What's up with the rebel flags?

[Indy_Guy_77]

i can say that in my experience, there is a LOT of racism in Indiana, much more than i ever experienced in Ohio (and yes,i realize there are racists everywhere...i just see more of them here). the flag itself may not stand for slavery.
buti am pretty sure most of the confederate flag bearers, at least when i see them in muncie, are just racist hillbillies. and i have met plenty of those.

Racist...or bigoted?

BIG difference, and most folks don't know betwixt the two.

-J-

 

[360]

I'd rather see the real general lee and not all jacked up like that. But I love the ole Dukes. And at least a couple times a week at work I'll give out a loud rebel yell when its time to go. Just like Bo normally did when they jumped the General.

Would you like to see the most recent version?

Or how about some variants?

Damn, there were a bunch.

 

[hotfarmboy1]

Ok the jeep, and the Dukes of Fallujah painted Humvee look kinda cool. But the rest make me wish I had eye bleach and a huge sledgehammer. They are just insults to the orig.

 

[tom1025]

If southerners are such dumb slave owning rednecks how come you never hear of anyone retireing to the NORTH ???

 

[hotfarmboy1]

Plus something some people seem to forget. When settlers came to America from England they were slave owners because alot of England was slave owners. They just carried on the tradition. It didn't start here...

Plus even after slavery was outlawed in the south. There were some slaves that didn't want to leave where they were cause it was the only life they knew and they actually liked it. They had a roof over their head, food to eat, and a bit of change in their pocket.

I'm not saying in any way that I approve of slavery. Just saying you can also look at it from different angles, and there are some things that people often forget or don't think about. These are some of those things..

 

[360]

Ok the jeep, and the Dukes of Fallujah painted Humvee look kinda cool. But the rest make me wish I had eye bleach and a huge sledgehammer. They are just insults to the orig.

How can you say that about the last one? It is the ORIGINAL. LOL

 

[hotfarmboy1]

How can you say that about the last one? It is the ORIGINAL. LOL

I mean the original car.

 

[photoshooter]

Here's an interesting exercise. Compare and contrast the changes the Confederates made to their Constitution. They basically took the US Constitution and "fixed it". This site does a side by side comparison of the two documents and lists the differences (usually additional restrictions on the power of the federal government by the Constituion) Constitution of the Confederate States of America- what was changed?

To understand "Fixing it", and get the underlying economic and states rights issues, you have to 1. Ignore the slavery issue (for the moment) and 2. Understand how great the loopholes for Federalism were that Alexander Hamilton wheedled into the Constitution for the United States.

I lament that Jefferson was overseas for most of the original Constitution Convention and missed out on forcing stronger language for States' rights.

Up until the Tea Party movement kicked off this past year, I always considered Lincoln to be a noble man, the one responsible for freeing the slaves. I've since learned that the damage he did to our Constitutional liberties may be irreversible.

Now, I'm coming to understand him as just another cog in the Hamiltonian Federalist Machine. Lincoln often listed himself as "an old Henry Clay whig"... Clay was a major Hamiltonian, supporting Tarrifs, Corporate Welfare, and nationalized banking - all issues that we're still fighting against today.

Clay, Lincoln, and a long line of Federalists stretch from Hamilton to present day, and most of the blame for our Constitution's erosion can be laid directly at their feet due to such issues.

Issues such as creating a centralized federal run bank (the Federal Reserve for today's mess), the power of Congress to regulate ANY business endeavor via the "interstate commerce" clause, the power of congress to levy taxes in a progressive manner or on specific items, Tariffs (which dramatically hampered the agricultural South while aiding the manufacturing North) and the moving of power from the States to the Centralized Federal government was the dream of Hamilton.

Take a look at where we are today - especially the issues that the Tea Party is moving to repeal or roll back - and you'll see Hamilton's hand, Lincoln's war, and the Progressive movement (17th and 18th amendments) all tied neatly together.

I just find it sad and disturbing that the two most important issues since our Country's birth, ending Slavery and maintaining States' rights were tied up into the same battle. By winning the freedom for all men and women, we insured our own slavery to the Federal government for generations to come.

 

[elemonator]

What about 'them Dukes, them Dukes...'he he..

 

[ThrottleJockey]

the election of Lincoln. and why was that? because he was anti-slavery.

Ummm, big fat NO. Abe Lincoln did not care one way or the other about slavery. See this video, from about 3:00-3:22.
YouTube - SA@Takimag - Being Honest About Abe

 

[printcraft]

Nazi's - clearly nazi's........

