The Trump/Republican Primary/General Election Megathread

[T.Lex]

"Seem" is the key part of how the left (and NeverTrumpers) have been trying to paint him into a corner. Guilt by association is a long-used smear tactic and is being used here to distract from Hillary's real financial links to Russia. Remember the Panama Papers?

Those more implicate the Podestas, who do support HRC, but are not actually HRC. As I recall - and I'm open to correction - The Panama Papers did not reveal any direct connection between HRC or her close advisors and Russia.

But, the link between Manafort and Russia (in the Ukraine) is a solid, direct line.

ETA:
Apparently, John Podesta is part of the Clinton crew, but the lobbyist brother from the Panama Papers is not. Suspicious - sure. But not as direct a link as Manafort.

And really, is this something that we, as voters, should accept as a tie? "They both have ties to Russia" somehow validates Trump as a candidate?

 

[jamil]

Don't be lazy.

1. Reuters/Ipsos poll. What's leftist about it? What would that even matter? They polled Republicans.
2. Do you refute the Russian ties that his buddies seem to have?
3. This is just a thing that's happening. They want to investigate it. I doubt they'll get anything from it though, just for show probably. But also not "propaganda"

The Russian ties thing is a red herring. And it's intentionally that. I think the media is helping Democrats create something where there's probably nothing.

And it's not that I don't want them to investigate Trump's dealings with Russia. Because it's only probably nothing. So sure, investigate. But it's not just a thing that's happening. It's happening for a political purpose. And, I'm okay with that as long as they're not working to deceive the public.

As much effort as they're putting into trying to build Trump into this Manchurian candidate, I'd like to see the press devote that kind of effort in trying to uncover what's hidden in Hillary's closet. Where are all the Woodward's and Bernstein's trying to make a name for themselves uncovering the mystery of Seth Rich?

 

[ArcadiaGP]

And really, is this something that we, as voters, should accept as a tie? "They both have ties to Russia" somehow validates Trump as a candidate?

I don't buy the "but they do it too" stuff.

I expect them to have shady ties. I expect more from candidates of my alignment, and would hope that shady ties with commies is something they would avoid.

Manafort is a big one. Clinton having PP ties to Russia doesn't make Trump's ties "okay". Then again, Trump isn't really a Republican, so it's a moot point with me. His followers, however, should expect more transparency and be critical of things like Manafort.

 

[T.Lex]

I don't buy the "but they do it too" stuff.

I expect them to have shady ties. I expect more from candidates of my alignment, and would hope that shady ties with commies is something they would avoid.

Manafort is a big one. Clinton having PP ties to Russia doesn't make Trump's ties "okay". Then again, Trump isn't really a Republican, so it's a moot point with me. His followers, however, should expect more transparency and be critical of things like Manafort.

Honestly, that's kinda why real candidates - and businesspeople - work through lobbyists, certain law firms and CPAs, and 3rd parties. To avoid this kind of issue.

And I would've thought Manafort would be toxic.

 

[bwframe]

Does anyone take the NeverTrumpers seriously anymore?

 

[T.Lex]

Does anyone take the NeverTrumpers seriously anymore?

No.

 

[indiucky]

Here is a quote from Hillary....

Hillary Clinton?s Kennedy assassination comment draws fury | New York Post

WASHINGTON – Hillary Rodham Clinton yesterday brought up the assassination of Robert F. Kennedy while defending her decision to stay in the race against Barack Obama – drawing a furious reaction from the front-runner’s camp.“My husband did not wrap up the nomination in 1992 until he won the California primary somewhere in the middle of June, right? We all remember Bobby Kennedy was assassinated in June in California. I don’t understand it,” she said, dismissing calls to drop out.

 

[KG1]

There is truth to this.

I am in no way a Trump supporter and I honestly feel that he is completely unqualified and unfit to be president. But attacks like we're seeing today certainly have me defending him rigorously.

I'm starting to be of the same mindset here. I'm absolutely not a hardcore Trump supporter but I'm getting a bit po'd about the media contortions of Trump's comments to fit their agenda.

I believe there is such a thing as overplaying your hand.

 

[foszoe]

One-in-five U.S. Republicans want Trump to drop out - Business Insider

The other four work at Breitbart.

