This scares the hell out of me (LEO attitudes toward CCW)

[Glock Lover]

If Obama becomes president we all better hope we can still hold discusions about things like this. First the 2A then the 1A.

Good point

 

[sanzo87]

well i think that the posts on the other fourm were appulling. i can in some points understand that an officer may want to disairm you, but i would not want him messing with my loaded gun now if he was going to let me unload it that may be another story. also as far as him searching my car because i told him i had a ltch and handed him my firearm that will not happen unless he wants to get a warrient i will protect my 4A i know i dont have anything to hide but thats not the point IMO. but then again i have never been pulled over without a ticket or something rediclous happenin (example i was told that my own car was stolen and he wanted to search my car and had be get out of the car with his gun unholstered even after i had given him my info when he threatened to esclate things i told him to call his sargent(by name) that i am good friends with him and his kid so things were left at that also i am regularly pulled over when i drive through campus"suspecetd dui" mind you i dont drink and its normaly sunday) but that aside i always stay polite and treat the officer with respect and i end up with tickets for only 5 over it pisses me off i would like to get a worning for once i mean dam i know im only 20 about to be 21 but still i drive over 3000miles a month give me a break here ( sorry went off on a topic) the leo's on the other post were a very bad example of how a leo should conduct him/her self on or off dutie I know severial leo's and MP's i have a great deal of respect for them im even thinkin about becomeing an MP

 

[SavageEagle]

well i think that the posts on the other fourm were appulling. i can in some points understand that an officer may want to disairm you, but i would not want him messing with my loaded gun now if he was going to let me unload it that may be another story. also as far as him searching my car because i told him i had a ltch and handed him my firearm that will not happen unless he wants to get a warrient i will protect my 4A i know i dont have anything to hide but thats not the point IMO. but then again i have never been pulled over without a ticket or something rediclous happenin (example i was told that my own car was stolen and he wanted to search my car and had be get out of the car with his gun unholstered even after i had given him my info when he threatened to esclate things i told him to call his sargent(by name) that i am good friends with him and his kid so things were left at that also i am regularly pulled over when i drive through campus"suspecetd dui" mind you i dont drink and its normaly sunday) but that aside i always stay polite and treat the officer with respect and i end up with tickets for only 5 over it pisses me off i would like to get a worning for once i mean dam i know im only 20 about to be 21 but still i drive over 3000miles a month give me a break here ( sorry went off on a topic) the leo's on the other post were a very bad example of how a leo should conduct him/her self on or off dutie I know severial leo's and MP's i have a great deal of respect for them im even thinkin about becomeing an MP

LMAO That has to be the LONGEST sentence I've EVER seen! No offense intended. I just found that REALLY funny! <----When you turn 21 of course....

 

[esrice]

INGO group hug!!!

Don't make me take off my vest!

Lots of opinions in this one. Let's just remember that that's all they are-- opinions. I'm sure no one was actually "offended" or hates anyone for something they've said on an internet forum. . . that'd be silly! <------ another opinion

 

[Glock Lover]

INGO group hug!!!

Don't make me take off my vest!

Lots of opinions in this one. Let's just remember that that's all they are-- opinions. I'm sure no one was actually "offended" or hates anyone for something they've said on an internet forum. . . that'd be silly! <------ another opinion

Good point esrice

 

[sanzo87]

yea i know i was ranting i forgot about putting some spaceing in it lol. and its only 16 days till 21 and esrice you got a good point.

 

[benron]

I've been in law enforcement since 1992,and i've never met a law abiding citizen that was a threat to my safety.some of these leo responses are pretty arrogant and speaks of pure elitism,and puts a even bigger gap in citizens trusting the police,even though it is a small percentage of leo's that feel that way,but it's always police officer with these attitudes that gets the publics attention,and not the the ones who treat people with respect.

 

[benron]

esrice,you have get me one of those vests, PLEASE

 

[esrice]

esrice,you have get me one of those vests, PLEASE

Ok. . but you're on your own with the flair.

 

[rhino]

I've been in law enforcement since 1992,and i've never met a law abiding citizen that was a threat to my safety.some of these leo responses are pretty arrogant and speaks of pure elitism,and puts a even bigger gap in citizens trusting the police,even though it is a small percentage of leo's that feel that way,but it's always police officer with these attitudes that gets the publics attention,and not the the ones who treat people with respect.

I think that's probably true of any group ... the few bad apples are responsible for most of the ill-will from those outside of the group. One thing that helps is people like you who are obviously level-headed and reasonable.

In general, I think most groups with image problems, whether based on reality or perception, could benefit from more self-policing (no pun intended).

 

[Fenway]

We have got a lot of good LEOs on this board. I have had the chance to meet many of them. There are bad apples every where in every profession.

 

[rhino]

We have got a lot of good LEOs on this board. I have had the chance to meet many of them. There are bad apples every where in every profession.

You are correct.

However (and this is a big "however"), how many of those professions have been given (or assumed) the kind of authority and means to affect people's lives the way a bad cop can? That's why it's such a big problem, even if it's only a tiny minority. They have too much power to do too much harm.

A bad stockboy at Kroger or a bad shoe salesman is just an annoyance. A bad doctor, or a bad judge, or a bad IRS agent can ruin your life or worse.

 

[Fenway]

Yes, I agree with you 100%. Just trying to throw a reminder out there on pg 13 that the good far out number the bad. IMHO And many of the good guys are on here. Matt and Cory for example.

However (and this is a big "however"), how many of those professions have been given (or assumed) the kind of authority and means to affect people's lives the way a bad cop can? That's why it's such a big problem, even if it's only a tiny minority. They have too much power to do too much harm.

