spaggetti sauce jar makes a good candle holder or even a bait holder.

You might already know some of these tips but I figured this was better than blasting and insulting your character. Good luck and I hope none of us find ourselves having to ask that question.

 

[shibumiseeker]

I never said that everyone else was wrong, I did however say that everyone else was addressing the moral issues of an action that I wasn't talking about.

"everyone" Hardly. A majority of us were telling you it's a bad plan to base your preps on it and several tried to offer better alternatives. A very few posts talked about the morality side of it, but you got stuck on that point and kept coming back to it. It was pointed out to you that there are very few SHTF, TEOTWAWKI situations where there isn't some type of justice system, either vigilante style or rule of law style where you will later have to account for your actions. This has born out time and again throughout history yet you blithely dismiss it, and this has been the thrust of what many of the posts here have been talking about. Hence my comment about you are always going to be right and everyone else is always going to be wrong.

I have been a survivalist since was 11 and have studied it extensively both from the practical survival standpoint as well as the sociocultural standpoint. I've worked disaster response and gone all over during times of major SHTF. I've studied the modern collapsed societies. I probably have more preps than most people here, and my opinion given ALL of that is that skills, attitude, and mindset are far more important than what you store. I also see far more value in putting most of the effort into preparing for the most probable scenarios in life, which aren't total TEOTWAWKI because all the skills and preps that allow you to survive those highly probable events, also allow you to better survive the end of the world.

I got little use for someone who would rather just plan on "liberating" a pair of shoes rather than learn how to make a functional pair of shoes out of materials on hand. Learning a craft is a cheap way to prep and is one that cannot be taken away from you. I've seen more survival creativity in third world countries than you could ever find in a suburban neighborhood here.

And with that, I really am done with this thread. I've beat that drum way too many times over the years and it continues to fall on the same deaf ears.

 

[shibumiseeker]

Go ahead and post it, I would like to read it...

PMed.

 

[dukeboy_318]

Learning a craft is a cheap way to prep and is one that cannot be taken away from you.

Honestly, I think this is the key to survival in any SHTF scenario.

 

[dukeboy_318]

PMed.

I'd like to read it too, if I could?

 

[jeremy]

Only one post addressed what I was actually talking about, everyone else has been talking about moral issues with what I was talking about, and as already stated, the luxury of morals is something we won't have when the balloon goes up.

I have no moral issues with what you are talking about. I am just wondering how you think you are going to get these supplies without one hell of a fight. Which will further deplete your supplies. Also, while placing your life, and the lives of your "group" and family in serious jeopardy.

Actually, I'm already involved in a group, we have "hunters", gatherers, current and ex military, a doctor, two nurses, a mechanic, and a couple home makers.

You might want to ask the tacticians in your group what their thoughts on your plan are on acquiring stuff. The Team I am with is pushing over 50 Veteran Soldiers (read Combat Proven, Combat Arms at that), not to include spouses and dependents or the service and support persons. What do you think my Team would do to a group like yours operating in or near Our AO after the fall of Civilization?!