The Official Redbrush/WSSC IDPA Thread

[DustyDawg48]

If I had a key to the equipment room you might never see it again.

Fast moving targets are a complete mystery to me. I don't know if there is something that could be learned, practiced, or changed to improve things, or if it is just that some folks have the visual speed and reflexes and some don't.

They had a really really slow moving drop target at Tenn. I'd like to see one of the local clubs get one. It creates a little time pressure just because you know it will disappear but it allows time for other targets , a tac reload, etc so I think it would lend itself well to different course designs.

From a pasting and resetting along with a tear-down perspective...I'd be willing to assist you in never seeing that thing again! I haven't shot it enough to really get a good gauge on how to properly tackle it during a COF...and i'm not saying I want to see it more, either!

I think a slow mover/dropper would be a good addition. I've thought of a few cool ideas for movers or drop targets but don't quite have the time or inclination to try and put them together.

 

[dgtk]

Just got the email for red brush idpa, 150 rounds. Higher the round count the better for me, I need the practice, but need to hit the press between now & then

 

[DustyDawg48]

Just got the email for red brush idpa, 150 rounds. Higher the round count the better for me, I need the practice, but need to hit the press between now & then

I am hoping 150 is a very generous estimation...I've been busy and only have 160 rounds of .45 loaded as of right now. I have plenty to load but have been concentrating on getting a stock of 9 loaded.

Also, Jay from WSSC confirmed no June match for those that didn't get the email. the NCOWS group pretty much takes over the entire WSSC ground the first week in June and nothing but that goes on during that time.

 

[Grelber]

I am hoping 150 is a very generous estimation....

I was thinking about stuff, never a good thing, anyway, some folks want a high round count and some would rather have a more modest round count.

Wasn't really a thing until ammo prices and availability went south.

I wonder if there is a big downside to some folks just choosing to shoot x - 1 or x - 2 stages? You can still track how well you are doing by looking at the scores for the stages you chose to shoot and the folks who want to shoot more do not loose the opportunity.

 

[sbcman]

One reason I've kept most of my shooting in IDPA is because of the low round counts. I found a while back that I could shoot 2 matches to one with IDPA against USPSA. For example, if RB runs 7 stages, the maximum round count will only be 126. That's if every course is maxed out at 18 rounds. If been in some USPSA matches that 128 rounds gets you about half way through the match.

Most folks could cut their round usage drastically if they would shoot like revolver shooters shoot I've often wondered how I will feel if I ever get a bottom feeder out again and can take a make-up shot. Probably won't help much because I'll waste too much time trying to find the cylinder latch on my M&P

The very worst thing about having 18 round courses in IDPA is if course designers fail to make them good courses. I've ran courses that required 10 rounds that were far superior to courses with 18.

 

[DustyDawg48]

It is very easy to fall into the trap of making nothing but 18-round Vickers' Count stages. I'm not complaining since I've probably designed about 3 COF in my life but quantity of rounds doesn't always equal quality of stages. I think back to last year's Postal Match and how good some of those stages were and none were high round count if I remember correctly.

personally I would rather have 8 stages at 10 rounds or less each than 4 stages of 18-rounds. Even though they are closer together I'd rather face 8 different challenges than 4 but that is just me.

 

[Bosshoss]

FWIW all the USPSA match that are local have a min. round count between 150 and 180 IF you don't miss. There has been a lot of discussion about reducing round counts as the ammo availabilty would hurt those that don't reload. My opinion is if I am driving a hour and a half one way and paying $15 to $20 dollors to shoot a match I want to shoot as much as I can. The difference between 130 and 180 round matchs is $8 to $10 for my reloads, after driving 3 hours round trip and paying my entry fee that is not a big deal.
Dropping the round count MIGHT help a few new shooters that can't find ammo but it will make some of the regular shooters( the ones that help set up and tear down and RO) decided that it is not worth the drive for a shorter match. Keep in mind that a lot of the regular shooter at the matchs I shoot at some drive 3+ hours one way to shoot.
I like the idea of letting a new shooter or some one who can't find ammo shoot just the stages they want as long as they understand that will hurt them in the results and don't get discouraged.
I'm a USPSA guy but we have been having the same discussions at the clubs I shoot at about the same thing. So just throwing my in.

 

[DustyDawg48]

FWIW all the USPSA match that are local have a min. round count between 150 and 180 IF you don't miss. There has been a lot of discussion about reducing round counts as the ammo availabilty would hurt those that don't reload. My opinion is if I am driving a hour and a half one way and paying $15 to $20 dollors to shoot a match I want to shoot as much as I can. The difference between 130 and 180 round matchs is $8 to $10 for my reloads, after driving 3 hours round trip and paying my entry fee that is not a big deal.
Dropping the round count MIGHT help a few new shooters that can't find ammo but it will make some of the regular shooters( the ones that help set up and tear down and RO) decided that it is not worth the drive for a shorter match. Keep in mind that a lot of the regular shooter at the matchs I shoot at some drive 3+ hours one way to shoot.
I like the idea of letting a new shooter or some one who can't find ammo shoot just the stages they want as long as they understand that will hurt them in the results and don't get discouraged.
I'm a USPSA guy but we have been having the same discussions at the clubs I shoot at about the same thing. So just throwing my in.

I was in a small debate about whether to trim the rounds per stage or the number of stages and I put up about the same argument. If I am going to drive for about an hour to shoot, I don't just want to experience 4 stages and be done, I want to make sure that I'm getting my money's worth out of it. With USPSA and IDPA being just different enough in the proper places, I think IDPA can make out better with few rounds per stage since it is supposed to be simulating more self-defense situations and not all of them are 18 + round fire fights.

