This scares the hell out of me (LEO attitudes toward CCW)

[Scutter01]

4sarge,

Thanks for the reply. I think I agree with everything you mentioned above. It's tough for those of us on the outside of the badge to understand police culture, but when we have the opportunity to discuss it with someone such as yourself, I believe both sides benefit.

 

[Dogman]

One thing I've found funny is that no one even knows if " DC COP " is even an officer, or some wannabe running off at the mouth .

 

[Gryphon]

I agree. If two officers came up to me - one with an "attitude" the other with a respectful attitude, I would do everything I could to ignore the bad attitude guy (or gal) and answer to the good attitude person.

This sensible approach didn't work for me when two officers entered my apartment many moons ago without my permission, and without a warrant for reasons to this day only the Good Lord and they will know.

The big mouth happened to be the senior partner, so the rookie had to stand back and observe officer Neanderthal create a totally unnecessary scene that I found to be embarrassing, intimidating, and bewildering.

And if for some reason it was at my house (can't think of a reason), then I would demand that the BA person leave and only speak to the GA person.

Officer Neanderthal left when he was done screaming in my face. I was too terrified to utter a sound at that time. He had the badge, the baton, and the revolver, along with a very nervous rookie backing him up rather he approved of what his senior pal was doing or not.

I know you guys see a lot of criminal types out there, but that is no reason to treat everyone as if he/she is. Some of you recognise that, others need to. Thanks

As soon as these two "heroes" slammed my front door on their way out, I called their watch commander, who listened to my complaint, and then informed me that officer Neanderthal had just entered the ranks of the unemployed.

Did the atrocious behavior of officer Neanderthal cause me to hate all LEOs... NO!

Not all LEOs are bad eggs. In fact, an ISP sergeant (He retired a captain.) stood by me a few years before this bad incident occurred after I shot an attack dog in self-defense on public property. He kept an already ugly situation from getting a lot uglier. But one bad officer can cause the public to riot in outrage due to their unacceptable behavior. These vicious control freaks with lethal authority need to be weeded out of departments as soon as possible.

 

[4sarge]

This sensible approach didn't work for me when two officers entered my apartment many moons ago without my permission, and without a warrant for reasons to this day only the Good Lord and they will know.

The big mouth happened to be the senior partner, so the rookie had to stand back and observe officer Neanderthal create a totally unnecessary scene that I found to be embarrassing, intimidating, and bewildering.

Officer Neanderthal left when he was done screaming in my face. I was too terrified to utter a sound at that time. He had the badge, the baton, and the revolver, along with a very nervous rookie backing him up rather he approved of what his senior pal was doing or not.

As soon as these two "heroes" slammed my front door on their way out, I called their watch commander, who listened to my complaint, and then informed me that officer Neanderthal had just entered the ranks of the unemployed.

Did the atrocious behavior of officer Neanderthal cause me to hate all LEOs... NO!

Not all LEOs are bad eggs. In fact, an ISP sergeant (He retired a captain.) stood by me a few years before this bad incident occurred after I shot an attack dog in self-defense on public property. He kept an already ugly situation from getting a lot uglier. But one bad officer can cause the public to riot in outrage due to their unacceptable behavior. These vicious control freaks with lethal authority need to be weeded out of departments as soon as possible.

You sir handled it correctly and I'm sorry for the x-cop's demeanor who handled the situation poorly.

 

[flagtag]

Scutter, in the old days, that tea & crumpet meeting would have been referred to as a beat down. Didn't see many but when you did they were usually horrific. A few beers at the hall after shift and someone mouthed off or had a festering beef with someone else. A citizen would have went to the hospital, a copper licked his wounds and went on.

Most cops are suffering from some form of PTSD (varying stages), add a combo of Testosterone, alcohol, women, or drugs and just having a ****** day then what can you expect. Professional supervision can and should be a circuit breaker in the system to diffuse these potential situations, abhorrent behavior etc. Cops are only human, good and bad both mixed in just like normal people.

I do not know DC Cop (if he is one) and I'm not trying to defend him but these large cities are in a state of war. Surely you have seen the Rodney King riots etc. Many NYPD, Chicago, St; Louis, Detroit, LAPD etc. coppers are in a state of siege. Damned if you do and damned if you don't


Actually, I'm tired of typing, said to much, believe or not believe, agree or disagree but that's the way that it is.


One parting word of advice that I know will not be appreciated or even understood by many but here I go anyway :rolleyesedit:


If an officer ever gives you an order, (surrender your gun etc) please comply. If you feel that is wrong, incorrect or beyond his/her scope of authority then take it up later when cooler heads can prevail. I've seen cops & citizens both die over silly orders or non compliance. A tombstone inscribed BUT I Was Right, just doesn't cut it for me

Good idea. But it wouldn't hurt to add while doing so, that you are doing so under protest because you don't believe that the officer has the authority. Just for the record.

 

[4sarge]

Good idea. But it wouldn't hurt to add while doing so, that you are doing so under protest because you don't believe that the officer has the authority. Just for the record.

Cops are just like wives or girlfriends (sorry ladies), they always get the last word

and if it's a Female Cop, you are really in Trouble

 

[flagtag]

You sir handled it correctly and I'm sorry for the x-cop's demeanor who handled the situation poorly.

