17 year old kid shot dead by Neighborhood Watch "Captain"

[Bond 281]

Cave in to the mass media and make stupid charges? I thought that people were supposed to be innocent until proven guilty?

The problem here is that it is entirely possible that the prosecution knows something we don't that substantially changes the whole narrative. Or maybe they don't. We just don't know. All we can really do is base our opinions on the evidence at hand. My opinion is that unless the prosecution does have some major piece of evidence, or more likely even multiple pieces of evidence that aren't available to the public, this is simply feeding Zimmerman to the mob.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Cave in to the mass media and make stupid charges? I thought that people were supposed to be innocent until proven guilty?

You can't back that up with fact. You're making a presumption.

 

[hornadylnl]

I would think that Murder 2 would be difficult as well. I actually expected Zimmerman to walk without being charged. But then again, we only have a bare minimum of facts. For instance, if Zimmerman did something as minor as grab Martin by the arm, to detain him until police arrived, that would change the whole dynamic of what we know.

That's Unpossible. Haven't you read Martin's tweets or seen his pictures? Those are a guarantee that he's a thug. Zimmerman's past charges mean nothing. The fact that zimmerman is a criminal justice major would not give him the knowledge to leave out any details of the story that may make himself look bad either.

 

[Bond 281]

Dude, if there is guy chasing me, and I actively attempt to evade him, my SA is going to be going through the roof. If that guy catches up with me, and places his hand on me, he's going to be in for the fight of his life.

If a person is armed in such an instance, the person being grabbed in justified in putting two in his chest. You aren't implying that because someone only has their hands to defend themselves, and not a firearm then deadly force is not an option?

What I'm implying is simply that if say someone pushed you. Then you went berserk and started beating the crap out of that guy. Then (assuming that guy didn't have a gun) you continue to beat somebody's head into concrete repeatedly as they're crying out for help multiple times....yeah, you're going to prison. Force has to be reasonable. You can't beat somebody to death because they slapped you, or grabbed you or whatever. Or if you do, you have to show you had a damn good reason to do so. Martin doesn't have that option.

Pertaining to this case, there's absolutely nothing that would prove that Zimmerman's gun had anything to do with Martin's continued assault. Seeing as how that can't be proven, there's no way that will fly in court. As far as, you know, actual evidence is concerned, Martin continued to assault Zimmerman in a life threatening manner even after Zimmerman tried to passively end the confrontation. That justifies Zimmerman's use of deadly force even if he threw the first punch or whatever. Not that there's any evidence to suggest he did.

Furthermore, there's evidence to suggest that Martin, instead of going to the safety of his home, doubled back to confront Zimmerman. This active reentering a potentially dangerous situation is not only stupid on Martin's part, but if anything suggests that it's more likely that Martin initiated violence.

 

[HICKMAN]

The problem here is that it is entirely possible that the prosecution knows something we don't that substantially changes the whole narrative.

I doubt it, if they had anything they would have charged him early.

 

[Bond 281]

That's Unpossible. Haven't you read Martin's tweets or seen his pictures? Those are a guarantee that he's a thug. Zimmerman's past charges mean nothing. The fact that zimmerman is a criminal justice major would not give him the knowledge to leave out any details of the story that may make himself look bad either.

There's plenty of evidence to suggest both good and bad aspects of Zimmerman's character. There's the charges for pushing an ATF agent and some guy saying he was an aggressive bouncer. On the other hand, there's his community service record, and his crusade for justice regarding the police beating of a homeless man.

Where's any positive evidence speaking to Martin's character? All we have is that he very likely dealt drugs, was suspended from school multiple times, assaulted his bus driver, and has pictures of himself dressed as a thug and his twitter name was NOLIMIT*****.

You're either willfully being ignorant of the fact that everything that's ever come out about Martin is 100% negative or you're just ignoring it so you can be a liberal media cheerleader. Now, I agree with you that all the stuff about Martin and Zimmerman is completely inconclusive. People are probably rushing to judgement against Martin because he seems to fit a stereotype. However, don't be silly in suggesting that they're rushing to judgement based on anything other than reasonable evidence. It's also probably further compounded by people being pissed off at how blatantly the media has been skewing the entire narrative of this case.

Edit: Hickman, I doubt it too. Just leaving open the possibility.

 

[Pocketman]

Cave in to the mass media and make stupid charges? I thought that people were supposed to be innocent until proven guilty?

Zimmerman has been charged, not convicted. This is an equal opportunity for everyone to present ALL the evidence. I don't understand all the angst about this, unless people fear an unjust conviction.

 

[HICKMAN]

While the right hand is race baiting and debating about hate crime, profiling, a kids suspension, black panthers, bounties and all the other nonsense....

the left hand is working in the background to attack the Stand Your Ground law and gun control.

How many "high profile" shootings have we had since Obama took office now? Giffords, Fort Hood and this?

The Brady Campaign is already hard at work, here is what they are sending to Congress to oppose S. 2188 and S. 2213.

I don't believe in the gun lobby's vision of armed and dangerous people legally carrying loaded and hidden handguns in my neighborhood. More "George Zimmermans" walking the streets of our community? That's the gun lobby's vision of America. But it's not mine.

These bills would force our state to honor the concealed carry permits of other states with abhorrently low standards.

