Woman With Pot of Boiling Water Shot Dead by Police

[BehindBlueI's]

So when I do watch Cops and Live PD it's not really real?

It's as real as any reality show. Literally thousands of hours of video carefully selected for the most interesting to an audience bits, perhaps artfully edited, etc.

They've ridden with us before, and the camera crews for Cops were pretty solid dudes but I would never have a crew ride with me any more than I'll do media interviews. They have an agenda and know how to take 1+2 to make 4 if it's more interesting because interesting is money in the attention based economy.

 

[Creedmoor]

It's as real as any reality show. Literally thousands of hours of video carefully selected for the most interesting to an audience bits, perhaps artfully edited, etc.

They've ridden with us before, and the camera crews for Cops were pretty solid dudes but I would never have a crew ride with me any more than I'll do media interviews. They have an agenda and know how to take 1+2 to make 4 if it's more interesting because interesting is money in the attention based economy.

My kid sister was a Detective in Jacksonville, FL SD when Cops did episodes with them. She will still shakes her head when the topic come up.
One county over in Maryland is Calvert Co, MD. Cops did shows there also, It was an endless goat rope.

 

[Ziggidy]

Let's stick to reality.

But this isn't some "demon cop kills church lady" like you seem to think it is.

Reality: This is about some "demon cop kills lady who's following commands".

I have great respect for your wisdom of such matters; however, sometimes it is hard to see reality beyond the blinders we inherit from our experiences. IOW, take your experience hat off and look at, watch, listen to the data we have available and tell me the cop was not off his rocker.

 

[Route 45]

Reality: This is about some "demon cop kills lady who's following commands".

I have great respect for your wisdom of such matters; however, sometimes it is hard to see reality beyond the blinders we inherit from our experiences. IOW, take your experience hat off and look at, watch, listen to the data we have available and tell me the cop was not off his rocker.

Psychological issues, most likley. Anger control problems. Listen to his words after he shoots her. He knows he ****ed up. His issues finally caught up with him. Doesn't require anything supernatural. Humanity is filled with people like this. Some of them unfortunately acquire a badge.

If you think it has anything to do with supernatural good vs evil, I've got some bad news for you. The demons usually win.

 

[armalitesheepdog]

This guy has been through 6 departments on 4 years. Maybe police work is not for him.

He seems better suited for atf or fbi.

How does he do with dogs and children?

I have to go thru a background check to buy a gun but a job that requires you carry one well……BG checks are overrated?……. I sometimes hire people for warehouse work and I won’t hire someone who has had to many jobs in to little time.

 

[Route 45]

I have to go thru a background check to buy a gun but a job that requires you carry one well……BG checks are overrated?……. I sometimes hire people for warehouse work and I won’t hire someone who has had to many jobs in to little time.

His first 3 departments were all part-time, with the first 2 having overlap in dates of employment. Maybe he was a reserve officer? The last 2 before his current department indicate resignation, doesn't say why. Would be interesting to know why he left the other two full-time jobs.

I'm quite sure they did background checks for employment at a police or sheriff's department. Not sure what kind of disclosure of prior employment records is allowed in Illinois, though. If he had a clean criminal background, that might have been the extent of the check. Might not have been a big applicant pool for these jobs. He was certified, and nobody really wants to be a cop anymore, so...

 

[Bugzilla]

WTF
Said Reed and Malloy

1 Adam 12 was racist. 99.9% of the criminals were white!

 

[Ark]

His first 3 departments were all part-time, with the first 2 having overlap in dates of employment. Maybe he was a reserve officer? The last 2 before his current department indicate resignation, doesn't say why. Would be interesting to know why he left the other two full-time jobs.

I'm quite sure they did background checks for employment at a police or sheriff's department. Not sure what kind of disclosure of prior employment records is allowed in Illinois, though. If he had a clean criminal background, that might have been the extent of the check. Might not have been a big applicant pool for these jobs. He was certified, and nobody really wants to be a cop anymore, so...

View attachment 368350

If you don't F up big enough to make the news, and your previous employers don't volunteer anything but name and employment dates, and you don't have a criminal record... what do people think a "background check" is going to do?

Dunno how things are in cop land, but in the private employment world the policy has been "no comment, no recommendations, name and date verification only" for a while now. Too much liability exposure for badmouthing people and interfering with their future employment.

