vote on banning male circumcision - Only In California

[dross]

The penis isn't exactly pleasant to look at as it is, ...

I've often heard different.

Just sayin'.

 

[PatriotPride]

Yes, I can see what you mean. Let me put this into perspective from someone with experience... I have more hands on experience in the penis world and can say that there is a little difference in nerve response to circumcised vs non-circumsized. That being said that's only average... as some people are not affected at all, and generally the effect is only minimal. In my world it makes no difference. There is absolutely no doubt that circumcision helps fight all kinds of VD's, and hygiene helps but it doesn't cover it all. Why don't they have it done as adults? Because more nerve endings, blood flow, and development occurs there as you get older. Adult circumcision can be an almost crippling experience, but when done as a youth minimal pain, and minimal recovery time. Some gay people prefer one way or another and sometimes gay men get it done... most take a week off of work, and are in tons of pain. So if YOU ARE thinking its a good idea get it done young, and if you don't want to likely you will be fine anyway about it. And the biggest part... if you go to San Francisco the boys will like you both ways LOL LOL LOL

What the **** is this ****?

 

[Hawkeye]

Human genital mutilation - a barbaric custom. Steeped in religious superstition and justified by pseudo-science.

 

[PatriotPride]

Human genital mutilation - a barbaric custom. Steeped in religious superstition and justified by pseudo-science.

Says you.

 

[RelicHound]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qytw2eCi7-0[/ame]

 

[Rookie]

I had the old snip the tip when I was first born. It was traumatic.


I couldn't walk for a year.

 

[rjstew317]

I had the old snip the tip when I was first born. It was traumatic.


I couldn't walk for a year.

or speak!

 

[chraland51]

Heck, my circumcision right after birth traumatized me so much that I wet and soiled myself for nearly two years after the procedure. I eventually recoverd with the help of a very loving and caring set or parents. I went nuts and would not speak for quite some time after I had my tonsils forceably removed at around the age of two-just one traumatic procedure after another. These were probably recommended by some greedy doctor.

 

[Zephri]

I've often heard different.

Just sayin'.

I'm going have to agree with this, I quite like the way they look.

 

[randyb]

They can have my penis when the pry it from my cold dead fingers.....oh wait, that is my PISTOL. Yeah.....
On a serious note though. Government needs to stay away from such issues. Leave parenting to parents. Nanny states are alot of the problem we are facing right now. If its for religious, cultural, whatever issues, it is the right of the parent to determine care of their child. The same choice as feeding them, raising them with a moral compass, and educating them and preparing them for life. Next thing you know they will be taxing people who have foreskin, or not.....

 

[rjstew317]

A foreskin tax..................

 

[Paco Bedejo]

Government needs to stay away from such issues. Leave parenting to parents. Nanny states are alot of the problem we are facing right now. If its for religious, cultural, whatever issues, it is the right of the parent to determine care of their child.

So, you'd be fine if parents decided to have wings tattooed onto their 3 year old girl's back, elongated her neck with rings, put a plate in her lower lip, plugs in her earlobes, & pierced her clitoris?

 

[rjstew317]

So, you'd be fine if parents decided to have wings tattooed onto their 3 year old girl's back, elongated her neck with rings, put a plate in her lower lip, plugs in her earlobes, & pierced her clitoris?

show where these things have a medical benefit. there is proof that circumcision has a medical benefit whether you choose to believe it or not, and there have been first hand experience examples posted right here in this thread.
the comparison is weak at best.

 

[Paco Bedejo]

show where these things have a medical benefit. there is proof that circumcision has a medical benefit whether you choose to believe it or not, and there have been first hand experience examples posted right here in this thread.
the comparison is weak at best.

The oft-touted medical "benefits" of circumcision are weak at best, as well.

From: Circumcision Vs Uncircumcised

Lack of circumcision:

• Is responsible for a 12-fold higher risk of urinary tract infections in infancy. Risk = 1 in 20 to 1 in 50 for uncircumcised infants and 1 in 200 to 1 in 500 for circumcised infants. Higher risk of UTI at older ages as well. Overall lifetime cumulative prevalence of UTI = 1 in 3 for uncircumcised males compared with 1 in 20 for circumcised males, respectively.

Washcloth?

• Confers a higher risk of death in the first year of life (from complications of urinary tract infections: namely kidney failure, meningitis and infection of bone marrow).

Another washcloth?

• One in ~400–900 uncircumcised men will get cancer of the penis, which occurs more than 20 times more commonly in uncircumcised men. A quarter of these will die from it and the rest will require complete or partial penile amputation as a result. (In contrast, invasive penile cancer never occurs or is extraordinarily rare in men circumcised at birth.) (Data from studies in the USA, Denmark and Australia, which are not to be confused with the often quoted, but misleading, annual incidence figure of 1 in 100,000).

This argument could easily be used to encourage removal of women's breast tissue.

• Higher risk of prostate cancer (50–100% higher in uncircumcised men)

This argument also could easily be used to encourage removal of women's breast tissue.

• Is associated with 3-fold higher risk of inflammation and infection of the skin of the penis. This includes balanitis (inflammation of the glans), posthitis (inflammation of the foreskin), balanoposthitis (inflammation of glans and foreskin), phimosis (inability to retract the foreskin) and paraphimosis (constriction of the penis by a tight foreskin that will not return after retraction). Up to 18% of uncircumcised boys will develop one of these by 8 years of age, whereas all are unknown or much rarer in the circumcised. Risk of balanoposthitis = 1 in 6. Obstruction to urine flow = 1 in 10–50. Risk of these is even higher in diabetic men.

