UFC Lesnar vs Carwin, You Call It!

[FordMan08]

Oh...and you can DVR it, just start recording after it starts.

 

[42769vette]

lesnar wins head and arm choke in the 2nd

 

[Suprtek]

Great fight! Enjoyable to watch. Really liked seeing Brock get his face punched for a change. I was really pulling for Carwin, but I gotta give Brock credit. In spite of the beating he took in the first round, he didn't wilt. Carwin just couldn't keep up with Brocks cardio. I also give Brock extra props for behaving with a lot of class post fight. If he keeps this up, he may eventually win more fans, including me.

 

[WestSider]

The first round was not a shock to me, as I knew Carwin has the superior stand up. Brock's striking is not on the same level, which is why he immediately went for a take down, which was stuffed, then he got dropped.

There are a lot of Carwin fans on the UFC boards right now saying Rosenthal should have stopped the fight in the 1st round. Now, it's no secret to anyone that knows me that I am NOT a Brock Lesnar fan. However, I am not going to say that they should have stopped it, but he certainly could have as Lesnar turtled up several times. I have seen many fight stopped with much less of a beating taken that this one.

Bottom line is Carwin should have picked his shots better. This is not the first time we have seen someone get hurt bad in the first round and come back to win because the opponent couldn't' put them away and tanked in the 2nd round. If a guy is hurt, you have to be patient and pick your shots and/or go for a submission to finish him instead of just blindly throwing shots, Brock survived and did what was necessary to win, period.

Now, on to the speech after the fight. It was just about the most rehearsed, fake sounding garbage I have ever heard. He didn't have an exuberant amount of class, he simply took all the might he had and managed to not make a total ass out of himself for once.

 

[aclark]

There are a lot of Carwin fans on the UFC boards right now saying Rosenthal should have stopped the fight in the 1st round. Now, it's no secret to anyone that knows me that I am NOT a Brock Lesnar fan. However, I am not going to say that they should have stopped it, but he certainly could have as Lesnar turtled up several times. I have seen many fight stopped with much less of a beating taken that this one.

Bottom line is Carwin should have picked his shots better. This is not the first time we have seen someone get hurt bad in the first round and come back to win because the opponent couldn't' put them away and tanked in the 2nd round. If a guy is hurt, you have to be patient and pick your shots and/or go for a submission to finish him instead of just blindly throwing shots, Brock survived and did what was necessary to win, period.

I really lost a lot of respect for the UFC refs and Dana White for supporting them how he does. This fight should have been stopped in the first. Carwin gave Brock a chance to stand up or reposition and Brock did jack. It was obvious that he wasn't trying to improve his situation, but rather just survive that first round. It should have been stopped.

I don't care if its a title fight or not, Dana has stood up for his refs stopping for WAY LESS, and this should have been one he had to defend for an "early stoppage". If you give any pro UFC fighter 2-3 min after getting smashed they will be able to at least stand back up and put on a good fight/show. That's what happened here, and it should not have.

PERIOD

 

[FordMan08]

Brock wins in the second....sweet!

 

[lyric911]

I really lost a lot of respect for the UFC refs and Dana White for supporting them how he does. This fight should have been stopped in the first. Carwin gave Brock a chance to stand up or reposition and Brock did jack. It was obvious that he wasn't trying to improve his situation, but rather just survive that first round. It should have been stopped.

I don't care if its a title fight or not, Dana has stood up for his refs stopping for WAY LESS, and this should have been one he had to defend for an "early stoppage". If you give any pro UFC fighter 2-3 min after getting smashed they will be able to at least stand back up and put on a good fight/show. That's what happened here, and it should not have.

PERIOD

Note: the refs are not UFC refs. They are Nevada State Athletic Commission refs. Dana doesn't sign their paychecks.

 

[WestSider]

I really lost a lot of respect for the UFC refs and Dana White for supporting them how he does. This fight should have been stopped in the first. Carwin gave Brock a chance to stand up or reposition and Brock did jack. It was obvious that he wasn't trying to improve his situation, but rather just survive that first round. It should have been stopped.