I urge you to flatly reject this dangerous vision and stop the 'George Zimmerman Armed Vigilante Act.'

 

[bobzilla]

You can't back that up with fact. You're making a presumption.

You can't disprove it either, so it's a theory. The local DA, the local police chief and the local detectives (except one who now comes out as saying otherwise) all investigated, and revisited witnesses for 48 hours. They found no evidence of foul play. Yet we get a specially selected prosecutor sent in with Federal pressure to make a case and now we have charges.

A blind man with no hands and popped ear drums can see what this is. It's a play to placate the black community to stave off riots. Being unwilling to consider this as a possibility makes your own theory even more useless.

 

[bobzilla]

Zimmerman has been charged, not convicted. This is an equal opportunity for everyone to present ALL the evidence. I don't understand all the angst about this, unless people fear an unjust conviction.

With the amount of media coverage, where is this man going to get a fail trial? Seriously... where?

 

[HICKMAN]

 

[Bond 281]

Zimmerman has been charged, not convicted. This is an equal opportunity for everyone to present ALL the evidence. I don't understand all the angst about this, unless people fear an unjust conviction.

Here is why, assuming there isn't some crucial piece of evidence that isn't publicly available. I think it's the utter lack of probable cause based upon all evidence. Zimmerman's story, that legally justifies his actions, given right after the incident, that passed a lie detector, that was given without any legal council, has stood up to every single piece of physical evidence and witness testimony that has come out. Given all current evidence, there is no possible way he could be charged with a crime in good faith. That means that the ONLY reason he's being charged is the state caving to federal or media pressure. This is outrageous enough. In addition though, a trial isn't just simply a chance to present evidence and hear the case out and all that. It will be a media circus in which even more of Zimmerman's life will be subject to intense public scrutiny, so it's an invasion of privacy. Furthermore, unless he goes the Public Defender route it's bound to be incredibly expensive. Zimmerman isn't rich from what I understand. The exorbitant cost of legal fees will likely haunt him for years to come.

That's why people are pissed off about a charge that isn't based on probable cause. It's a horrible experience that strips someone's privacy and financial well-being away from them. It's not something that ought to be done just to satiate the mob, which is exactly what is seems to be.

Edit: And yeah, it also seems like big media frenzy trials don't usually get justice done.

 

[hornadylnl]

Dude, if there is guy chasing me, and I actively attempt to evade him, my SA is going to be going through the roof. If that guy catches up with me, and places his hand on me, he's going to be in for the fight of his life.

If a person is armed in such an instance, the person being grabbed in justified in putting two in his chest. You aren't implying that because someone only has their hands to defend themselves, and not a firearm then deadly force is not an option?

Self defense, stand your ground, and deadl force aren't options if you post scary pictures of yourself on twitter.

 

[Bond 281]

Self defense, stand your ground, and deadl force aren't options if you post scary pictures of yourself on twitter.

Or if the person you're defending yourself from is a minority, apparently.

 

[popeye]

Zim is gonna get "Minoriscrewed". He made the mistake of killing someone lower on the minority scale than himself. If he was an Eskimo he could have walked.

I'm retired and I gotta laugh. I see almost nonstop posting to the thread. Does anybody here work? Are you all stay at home mom's? Are you all still unemployed living in mom and dad's basement?

 

[ATOMonkey]

Zim is gonna get "Minoriscrewed". He made the mistake of killing someone lower on the minority scale than himself. If he was an Eskimo he could have walked.

I'm retired and I gotta laugh. I see almost nonstop posting to the thread. Does anybody here work? Are you all stay at home mom's? Are you all still unemployed living in mom and dad's basement?

I don't know how long you've been retired, but most people have computers at work now.

Instead of standing around the water cooler, or yacking on the phone, people post on the web.

 

[blamecharles]

I don't know how long you've been retired, but most people have computers at work now.

Instead of standing around the water cooler, or yacking on the phone, people post on the web.

Also from the bathroom with all this newfangled technology.

 

[Jake46184]

Zimmerman has been charged, not convicted. This is an equal opportunity for everyone to present ALL the evidence. I don't understand all the angst about this, unless people fear an unjust conviction.

Your comments suggest a misunderstanding. It is not the prosecutor's job to file charges just to appease a mob. That's why the local prosecutor, after reviewing all available evidence, chose not to do so. That was obviously not going to be acceptable to the state of Florida, so they moved him aside and brought in their hack.

Zimmerman was not charged because there was probable cause to do so. He was charged to calm a violent mob. The entire proceeding has made a mockery of our supposedly superior judicial process. Given all that has happened so far, it is much of a stretch to assume that Zimmerman has already been found guilty? An unjust conviction? How naive.

 

[popeye]

I don't know how long you've been retired, but most people have computers at work now.

Instead of standing around the water cooler, or yacking on the phone, people post on the web.

Retired from I.T. a couple years ago. I can't believe everybody is "deskbound". If that's the case better hope the boss isn't tracking your computer usage.

 

[iwearcowboyboots]

I don't know how long you've been retired, but most people have computers at work now.

Instead of standing around the water cooler, or yacking on the phone, people post on the web.

Speak for yourself. I'm currently unemployed and living in popeye's mom and dad's basement.