Is there anything that says one can't call 911 while this is going on to complain and have a record of the incident? (I know that dispatch can hear quite a bit over the phone - and that all calls are recorded)

 

[4sarge]

Is there anything that says one can't call 911 while this is going on to complain and have a record of the incident? (I know that dispatch can hear quite a bit over the phone - and that all calls are recorded)

911 is recorded and so are most PD radio transmissions. I wouldn't suggest doing anything that made it appear that I'm being combative or failing to comply. Cooler heads, supervisors, etc are the way to go IMO. Everyone dislikes a jail house lawyer.

 

[flagtag]

Cops are just like wives or girlfriends (sorry ladies), they always get the last word

and if it's a Female Cop, you are really in Trouble

Don't mess with the ladies!

 

[flagtag]

911 is recorded and so are most PD radio transmissions. I wouldn't suggest doing anything that made it appear that I'm being combative or failing to comply. Cooler heads, supervisors, etc are the way to go IMO. Everyone dislikes a jail house lawyer.

That's what I thought. I know it is here.
If the officer(s) doing nothing wrong, he/she shouldn't object to 911 being called.

 

[rhino]

In my opinion, I think that police officers should have zero "authority" over someone if they have not broken any laws. We all know that's not the case, and it's primarily a result of all levels of government being allowed way too much power. Even the good people who act as agents of the government have too much power.

When I was a "fed" (US EPA, Region IX, Superfund Project Manager), I was essentially a nobody in the agency, yet I had the power to violate people's rights and ruin their lives on a regular basis. I was too young and too inexperienced to recognize it at the time, and I am still ashamed for some of the actions taken by the agency in which I played even a peripheral role. Having been on that side of things and having a couple of more decades of life, I have a better understanding of how things really are vs. how things really should be. We're much closer to the former, and it's a huge factor in why just a few bad cops are an unacceptable number.

 

[Dogman]

"afternoon tea and crumpets"

Hummmmmm........ crumpets

 

[4sarge]

Hummmmmm........ crumpets

they are quite good cheerio and all that

 

[epsylum]

they are quite good cheerio and all that

mmmmmm..... cheerios.

 

[SavageEagle]

I love this forum. So many great people on here and so many great experiances. When i was younger and dumber, i saw cops as the enemy. As I've grown older and had kids, I so respect officers for what they do and what they put up with. I've seen things from the wrong side and I know people can be very evil. So to have to put up with that day in and day out and all the STUPIDITY LEO's must put up with everyday, it's hard to see why anyone would even WANT to do the job, live the life. It has to be SO HARD on a persons mentality. I've seen the wrong side of Chicago. The streets even the police are afraid to patrol. And rightly so. There are neighborhoods in Chi that ARE war zones. Police just come to clean up the mess. Thank GOD I never got into the life. You can say I vacationed there for a short while. Yes it was fun at the time, but I can also say I was never so scared in all my life. And those are the people, or, types of people, that big city police put up with everyday. It's awful and there's no way anyone can do it day in and day out and keep their sanity to make a career out of it. If you can, more power to ya cause you're more of a man than me. So I salute all you LEO's and all that you do. I can only imagine how hard your job can be. But for the LEO's that constantly have a BA towards the people they pull over, transfer or find a new career. Every one human on this earth is inherently evil. But VERY FEW people would sacrifice their life to take yours.

4sarge - I'm so glad there are officers out there like you. You are the type I try to show to my kids so they never see LE the way I once saw LE. I am ashamed of my boyish mistakes, but I study history and learn from my mistakes so as not to be doomed to repeat. I also try to share my experiances, good and bad, with others so maybe they can learn too. So I thank you for your experiances that you have shared and your advice. I hope everyone learns something from this thread as I have.

 

[Annie Oakley]

SavageEagle, good post.

 

[snake-doctor]

In my opinion, I think that police officers should have zero "authority" over someone if they have not broken any laws.

I agree with SavageEagle that cops have to put up with the dregs of society, but I also agree with this. The police do have way too much power, in my opinion. Being able to arrest someone just for talking back to them is ridiculous. I once tried to apologize to a traffic cop when I misread his traffic hand signs, and he acted like he was going to arrest me for apologizing.

Absurd.

 

[sanzo87]

SavageEagle and also for this comment In my opinion, I think that police officers should have zero "authority" over someone if they have not broken any laws.

 

[Dredd]

ill say it before and ive said it again, i have a job to do and i plan to do it safely. If you cant be away from your gun for 10 whole minutes then it will just be tough cookies for you. officer safety is not something i budge on and fiesty citizens wanting to hold guns while im tryng to write tickets does not sit well with me. Sorry but your gun comes with me. If all this makes you so uncomfortable then you should of not been breaking the law in the 1st place. you have to see it from where we are standing too.

 

[Keyser Soze]

Man dredd you are bumping an old ass thread. I'm a tender 26 but started when I was 20. In my five years on I have not heard of a person that was LTC 10-0ing an officer at least on a traffic stop.

Someone tells you they have a firearm in the vehicle and they are LTC whats the point in taking it? To see if its stolen? Ive never recovered a stolen gun that had numbers. Officer safety? You would have been shot at already if that was the intention.


My problem when a firearm is not mentioned, person changes position and out pops a weapon. #@R just got real. Thats why I am thankful for people with 1/16th of a brain. People that inform LEOs there is a heater in the beater.