News and Commentary from GP!

romney got what about 90% of the republican vote? so if the poll holds through the election cycle, Romney only needs 1/2 of the fifth Republican + 1/2 of a new voter. Or various other combinations.....

That doesn't sound all that bad considering Trump is bringing in new voters.

I guess its all in how you phrase it.

 

[foszoe]

A business man with international properties has business relationships with people from other countries! Wow and I wonder why I think the WaPo is in the Hillary Camp. I am a friend of a few Russians too. I have attended parishes where the entire service was in Russian and they prayed for the Russian leader and I ate their food! I wonder if the House will investigate me.

I believe having back channel communications is important for keeping your enemies close and possibly turning enemies into friends. Unless there is reason to believe an actual crime has been commmitted its all just smoke and mirrors.

Another Trump adviser with deep ties to Russia

and

Three house Democrats want to investigate Trump for urging Russia to meddle in Clinton's emails.

 

[T.Lex]

A business man with international properties has business relationships with people from other countries! Wow and I wonder why I think the WaPo is in the Hillary Camp. I am a friend of a few Russians too. I have attended parishes where the entire service was in Russian and they prayed for the Russian leader and I ate their food! I wonder if the House will investigate me.

I believe having back channel communications is important for keeping your enemies close and possibly turning enemies into friends. Unless there is reason to believe an actual crime has been commmitted its all just smoke and mirrors.

Does Trump having Manafort as his lead campaign manager give you any pause?

I don't necessarily disagree - particularly on the business side. But actively helping Pro-Russian parties in the Ukraine before/during/after the annexation of the Crimean doesn't bother you?

 

[foszoe]

i will preface my answer with I don't pay a whole lot of attention to US "Kingmaking" overseas other than i generally disapprove of it.

The short answer is no and no.

As for Manafort, how he makes his money as long as its legal is ok with me. IF his influence in the Ukraine election was illegal, then I would care. His involvement being objected to by the US government doesn't bother me AS long as it was legal.

As for Crimea, again i may not know all the pertinent facts, but its changed hands several times in the last two hundred years. When it was "given" to the Ukraine by the USSR, it wasn't really given and I don't know if International law recognized this donation. The whole donation to Ukraine was a farce.

When they voted for Russian reintegration, if that was the will of the people which I believe the referendum was valid regardless of what international law says. These people had voted earlier to leave the Ukraine. back in the 90s sometime.

So I was all for the Crimean annexation as I understand its occurrence.

Does Trump having Manafort as his lead campaign manager give you any pause?

I don't necessarily disagree - particularly on the business side. But actively helping Pro-Russian parties in the Ukraine before/during/after the annexation of the Crimean doesn't bother you?

 

[bwframe]

Once we get by all the media whiners, fake outrage and nevertrumpers, I actually think this will help us. Help us a lot.

Our lobby organization pays out millions trying to get this message to the average gun owner who pays little attention until right before the election. The Donald has gotten much better coverage, at quite honestly a great time in this election cycle.

[video=youtube;3sSUpKqMScw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3sSUpKqMScw[/video]

 

[LP1]

Once we get by all the media whiners, fake outrage and nevertrumpers, I actually think this will help us. Help us a lot.

Our lobby organization pays out millions trying to get this message to the average gun owner who pays little attention until right before the election. The Donald has gotten much better coverage, at quite honestly a great time in this election cycle.

[video=youtube;3sSUpKqMScw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3sSUpKqMScw[/video]

If by "us" you mean people who don't want him to be president, then you're right. Once you get past those who don't want Trump, there will be very few left. Sadly, I think most of them are on INGO.

How much nutty crap does he need to spout before enough people realize that he is unqualified and would be an unmitigated disaster? How low-information does someone need to be in order to fail to realize that he is desperately pandering to fear, hatred, and prejudice?

His latest statement did far more harm than good for our political process. Had you or I said the same thing, the authorities would be talking with us right now (a former CIA director has stated exactly that). And I'll guarantee you that someone out there heard the dog whistle and is thinking "I need to shoot Hillary". Do any of you REALLY want that to happen?

 

[foszoe]

I don't think it was a call to violence. It certainly wasn't plainly stated as so. At what point on the slope do you cease holding the person who commits the deed responsible and start shifting the responsibility to the speaker?

