VIDEO - Officers threatens to execute Ohio CCW holder

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  • henktermaat

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    Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I agree with nearly everything Scutter has said in this thread... but it seems to me I've seen the "basher" label thrown around for similar statements referring to "closing ranks".

    It certainly speaks to how combustible these issues are becoming.

    Another agreement. I don't think it's wrong, per se... Scutter is entitled to his opinions and I would not personally classify his comments as "cop bashing..." but yeah. I noticed that too.

    We love ya, Scutter :)
     

    SirRealism

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    eric001

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    Fair warning: :soapbox:

    From the way the (hopefully soon to be once and former) officer was acting, I can say I'm honestly surprised that he didn't in fact beat or do worse to the driver. I'd also say that this one officer's actions have undoubtedly increased feelings of hostility and mistrust in many, many people.

    However, the borderline (?) insane actions of one idiot should NEVER be used to judge EVERY person in that field, no matter what field it may be. Ever had to deal with a lousy landscaper or plumber, or even with a bad lawyer, judge or cop?? Is everyone in each of those professions an incompetent, dangerously rabid animal that should be thrown behind bars for ever and ever???

    Howling for the blood of all people in a profession because they don't actively shun that one idiot fast enough or vehemently enough is at best just an emotional over-reaction and at worst a clear sign of not thinking things through.

    Would anybody ever want to face this scenario where their life is in the hands of an out of control officer--NO!! But how many times, in today's age of information overkill, do people have to face this kind of scenario?? Often enough to rebel against ALL officers EVERYWHERE who are doing their duties as best they can? Unless that really IS the case, perhaps we would be better off waiting for due process (remember the phrase "innocent until proven guilty"??) takes its course...and get upset and vocal if justice is NOT served.

    Any two people can ALWAYS find a reason to hate each other--the trick is in overlooking those reasons so we can live with each other without hating those around us! :twocents:
     

    SirRealism

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    Fair warning: :soapbox:

    From the way the (hopefully soon to be once and former) officer was acting, I can say I'm honestly surprised that he didn't in fact beat or do worse to the driver. I'd also say that this one officer's actions have undoubtedly increased feelings of hostility and mistrust in many, many people.

    However, the borderline (?) insane actions of one idiot should NEVER be used to judge EVERY person in that field, no matter what field it may be. Ever had to deal with a lousy landscaper or plumber, or even with a bad lawyer, judge or cop?? Is everyone in each of those professions an incompetent, dangerously rabid animal that should be thrown behind bars for ever and ever???

    Howling for the blood of all people in a profession because they don't actively shun that one idiot fast enough or vehemently enough is at best just an emotional over-reaction and at worst a clear sign of not thinking things through.

    Would anybody ever want to face this scenario where their life is in the hands of an out of control officer--NO!! But how many times, in today's age of information overkill, do people have to face this kind of scenario?? Often enough to rebel against ALL officers EVERYWHERE who are doing their duties as best they can? Unless that really IS the case, perhaps we would be better off waiting for due process (remember the phrase "innocent until proven guilty"??) takes its course...and get upset and vocal if justice is NOT served.

    Any two people can ALWAYS find a reason to hate each other--the trick is in overlooking those reasons so we can live with each other without hating those around us! :twocents:

    I'll wait for a jury to find him guilty of a crime, if that's the case. I won't wait to condemn him... I've seen the video.
     

    henktermaat

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    Fair warning: :soapbox:

    From the way the (hopefully soon to be once and former) officer was acting, I can say I'm honestly surprised that he didn't in fact beat or do worse to the driver. I'd also say that this one officer's actions have undoubtedly increased feelings of hostility and mistrust in many, many people.

    However, the borderline (?) insane actions of one idiot should NEVER be used to judge EVERY person in that field, no matter what field it may be. Ever had to deal with a lousy landscaper or plumber, or even with a bad lawyer, judge or cop?? Is everyone in each of those professions an incompetent, dangerously rabid animal that should be thrown behind bars for ever and ever???