I don't care if its a title fight or not, Dana has stood up for his refs stopping for WAY LESS, and this should have been one he had to defend for an "early stoppage". If you give any pro UFC fighter 2-3 min after getting smashed they will be able to at least stand back up and put on a good fight/show. That's what happened here, and it should not have.

PERIOD

There was one point where Shane landed a huge elbow that Brock went completely limp for a split second. The Lesnar fans say that he immediately started moving again. However, "moving" consisted of him just basically covering up and rolling around trying to avoid more punches. In the UFC, "turtling up" or just covering your head with your forearms is NOT considered and intelligent defense and is grounds for stoppage of the fight.

This is where the gray area comes in, because the ref has the power to deem whether a fighter is in fact still able to defend himself or not. Like I said above, I have been an MMA fan since UFC 1 and seen MANY fights in the UFC stopped with much less punishment delivered than Shane did in this one, but it is what it is. I'm not ready to say there is a conspiracy with Dana White and the refs, but clearly Rosenthal gave Brock a LOT of grace in that first round...

 

[FordMan08]

I've watched the fight a few times now. I think the ref did the right thing by letting it go. He was in there watching everything. If he had seen Brock in trouble he would have stopped it. Alot of Carwins shots were hitting Brocks arms. Both fighters fought like champs!

Maybe Shane shouldn't have winked at him at the beginning of round 2.

 

[PwrCruz]

I think the fight should have been stopped in the first but that is just my .
Really disapointed that Carwin did not have the cardio to go at least 2 rounds . Only good news is the announcement that Cain has winners of this fight. Cain does not have the strikeing of Carwin but it is still better than Brocks also Cain is a machine he will not gas out.

On the flip side Brock is a freak with that size, strenght and speed of his. Should be a good fight.

 

[WestSider]

Brock thanked Rosenthal like 3 times for not stopping the fight in the post fight remarks, but tried to say he wasn't hurt which wasn't true, he was hurt bad. Like I said though, the did what he needed to do and survived. Carwin should have been smarter about what he did after he dropped him.

One this is for sure, Brock's stand up needs some work. Even if you look at that 2nd Frank Mir fight, Frank was working him over before Brock landed the takedown. Cain Velasquez is going to be Brock's next opponent, and he is going to have to strike and avoid being taken down to have a chance. He doesn't have the power of Shane, but he can stick and move and probably avoid Brock a little easier.

 

[42769vette]

one thing i was impressed with was how carwin wasn't crying about "you should have stopped the fight" like most internet forums. we have seen fights stopped early and we have seen them not stopped. bottom line is there is a area of "judgement call" in where a ref should stop a fight. i think this fight fell into this area. if it would have been stopped alot of fans would have been crying "you stopped it to early" if it was not stopped alot of fans would have said "you should have stopped it. the refs have a tough job and i dont think this non-stoppage was quite to the point of complaining. if he had stopped it i dont think you could have complained about that either.

i think this fight (whole ppv) really showcased the evolution of mma fighter. brock winning by submition, leban winning by triangle and lytle winning by a extreamly advanced armbar/triangle. if somone would have told you a few years ago lytle would have won by a simple submition you would have believed them. if somone had told you he would have won with that submition you would have called them crazy

 

[42769vette]

I think the fight should have been stopped in the first but that is just my .
Really disapointed that Carwin did not have the cardio to go at least 2 rounds . Only good news is the announcement that Cain has winners of this fight. Cain does not have the strikeing of Carwin but it is still better than Brocks also Cain is a machine he will not gas out.

On the flip side Brock is a freak with that size, strenght and speed of his. Should be a good fight.

imo cain had no chance against brock. i think the fight you saw last night was between brock and the only man in the ufc that could take his belt

 

[WestSider]

one thing i was impressed with was how carwin wasn't crying about "you should have stopped the fight" like most internet forums. we have seen fights stopped early and we have seen them not stopped. bottom line is there is a area of "judgement call" in where a ref should stop a fight. i think this fight fell into this area. if it would have been stopped alot of fans would have been crying "you stopped it to early" if it was not stopped alot of fans would have said "you should have stopped it. the refs have a tough job and i dont think this non-stoppage was quite to the point of complaining. if he had stopped it i dont think you could have complained about that either.

i think this fight (whole ppv) really showcased the evolution of mma fighter. brock winning by submition, leban winning by triangle and lytle winning by a extreamly advanced armbar/triangle. if somone would have told you a few years ago lytle would have won by a simple submition you would have believed them. if somone had told you he would have won with that submition you would have called them crazy

Good points, I agree on the ref thing. Believe me I wanted the fight to stop, because I wanted to see Lesnar lose, I can't stand the guy and I don't hide that fact. Bottom line is Rosenthal decided that he wasn't hurt enough to have the fight stopped and that is what he gets paid to decide. If he had stopped it, the Lesnar fans would have been outraged that the fight was stopped.