 

[tenring]

Seems that a lot of people forget where the origin of the slave market was at during that time, and still exists to this day. To call the descendants of those individuals with a hyphenated nomenclature would, at the least, call for everyone on this board to search their heritage and insist that they be addressed as an ________-American. As for me, my great, great, grandparents are buried in a cemetery in Hamburg, Germany, so am I a German-American? I could not care less. When doing my tour in Viet Nam, their were several Confederate flags flying over the "hoocthes", which meant that the majority of the occupants were from south of the Mason-Dixon line, and no more. The Civil War was about State's Rights, slavery being the instigator. Lincoln could not have cared less about Negroes, and that is a historical fact, just depends on how much your mind is made up on the subject. Taxes on the Southerners by the Federal government were a major sore point of many, which can be mirrored by the events of today, and especially of tomorrow, with the Health Bill still being written behind closed doors contrary to what our current POTUS has promised on at least eight occasions. Want to read a "racists" piece of legislation? Read the Health Bill [all of it, including the amendments and proposals], every line, every last page, Argue all you want over what a flag stands for, while you can.

 

[Joe Williams]

Would you like to see the most recent version?



Or how about some variants?

Damn, there were a bunch.

I get a kick out of those two LOL.

 

[Ol'Bluesmoke]

My Family has fought and died under every flag this country has flown. Tread lightly with your ignorance.

There was as much Honor, maybe even more Honor under tha Stars and Bars than what was displayed by the Armies of the Potomic...

Ignorance? Tread lightly with your arrogance.

 

[Ol'Bluesmoke]

I wonder how much negative rep this thread has generated for ol'bluesmoke? I'm not going to add to it, his ignorance is clear. I have however added some rep to those who got it right.

Actually this thread added to my rep because there are many who are not as bombastic as a few here and clearly agreed with my stance, but silently. As far as rep goes I would not hit someone with a neg rep because they think differently than I.

 

[Ol'Bluesmoke]

you guys crack me up. saying that slavery wasnt a main cause of the civil war....lolz then as a defense this link was posted, (not that i think this is some end-all source):
Top Five Causes of the Civil War

and notice how much slavery figures into the "top 5 reasons." yes, it was a "States' Rights" thing. and yes there were other issues such as tariffs, etc, but slavery was far and away the lightening rod. remember what actually caused the southern states to succede? the election of Lincoln. and why was that? because he was anti-slavery.

i can say that in my experience, there is a LOT of racism in Indiana, much more than i ever experienced in Ohio (and yes,i realize there are racists everywhere...i just see more of them here). the flag itself may not stand for slavery.
buti am pretty sure most of the confederate flag bearers, at least when i see them in muncie, are just racist hillbillies. and i have met plenty of those.

You got it man +1

 

[LEaSH]

I know of a few southern people that might be called pacifists.

I've known them long enough to tell they had not a racist bone in their bodies. Maybe they have a strong attraction to their family heritage and style. They aren't apologetic for things they haven't done and I agree they shouldn't be.

They don't use that flag as a fashion statement and they don't seem to care about people that do so.

People are sensitive. Minorities are incredibly sensitive. I try to accommodate that sensitivity out of courtesy and respect for others' feelings. But I don't like being told how I should feel. I was born in 1972, and never exploited anyone. My people came to this country long after the civil war, but it still fascinates me.

It's an important symbol. It's not something I view as racist. But some people will view a guy driving a plain F150 as a probable racist - it's absurd.

 

[jsgolfman]

you guys crack me up. saying that slavery wasnt a main cause of the civil war....lolz then as a defense this link was posted, (not that i think this is some end-all source):
Top Five Causes of the Civil War

and notice how much slavery figures into the "top 5 reasons." yes, it was a "States' Rights" thing. and yes there were other issues such as tariffs, etc, but slavery was far and away the lightening rod. remember what actually caused the southern states to succede? the election of Lincoln. and why was that? because he was anti-slavery.

i can say that in my experience, there is a LOT of racism in Indiana, much more than i ever experienced in Ohio (and yes,i realize there are racists everywhere...i just see more of them here). the flag itself may not stand for slavery.
buti am pretty sure most of the confederate flag bearers, at least when i see them in muncie, are just racist hillbillies. and i have met plenty of those.

If you want to talk about racism, that's fine, but if you want to talk about the war you need to do a little more research than reading an About.com article by a high school social studies teacher.
Most of the states that did secede did so prior to the election, not after. If you want to list causes, slavery doesn't even hit the list until at least 7 or 8, maybe later, and even then it's an issue of control, not human rights. How about this top 5 list instead:
1. Tariffs
2. State rights
3. Control of Western Territories
4. Southern Resources coveted by Northern Industrialists
5. Growth of the State and centralization of power

Not to mention the fact that Dishonest Abe and his minions wanted war in the worst way.
Go pick up a copy of "The Real Lincoln" or "Lincoln Unmasked".

 

[Phil502]

I guess Arlington National Cemetary has a racist section because there is a Confederate Monument there. Heres the link with racist flag pictures too.
Now lets talk about how fair the Reconstruction was to southern men.

Confederate Memorial At Arlington National Cemetery

 

[infidel]

WHAT on earth is that bulge hanging from between ummmm, her? legs????

ETA nevermind, just wasn't looking at the monitor from the correct angle....

Biology class will be held on Thursday nights at the local Hooters. Your questions should be printed out in advance because there will be so many others asking for information also.

No thats not a gun .....She is just happy to see you ....lol

And in an attempt to lighten the current mood...