But I think either way, with today's ammo crunch, that there needs to be a bit more thought put in to course design since you do have to weigh a few more factors when designing stages.

 

[sbcman]

I just had an epiphany. I haven't reconsidered USPSA since I got my Dillon. I determined my game change back when I was using a hand press. I can crank out enough rounds for a full blown USPSA major now in half an hour
I so want to get a M&P Core and make an open gun out of it
Sorry for the squirrel moment...

Back to the thought at hand, I don't really think round counts have made any difference during the crunch. Guys that reload probably had enough and guys that rely on factory probably couldn't scrounge enough up no matter how low the count was. There's nothing stopping anyone from taking Jeff's idea if it's still hard to get ammo.

 

[DustyDawg48]

You are just looking to justify a Core... admit it!

My friend that shot did just that. Since it isn't a tournament or anything for money, if you have X-Rounds on hand you just say I am only going to shoot x number per stage and call it good.

My biggest rant on round count is to just make everything 18 rounds just because it is hard to come up with ideas. I'm all for higher round counts and some of the hesitancy stems from looking to hold on to the .45 that I have but I can reload a bunch of 9mm and go to town if I feel like it. I really want to get the .45s out this month but I'm not sure. Might just suck it up and go another month with the 9 and let the Glock21 and M&P45 take another extended vacation.

 

[sbcman]

You are just looking to justify a Core... admit it!

My LGS got one in the other day and I got all excited about it. But, turned out to be a 40

 

[DustyDawg48]

My LGS got one in the other day and I got all excited about it. But, turned out to be a 40

There are times I think I want a 40... I would be hard pressed to not pick up a Core even if it was in 40.

 

[sbcman]

She's still there if you want it. I have to pass. As much as I would like a CORE I dislike adding new calibers.

Although, a guy could probably drop a 9 barrel in it (threaded) and be ready to roll. Plus, if I ever wanted to go major, the 40 would be ready. Hmmmm.

 

[DustyDawg48]

She's still there if you want it. I have to pass. As much as I would like a CORE I dislike adding new calibers.

Although, a guy could probably drop a 9 barrel in it (threaded) and be ready to roll. Plus, if I ever wanted to go major, the 40 would be ready. Hmmmm.

that has always sort of rolled around in my head. I don't really want to add another semi-auto caliber. If another caliber does come into the fold it would most likely be .357 or .223. But the 9mm drop in barrel and being able to shoot Major (IF i'd ever attend a USPSA match) does have it's appeal. I would most likely pick up either an M&P40 Pro 5" or a G20 (10mm) and get the conversion barrel from KKM Precision.

I think my next addition might be a bit off in the future but I'm looking at ARs again LOL I need to go on a bullet-buying spree for the next many weeks and then see where I stand once I have a couple thousand of each at my disposal.

 

[Grelber]

that has always sort of rolled around in my head. I don't really want to add another semi-auto caliber.

Upside is that pretty much whatever brass you find is useable, before I had a 40 it seemed like I'd find 40 brass wherever I looked. Now, not so much.

Haven't done it yet, but it seems like working up a 180 grain, say 140 pf, load for IDPA might be pretty nice. Enough authoritie for recalcitrant steels but maybe 9mm ish recoil.

 

[DustyDawg48]

Upside is that pretty much whatever brass you find is useable, before I had a 40 it seemed like I'd find 40 brass wherever I looked. Now, not so much.

Haven't done it yet, but it seems like working up a 180 grain, say 140 pf, load for IDPA might be pretty nice. Enough authoritie for recalcitrant steels but maybe 9mm ish recoil.

.40 always seems to be more readily available even in the reloading realm with bullets than any other caliber, too. If I weren't really vested in .45 and 9 I could easily see the advantage of reloading .40. I don't really like it compared to a 9 or .45 but it can be very versatile and with the right bullet and powder combo, one heck of a shooter.

 

[sbcman]

.40 always seems to be more readily available even in the reloading realm with bullets than any other caliber, too. If I weren't really vested in .45 and 9 I could easily see the advantage of reloading .40. I don't really like it compared to a 9 or .45 but it can be very versatile and with the right bullet and powder combo, one heck of a shooter.

Translation: I shoot Glocks and I'm scared to shoot them in 40

 

[sbcman]

Saw a CORE on gunbroker a bit ago. It was a 5" pro series with threaded barrel kit. That's the one I'm holding out for

 

[DustyDawg48]

Translation: I shoot Glocks and I'm scared to shoot them in 40

I guess you didn't notice the "I'd buy a Glock 10mm" part of that statement. I'd buy a 10mm M&P but I guess Smith isn't too sure their gun would hold together under than type of strain

You know, just when I get the urge to maybe pull the old M&P out of the box and take it for a whirl I get snarky comments from the peanut gallery!

 

[sbcman]

I guess you didn't notice the "I'd buy a Glock 10mm" part of that statement. I'd buy a 10mm M&P but I guess Smith isn't too sure their gun would hold together under than type of strain

You know, just when I get the urge to maybe pull the old M&P out of the box and take it for a whirl I get snarky comments from the peanut gallery!

I don't know, they handle squibs + a hot round fairly well. Saw a guy do this very thing once. He walked away unscathed and S&W fixed it for free. Sad this same dude went all traitorous on them I wonder what a Glock in 40 would do in that situation??? Can you say "Kaboom!"

I think S&W is confident enough in their M&Ps, not so much in the 10mm round itself. Nobody is putting guns off the assembly in mass for that caliber.

The M&P I saw on gunbroker was grabbing 600 and change. The one in my local shop is $635.