I think the whole event was one of the better UFC's I've seen in a while, all fantastic fights. The only thing I would disagree with you is on the Chris Lytle thing, only because I know that he has an excellent ground game, he just rarely uses it because he prefers to punch people in the face


EDIT: I also have to disagree on the Cain Velasquez thing. He is a fast and hard puncher and could probably outlast Brock if he can get it into the later rounds. He is a very resilient guy. Obviously Lesnar will be the favorite but I wouldn't write Velasquez off just yet.

 

[42769vette]

Good points, I agree on the ref thing. Believe me I wanted the fight to stop, because I wanted to see Lesnar lose, I can't stand the guy and I don't hide that fact. Bottom line is Rosenthal decided that he wasn't hurt enough to have the fight stopped and that is what he gets paid to decide. If he had stopped it, the Lesnar fans would have been outraged that the fight was stopped.

I think the whole event was one of the better UFC's I've seen in a while, all fantastic fights. The only thing I would disagree with you is on the Chris Lytle thing, only because I know that he has an excellent ground game, he just rarely uses it because he prefers to punch people in the face


EDIT: I also have to disagree on the Cain Velasquez thing. He is a fast and hard puncher and could probably outlast Brock if he can get it into the later rounds. He is a very resilient guy. Obviously Lesnar will be the favorite but I wouldn't write Velasquez off just yet.

imo lytle has always had enough of a ground game to survive. it seams to me in the last year or so he has transformed his ground game from "he can survive on the ground" to "watch out for his ground game".

i just think carwin was the ufc hw divisions main hope at taking the belt from brock. but its mma not boxing, it only takes one punch with a 4 oz glove to turn a man that doesn't have a chance into the champ. thats what i love about mma. the slightest mistake can make the underdog the winner

 

[tyler34]

there will be a carwin lesnar 2 and it will be EPIC!!!

 

[WestSider]

imo lytle has always had enough of a ground game to survive. it seams to me in the last year or so he has transformed his ground game from "he can survive on the ground" to "watch out for his ground game".

i just think carwin was the ufc hw divisions main hope at taking the belt from brock. but its mma not boxing, it only takes one punch with a 4 oz glove to turn a man that doesn't have a chance into the champ. thats what i love about mma. the slightest mistake can make the underdog the winner

You are right about Carwin, I think he was the guy to give Brock the most trouble. It is going to be an uphill battle for Velasquez for sure, but like you said, anything can happen. Cain is a smart fighter, he will make a good fight of it. Also, Carwin isn't retiring so I'm already seeing a rematch in the future.

As for Lytle, he has made his name with his stand up game, but he has been a JJ black belt for a long time and most of his wins (over half) have actually been by submission. He also has never lost a fight by submission. His latest victories by submission have certainly highlighted his ground skills.

 

[42769vette]

there will be a carwin lesnar 2 and it will be EPIC!!!

i was betting on lesnar for there first fight. i would have to strongly consider betting on carwin for the next fight. i think if they fight again carwin wont wear himself out with a furry of punches like he did in the first. but brocks takdown was easy for him so i probably would not switch my bet but id think about it alot harder than i did this time

 

[sporter]

Well Carwin won the fight in the 1st and blew it all away in the 2nd.

This did prove Carwin's striking is FAR superior to Brock's and is much more powerful.

Obviously Brock is the better athlete overall however his chin is very suspect. He pretty much clammed up once he started getting hit.

 

[WestSider]

This why I think Velasquez has a chance, because he is an excellent striker. Not as much power as Carwin, but if he can drop Brock, or even stick and move and avoid the takedowns, I think he can make the fight very interesting.