If by "us" you mean people who don't want him to be president, then you're right. Once you get past those who don't want Trump, there will be very few left. Sadly, I think most of them are on INGO.

How much nutty crap does he need to spout before enough people realize that he is unqualified and would be an unmitigated disaster? How low-information does someone need to be in order to fail to realize that he is desperately pandering to fear, hatred, and prejudice?

His latest statement did far more harm than good for our political process. Had you or I said the same thing, the authorities would be talking with us right now (a former CIA director has stated exactly that). And I'll guarantee you that someone out there heard the dog whistle and is thinking "I need to shoot Hillary". Do any of you REALLY want that to happen?

 

[T.Lex]

I don't think it was a call to violence. It certainly wasn't plainly stated as so. At what point on the slope do you cease holding the person who commits the deed responsible and start shifting the responsibility to the speaker?

***Paging Tipper Gore... Tipper Gore... would Tipper Gore please pick up the red courtesy phone.***

 

[Tombs]

If by "us" you mean people who don't want her to be president, then you're right. Once you get past those who don't want Clinton, there will be very few left. Sadly, I think most of them are on INGO.

How much nutty crap does she need to spout before enough people realize that she is unqualified and would be an unmitigated disaster? How low-information does someone need to be in order to fail to realize that she is desperately pandering to fear, hatred, and prejudice?

Her latest statement did far more harm than good for our political process. Had you or I said the same thing, the authorities would be talking with us right now (a former CIA director has stated exactly that). And I'll guarantee you that someone out there heard the dog whistle and is thinking "I need to shoot Trump". Do any of you REALLY want that to happen?

FTFY

 

[bwframe]

If by "us" you mean people who don't want him to be president...

Like I said:

Once we get by all the media whiners, fake outrage and nevertrumpers, I actually think this will help us...

I was referring to "us" as 2nd Amendment proponents.
My apology for having to define that to anyone on this gun owner forum.

 

[indiucky]

How low-information does someone need to be in order to fail to realize that he is desperately pandering to fear, hatred, and prejudice?

I know many Trump supporters...They are very politically astute....A couple of them are attorneys, a couple are Doctors, a few are teachers...Some are union workers, some are waitresses, and one is an immigrant that runs the counter of a quickie mart...My wife is a Trump supporter...Many here on INGO have met her and she is far from "low information"....She is the daughter of immigrants from South America......Legal of course.....

I have never (and will never) call the anti Trump folks "low information voters", (which I can only assume is a polite way of calling someone "stupid" or maybe "Ignorant"???? If it's not it sure comes across that way...)

There is no need to disparage the intellect of those with which you disagree....I heard Trump's speech and I thought, "Good...Remind the Democrats what happened to them in 1994 when they went up against us 2nd amendment supporters...."

I can't fathom how anyone can not see it that way and yet here we are...I will not call you "low information" as you may be younger and not remember that time in history...The AWB cost the Democrats the House and in the following election cycle (IIRC) the Senate for the first time in 50 years......

So if one calls Trump supporters "low information voters" (which is an insult, and depending on the Trump supporter's ethnicity possibly even bigoted...) whom are they pandering too? Elites??? Bigots???? Globalists????? Whom???? Rosie O'Donnell????? Lady Ga Ga?????

I have no "fears." I have no "hatred" for anyone and I am not "prejudiced".....I have nothing against folks that follow the MSM dogma.... I get that every morning the MSM wakes us up with a NYC talking head breathlessly telling us "Trump is in hot water again for comments he made" and I can see how one can easily fall into the "Well the NYC and the DC Beltway folks, along with actresses, actors, and pop stars, are telling me Trump voters are low information, bigoted morons so it must be true" and fall in line with the rest of the flock.

Whether one votes for Johnson or just sits home with their vote it's their vote. Use yours as you wish but you should perhaps ease up on questioning the intellect of those with whom you disagree....It's just not polite....

IMHO and with no ill will...Zip...Nada....None......

 

[bwframe]

More from the nervertrumper crowd:

Elizabeth Warren
✔@elizabethforma

.@realDonaldTrump makes death threats because he's a pathetic coward who can’t handle the fact that he’s losing to a girl.
5:51 PM - 9 Aug 2016