    Howling for the blood of all people in a profession because they don't actively shun that one idiot fast enough or vehemently enough is at best just an emotional over-reaction and at worst a clear sign of not thinking things through.

    Would anybody ever want to face this scenario where their life is in the hands of an out of control officer--NO!! But how many times, in today's age of information overkill, do people have to face this kind of scenario?? Often enough to rebel against ALL officers EVERYWHERE who are doing their duties as best they can? Unless that really IS the case, perhaps we would be better off waiting for due process (remember the phrase "innocent until proven guilty"??) takes its course...and get upset and vocal if justice is NOT served.

    Any two people can ALWAYS find a reason to hate each other--the trick is in overlooking those reasons so we can live with each other without hating those around us! :twocents:

    I hear you and agree, but your post is just a distraction, a Straw Man. No one here is "Howling for the blood of all people in a profession" :rolleyes:
     

    Jack Burton

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    I hear you and agree, but your post is just a distraction, a Straw Man. No one here is "Howling for the blood of all people in a profession" :rolleyes:

    What many people are asking for, though (and rightfully so) is a general uprising of LEOs everywhere saying they are just not going to tolerate that in their ranks. Not just a few, and not even just many. This affects the entire LEO community in a highly negative light, and if the entire community won't condemn it then we are justified in asking why not.
     

    techres

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    Rarely in this day and age do you find a good example of something that is clearly right or wrong. Usually there is some muck, some wigggle room, some area for "possible misunderstanding", some.... well, you get the point.

    This is one of those rare examples.

    This officer is way out of line and crosses several in the process of incriminating himself and shaming his profession. The officer with him chose not to stop the spiral and for that he owns part of this situation as well.

    The department decided not to act on this immediately but moved to not act and now they own it too. That puts every officer in their department to shame and in a more difficult work environment.

    One of the people involved in this case is a great guy I have known for years. He always prefers to solve things the easy and kind way. The department refused that. So now they get to eat the viral mess they forced to happen through their stonewalling.

    The officer was beyond stupid in his lack of self control, the partner stupid in not taking over control of a spiraling situation and the department was stupid for thinking this would just disappear if they made the tape unavailable and pressured for a deal with the defendant.

    And as they say, "You play stupid games, you win stupid prizes."
     

    ryknoll3

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    I'll wait for a jury to find him guilty of a crime, if that's the case. I won't wait to condemn him... I've seen the video.

    This post was a response to misreading SirRealism's post. I apologize and remove my comments.
     
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    SirRealism

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    So the only way you find those actions condemnable is if he is found guilty of a crime? How could this behaviour by a sworn officer EVER EVER be acceptable, especially considering the guy was COMPLETELY compliant and non-threatening. This wasnt a guy who was subdued after putting a gun to one of their heads. He just didn't notify them fast enough in their opinion. This behavior is NEVER acceptable by anyone, but especially someone bestowed with authority to protect and serve. This behavior should be condemned by everyone, every time!

    You say you saw the video. If you can't say that was conduct and character worthy of condemnation...... your morals scare me.

    I think you might need to re-read my post.
     

    henktermaat

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    So the only way you find those actions condemnable is if he is found guilty of a crime? How could this behaviour by a sworn officer EVER EVER be acceptable, especially considering the guy was COMPLETELY compliant and non-threatening. This wasnt a guy who was subdued after putting a gun to one of their heads. He just didn't notify them fast enough in their opinion. This behavior is NEVER acceptable by anyone, but especially someone bestowed with authority to protect and serve. This behavior should be condemned by everyone, every time!

    You say you saw the video. If you can't say that was conduct and character worthy of condemnation...... your morals scare me.

    I think you mistook what he meant there...
     

    eric001

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    I hear you and agree, but your post is just a distraction, a Straw Man. No one here is "Howling for the blood of all people in a profession" :rolleyes:

    Not trying to be obnoxious here, but even though I'm still a nube, I've seen several instances of the "us versus them" flag being waved in many different threads, when what started it all was a single instance or action by a single person. I'm just trying (probably unsuccessfully, I guess) to get folks to look at this as what it is--a single case where one (arguably two) LEO(s) went WAY off the deep end, and should reap all the ill effects legally due him (them?) for doing so. I've got NO problem with one or both officers never wearing a badge again because of their recorded actions on the video, but I despise the inclination among many to make it an all or nothing situation involving dislike/mistrust/shunning/etc. involved in that "us versus them" mindset.
     