A bad stockboy at Kroger or a bad shoe salesman is just an annoyance. A bad doctor, or a bad judge, or a bad IRS agent can ruin your life or worse.

 

[Scutter01]

Why do the good LEOs allow the bad LEOs to behave this way? It seems like it just makes their job difficult. I should think that instead of closing ranks around a bad cop, they would want to take him out back and beat the tar out of him. Instead, it seems like they do the exact opposite in the name of "brotherhood". Every time a bad LEO story gets around, it undermines not only their credibility but the public's trust, and that can only make things harder for everyone.

 

[4sarge]

Why do the good LEOs allow the bad LEOs to behave this way? It seems like it just makes their job difficult. I should think that instead of closing ranks around a bad cop, they would want to take him out back and beat the tar out of him. Instead, it seems like they do the exact opposite in the name of "brotherhood". Every time a bad LEO story gets around, it undermines not only their credibility but the public's trust, and that can only make things harder for everyone.

Unfortunately, police work isn't done by "Mother May I" or "Simon Sez" rules. If you want a fair, honest, competent police force then I recommend that you keep the politics out, pay a decent wage, hire and support an honest, professional Chief of Police and demand supervisors that enforce policy. That said, this is the real world, the politicians want a political chief that they can control and who will hire their relatives or friends and selectively enforce policy to everyone but their friends, neighbors, or relatives. It's complicated and can be done but takes strong citizen and business involvement in the community and police department. Police officers often fall into the trap of "us vs them" mentality.

Arresting a person can alter the course of one's life and it was a decision that I did not take lightly :rolleyesedit:

and by the way, I considered myself to be a good cop

 

[Scutter01]

I'm not talking about "mother may I", but I understand your point and I agree.

I'm referring more to LEOs policing themselves. Within the ranks, bad behavior is allowed to continue even though the other officers have to know the damage that the one bad cop is doing to the whole department. You don't need direction from the Chief for that. I obviously wouldn't condone physically abusing a bad officer, but certainly instead of closing ranks and protecting him, you'd think the other officers would pull him aside and give him a few choice words for making their lives more difficult.

Every time I hear a "bad cop" story, I trust all LEOs (as a profession, not personal relationships) less because I never know if the one I'm dealing with is another bad cop.

 

[4sarge]

I'm not talking about "mother may I", but I understand your point and I agree.

I'm referring more to LEOs policing themselves. Within the ranks, bad behavior is allowed to continue even though the other officers have to know the damage that the one bad cop is doing to the whole department. You don't need direction from the Chief for that. I obviously wouldn't condone physically abusing a bad officer, but certainly instead of closing ranks and protecting him, you'd think the other officers would pull him aside and give him a few choice words for making their lives more difficult.

Every time I hear a "bad cop" story, I trust all LEOs (as a profession, not personal relationships) less because I never know if the one I'm dealing with is another bad cop.

You are absolutely right Scutter and that would work and when we had our "afternoon tea and crumpets" we could all tell the chap what bad form he had and how it was making the rest of us look like cheeky blokes"

Sorry real world reality check, it doesn't work that way :rolleyesedit:

 

[Fenway]

I have no doubt you were sarge. I look forward to meeting you some day!

and by the way, I considered myself to be a good cop

 

[flagtag]

I've been in law enforcement since 1992,and i've never met a law abiding citizen that was a threat to my safety.some of these leo responses are pretty arrogant and speaks of pure elitism,and puts a even bigger gap in citizens trusting the police,even though it is a small percentage of leo's that feel that way,but it's always police officer with these attitudes that gets the publics attention,and not the the ones who treat people with respect.

I agree. If two officers came up to me - one with an "attitude" the other with a respectful attitude, I would do everything I could to ignore the bad attitude guy (or gal) and answer to the good attitude person.

And if for some reason it was at my house (can't think of a reason), then I would demand that the BA person leave and only speak to the GA person.

I know you guys see a lot of criminal types out there, but that is no reason to treat everyone as if he/she is. Some of you recognise that, others need to. Thanks

 

[4sarge]

You are absolutely right Scutter and that would work and when we had our "afternoon tea and crumpets" we could all tell the chap what bad form he had and how it was making the rest of us look like cheeky blokes"

Sorry real world reality check, it doesn't work that way :rolleyesedit:

Scutter, in the old days, that tea & crumpet meeting would have been referred to as a beat down. Didn't see many but when you did they were usually horrific. A few beers at the hall after shift and someone mouthed off or had a festering beef with someone else. A citizen would have went to the hospital, a copper licked his wounds and went on.

Most cops are suffering from some form of PTSD (varying stages), add a combo of Testosterone, alcohol, women, or drugs and just having a ****** day then what can you expect. Professional supervision can and should be a circuit breaker in the system to diffuse these potential situations, abhorrent behavior etc. Cops are only human, good and bad both mixed in just like normal people.

I do not know DC Cop (if he is one) and I'm not trying to defend him but these large cities are in a state of war. Surely you have seen the Rodney King riots etc. Many NYPD, Chicago, St; Louis, Detroit, LAPD etc. coppers are in a state of siege. Damned if you do and damned if you don't


Actually, I'm tired of typing, said to much, believe or not believe, agree or disagree but that's the way that it is.


One parting word of advice that I know will not be appreciated or even understood by many but here I go anyway :rolleyesedit:


If an officer ever gives you an order, (surrender your gun etc) please comply. If you feel that is wrong, incorrect or beyond his/her scope of authority then take it up later when cooler heads can prevail. I've seen cops & citizens both die over silly orders or non compliance. A tombstone inscribed BUT I Was Right, just doesn't cut it for me