1 in 5 might have some discomfort which requires medical attention. Might as well cut it off immediately, eh?

• Means increased risk of problems that may necessitate 1 in 10 older children and men requiring circumcision later in life, when the cost is 10 times higher, the procedure is less convenient, and the cosmetic result can be lesser, as stitches or tissue glue are required, as compared with circumcisions done in infancy.

Well, because 10% might have to have it done later, might as well take the other 90%'s.

• Increases by 2–4 fold the risk of thrush and sexually transmitted infections such as human papillomavirus (HPV), genital herpes (HSV-2), syphilis, chancroid, Trichomonas vaginalis and thrush.

This issue shouldn't effect children.

• Is the biggest risk factor for heterosexually-acquired AIDS virus infection in men. 2 to 8-times higher risk by itself, and even higher when lesions from STIs are added in. Risk per exposure = 1 in 300.

This issue also shouldn't effect children.

• In the female partners of uncircumcised men lack of male circumcision is associated with an up to 5 fold higher incidence of cervical cancer (caused by sexually transmitted HPV), genital herpes, Trichomonas vaginalis, bacterial vaginosis (formerly called “Gardnerella”), and possibly Chlamydia (which is a cause of pelvic inflammatory disease, infertility from blockage of fallopian tubes, and ectopic pregnancy).

This issue also shouldn't effect children.

Unless you're unaware of how a washcloth & soap work or willing to surgically remove girls' breast tissue, there's no valid argument for male genital mutilation prior to becoming sexually active other than "well, doing it later might hurt & be less appealing to the eye".

 

[Wingcollector]

First, I believe the majority of folks in California are a little nuts S.F. seems to be crazier than most. I have heard this measure has no chance due to the fact that restricts religious freedom. The argument that it is like female circumcision is quite frankly ridiculous, getting "snipped" does not lesson sensation. I have two boys and we decided to have the procedure done, for many reasons. I sat in on both procedures, and yes it was tough to watch. While I don't remember my own procedure but I will tell you that the reaction was about the same "crying wise" as a really bad case of diaper rash. Why did we chose to do it? I have many Doctors in my family, and they ALL recommended it for various medically based reasons in the area of infection control and overall cleanliness.
I believe its a personal choice and that the government ( or any activist, gay, straight, etc.) has NO business intruding in this area!

From the Mayo Clinic:
Circumcision may have various health benefits, including:

• Easier hygiene. Circumcision makes it easier to wash the penis — although washing beneath the foreskin of an uncircumcised penis isn't generally difficult.
• Decreased risk of urinary tract infections. The overall risk of urinary tract infections in males is low, but these infections may be more common in uncircumcised males. Severe infections early in life can lead to kidney problems later on.
• Prevention of penile problems. Occasionally, the foreskin on an uncircumcised penis may be difficult or impossible to retract (phimosis). This can also lead to inflammation of the foreskin or head of the penis.
• Decreased risk of penile cancer. Although cancer of the penis is rare, it's less common in circumcised men. In addition, cervical cancer is less common in the female sexual partners of circumcised men.
• Decreased risk of sexually transmitted infections. Safe sexual practices remain essential, but circumcised men may have a lower risk of certain sexually transmitted infections — including HIV, the virus that causes AIDS.

 

[Fletch]

The argument that it is like female circumcision is quite frankly ridiculous, getting "snipped" does not lesson sensation.

...

While I don't remember my own procedure...

Then how would you know? If you've "always" been circumcised, you have nothing to compare your present level of sensation to. Only a sexually active, uncircumcised man who elects to have the procedure has the experience necessary to say for sure.

Circumcision may have various health benefits, including:

People who buy lottery tickets may have a chance of winning a giant pile of money. Does that make it a compelling investment strategy?

 

[rjstew317]

The oft-touted medical "benefits" of circumcision are weak at best, as well.

From: Circumcision Vs Uncircumcised

Lack of circumcision:



Washcloth?



Another washcloth?



This argument could easily be used to encourage removal of women's breast tissue.



This argument also could easily be used to encourage removal of women's breast tissue.



1 in 5 might have some discomfort which requires medical attention. Might as well cut it off immediately, eh?



Well, because 10% might have to have it done later, might as well take the other 90%'s.



This issue shouldn't effect children.



This issue also shouldn't effect children.



This issue also shouldn't effect children.

Unless you're unaware of how a washcloth & soap work or willing to surgically remove girls' breast tissue, there's no valid argument for male genital mutilation prior to becoming sexually active other than "well, doing it later might hurt & be less appealing to the eye".

Again I say, you have been given first hand experience examples right here in this thread to attest to the benefits. I work in the medical field and am more inclined to believe my own experience and two eyes, then something you read on the internet.
again, I'm not the one advocating for the government to intervene in this matter

 

[ljadayton]

I LOVE this thread

To me it's the only one that matters. When the times comes, I won't be using yours

NICE!!

leave it to me to derail a thread

Uh yeah, I do what I can

I've often heard different.

I'm going have to agree with this, I quite like the way they look.

I second this I have NO problem looking at them....

 

[rjstew317]

If you don't agree with it then don't do it

 

[ATF Consumer]