    Scutter01

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    Do you realize that some of your statements are in line with a lot of people that have earned the "cop basher" label?

    Yeah, that's what I was thinking. I agree with nearly everything Scutter has said in this thread... but it seems to me I've seen the "basher" label thrown around for similar statements referring to "closing ranks".

    It certainly speaks to how combustible these issues are becoming.

    Another agreement. I don't think it's wrong, per se... Scutter is entitled to his opinions and I would not personally classify his comments as "cop bashing..." but yeah. I noticed that too.

    We love ya, Scutter :)

    I have worked VERY hard to stay as neutral as I can in the pro/anti-cop fights on INGO because I have a responsibility as a moderator here. I've taken an unbelievable amount of grief as a result, as I am right now from the three people quoted above (as gentle and as polite as they're being). I've had members of both sides (both cop-bashers AND cops) physically threaten both me and members of my family because I wasn't 100% on their side, or because I didn't spank the other side in the way they felt I should. I think I'm MORE than entitled to a little leeway in stating my opinion and I'll not apologize for it.
     

    henktermaat

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    Not trying to be obnoxious here, but even though I'm still a nube, I've seen several instances of the "us versus them" flag being waved in many different threads, when what started it all was a single instance or action by a single person. I'm just trying (probably unsuccessfully, I guess) to get folks to look at this as what it is--a single case where one (arguably two) LEO(s) went WAY off the deep end, and should reap all the ill effects legally due him (them?) for doing so. I've got NO problem with one or both officers never wearing a badge again because of their recorded actions on the video, but I despise the inclination among many to make it an all or nothing situation involving dislike/mistrust/shunning/etc. involved in that "us versus them" mindset.

    You being a nube has nothing to do with anything dude.
    People are outraged and rightly so, but no one if calling for blood of all n the LEO profession (OK, well Dross just did :): )
     

    GuyRelford

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    I love and support LEOs. As I've said before, I can't imagine what it's like to walk up to car windows time after time, not knowing whether you're going to be greeted with a smile or the barrel of a sawed-off shotgun. I think the vast majority of our LEOs are heroes.

    But for any LEO to defend the actions we saw on this video - whether the driver technically violated Ohio's "duty to inform" law or not - will produce a rift between law-abiding citizens and LEOs that will take a very long time to heal.
     

    littletommy

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    The best thing about a thread like this is that you quickly find out who is who! :ingo:

    I'm going to leave it to the rest of you experts to figure out. Thanks for the lively discussion.
    What's to figure out, I don't need a judge or jury to tell me what I actually saw on video, the dumb ass cop video, mind you. What If I saw it in person? what if I walk out my front door and see a dog ****ting in my yard, do I need to wait for a courtroom decision before I go tell the neighbor to keep his damn dog in his own yard? I know where your coming from with the legalities of everything that happened, but I also know just because the court hands down a decision...that doesn't mean it's right. I think what infuriates non LEOs the most is seeing stuff like this happen, and the cop getting away with some departmental slap on the wrist. I understand innocent til proven guilty, but I think if this kind of crap is allowed to continue due to legal technicalities, the whole system might as well go out the window anyway.
     

    littletommy

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    I love and support LEOs. As I've said before, I can't imagine what it's like to walk up to car windows time after time, not knowing whether you're going to be greeted with a smile or the barrel of a sawed-off shotgun. I think the vast majority of our LEOs are heroes.

    But for any LEO to defend the actions we saw on this video - whether the driver technically violated Ohio's "duty to inform" law or not - will produce a rift between law-abiding citizens and LEOs that will take a very long time to heal.
    Very well said!:yesway:
     
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