 

[manifest destiny]

I hear leo's say some guys just aren't good cops. I believe they're being honest when they say it. What I never hear is what leo's are doing to remove the bad cops. "They shouldn't have a badge" isn't gonna make anyone safer or the force stronger. "One bad apple" doesn't explain what the other apples are doing to save the bushel. This cop literally said he was going to shoot her in the face.... over sme boiling water he lawfully directed her to handle. Oh well, at least he as at the right address.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I hear leo's say some guys just aren't good cops. I believe they're being honest when they say it. What I never hear is what leo's are doing to remove the bad cops. "They shouldn't have a badge" isn't gonna make anyone safer or the force stronger. "One bad apple" doesn't explain what the other apples are doing to save the bushel. This cop literally said he was going to shoot her in the face.... over sme boiling water he lawfully directed her to handle. Oh well, at least he as at the right address.

I've personally recommended two officers for termination as a supervisor. I've personally started investigations that were referred to internal affairs. I've personally referred officers to wellness/fitness for duty due to changes in personality/work product. I've personally suggested to people that maybe this job just wasn't for them for reasons other than bad behavior, mental health, etc. because they just sucked at it or had the wrong mindset and were going to get themselves, a partner, or the general citizenry hurt because of it.

I doubt I'm unique in any of this and it's often the worst part of the job.

You'll never hear about the details for the same reason you won't see many people talking about firing people at any job. Liability, supervisors are generally precluded from discussing personnel matters outside of "need to know" in any field, limitations on public posts that paint your employer negatively, etc.

 

[BigRed]

I've personally recommended two officers for termination as a supervisor. I've personally started investigations that were referred to internal affairs. I've personally referred officers to wellness/fitness for duty due to changes in personality/work product. I've personally suggested to people that maybe this job just wasn't for them for reasons other than bad behavior, mental health, etc. because they just sucked at it or had the wrong mindset and were going to get themselves, a partner, or the general citizenry hurt because of it.

Yeah.... but did you ever rebuke an officer in the name of Jesus?

 

[Brad69]

What’s strange in the Trucking industry has a website that most large corporations use.
It gives the details on drivers and why they were terminated
for example.
Immediate rehire great driver
Quit under load
5 chargeable accidents
Failed drug test
History of missed appointments

I wonder why we don’t have a data base of LEO’s it would stop them from department hopping.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I wonder why we don’t have a data base of LEO’s it would stop them from department hopping.

1) Lawyers

2) See #1

 

[manifest destiny]

I've personally recommended two officers for termination as a supervisor. I've personally started investigations that were referred to internal affairs. I've personally referred officers to wellness/fitness for duty due to changes in personality/work product. I've personally suggested to people that maybe this job just wasn't for them for reasons other than bad behavior, mental health, etc. because they just sucked at it or had the wrong mindset and were going to get themselves, a partner, or the general citizenry hurt because of it.

I doubt I'm unique in any of this and it's often the worst part of the job.

You'll never hear about the details for the same reason you won't see many people talking about firing people at any job. Liability, supervisors are generally precluded from discussing personnel matters outside of "need to know" in any field, limitations on public posts that paint your employer negatively, etc.

I'm sure your efforts are made by other supervisors. And I appreciate such efforts. But from the outside looking in, it seems easier to pawn off a bad officer on another force/employer than it is to remove them from this line of work. This officer had 6 jobs in 4 years, reasons unknown of course. Still, it looks fishy. Given the nature of the work it would seem LE would/should be more transparent when hiring a cop from another force. Nobody is perfect but if supra-authority is given to leo's, then supra-punishment should be applied to leo's when they screw the pooch or hurt someone.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

I'm sure your efforts are made by other supervisors. And I appreciate such efforts. But from the outside looking in, it seems easier to pawn off a bad officer on another force/employer than it is to remove them from this line of work.

It is easier. Same as it's easier to not give a tenant a bad review so they become some other landlord's problem.

There's also the simple fact that if someone resigns and it's not a criminal matter, you're done. Same as any job.

But here's the thing: If you don't want over politicized policing than you do need job protection based on merit and that means it's a process to fire someone. It is not difficult to find at will police departments, especially in the south. I can arrest the mayor's buddy and while it may hamper my odds at political appointment it won't put my job at risk. I'm not put in the position of risking my career to do the right thing. Now consider at at will job and the different pressures that would create.

Add in I could be a **** supervisor with a hard on for someone I just don't like. The smaller the department, the harder it is to get away from me. Now what if I can not not only screw you at this department, but every department?

Reasonable people can differ on where the line is drawn, but like many things there are second and third order effects to these decisions.

 

[Ziggidy]

Psychological issues, most likley. Anger control problems. Listen to his words after he shoots her. He knows he ****ed up. His issues finally caught up with him. Doesn't require anything supernatural. Humanity is filled with people like this. Some of them unfortunately acquire a badge.

I can understand that.

If you think it has anything to do with supernatural good vs evil, I've got some bad news for you. The demons usually win.

I already know who wins in the end.

I hear leo's say some guys just aren't good cops. I believe they're being honest when they say it. What I never hear is what leo's are doing to remove the bad cops. "They shouldn't have a badge" isn't gonna make anyone safer or the force stronger. "One bad apple" doesn't explain what the other apples are doing to save the bushel. This cop literally said he was going to shoot her in the face.... over sme boiling water he lawfully directed her to handle. Oh well, at least he as at the right address.

I think the Leo's you speak of go to work for FBI or if they are lucky enough, the SS. It's all about DEI today.

 

[Ziggidy]

I'm sure your efforts are made by other supervisors. And I appreciate such efforts. But from the outside looking in, it seems easier to pawn off a bad officer on another force/employer than it is to remove them from this line of work. This officer had 6 jobs in 4 years, reasons unknown of course. Still, it looks fishy. Given the nature of the work it would seem LE would/should be more transparent when hiring a cop from another force. Nobody is perfect but if supra-authority is given to leo's, then supra-punishment should be applied to leo's when they screw the pooch or hurt someone.

I agree but look at the trends over the last 2o years versus prior years. Leo's have been frowned upon for some time now. Some Leo's, the good ones, are getting fed up and leaving. Defunding. Prosecutors not supporting cops but support the criminal openly. Add DEI to the equation and who knows what else. It's a trend we're seeing in many areas; medical certainly comes mind.

Result is a bad cop is better than no cop. These bad cops give the good ones a bad name and the cycle grows.

When did all this start?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

When did all this start?

It's a pendulum that swings in our country over the course of decades. Literally none of this is new, though it's arguably amplified by social media and the 24/7 multichannel media blast. "Pig" was popularized in the 1960s. There was much weeping and gnashing of teeth over black police officers. There was much weeping and gnashing of teeth over female police officers. (Same for military integration, that day's equivalent of 'woke military').

Another 9/11, we'll be heroes again. Another George Floyd we'll be villains again.

In the meantime, social standing has fallen and financial standing has not risen, there are plenty of alternatives for the best and brightest, and recruiting shows the results. DEI doesn't matter in the slightest if your applicant pool is minimal to begin with. You want good *anything* you have to pay for it one way or the other.

 

[freekforge]

It's as real as any reality show. Literally thousands of hours of video carefully selected for the most interesting to an audience bits, perhaps artfully edited, etc.

They've ridden with us before, and the camera crews for Cops were pretty solid dudes but I would never have a crew ride with me any more than I'll do media interviews. They have an agenda and know how to take 1+2 to make 4 if it's more interesting because interesting is money in the attention based economy.

Just be a small town cop like I was then no one will want to watch you. Eating gas station pizza and then immediately crapping your guts out due to said gas station pizza multiple times in a 12 hour shift, staring at the the only stoplight in town, then chasing chickens doesn't lend itself to reality tv.

 

[Ziggidy]

It's a pendulum that swings in our country over the course of decades. Literally none of this is new, though it's arguably amplified by social media and the 24/7 multichannel media blast. "Pig" was popularized in the 1960s. There was much weeping and gnashing of teeth over black police officers. There was much weeping and gnashing of teeth over female police officers. (Same for military integration, that day's equivalent of 'woke military').

Another 9/11, we'll be heroes again. Another George Floyd we'll be villains again.

In the meantime, social standing has fallen and financial standing has not risen, there are plenty of alternatives for the best and brightest, and recruiting shows the results. DEI doesn't matter in the slightest if your applicant pool is minimal to begin with. You want good *anything* you have to pay for it one way or the other.

I forgot about the PIG era. I can remember posters that tried to combat that; Pride, Integrity, Guts. I never fit into the anti establishment group. Had friends (?) in high school who tried to get me to join the Students for a Democratic Society; which aligned with the Weather Underground. I considered myself a democrat back then but not that far left. Needless to say, we separated our ways.

Didn't mean to sidetrack the thread. You mentioned PIG and started reminiscing.