The CZickness III

[churchmouse]

Just ordered threaded barrel for the P-09

 

[RustyHornet]

My last range trip I decided to focus on shooting handguns at extended distances from a standing position. I have realized and confirmed that I am shooting high left with most handguns and have been for quite some time after really thinking about it. It's just really come to light here lately though, it's subtle at 7yds with some handguns, but really starts to show it's ugly head at 15-25yds. I have always shot Glocks high left and blamed the gun not fitting my hand properly. However I noticed it with the P-09 in 9mm that I had. This last range trip it was occurring with the Springer Loaded 1911 (.45) and the Sig P320 Carry (.40). But it did not happen with the P320 Compact (9mm), that did shoot a bit high but windage was right on the money. I realize the shooting high could have other factors thrown in there, like style of sights and ammo being used, so I'm not overly concerned about that unless the shooting high is related to the pulling left part and could possibly be remedied together.

I tried to correct on the spot with no real success. I made changes in my grip, my stance, where my thumbs were in relation to each other, tighter grip, looser grip. I also played around with finger placement on the trigger, more/less finger. I tried pulling the trigger in a more straight back motion. Nothing really seemed to correct the issue.

I don't really want to drift a bunch of rear sights to the right to correct something that I am doing wrong. According to this fancy chart, I'm possibly anticipating recoil and breaking my wrists up. This does make some sense as I will admit that I caught myself several times "flinching" right before firing and sometimes flinching bad enough that I caught myself and didn't pull the trigger enough to fire the gun. The flinching only occurred with the .40 and the .45, not with the 9mm. But I don't think it's necessarily a caliber issue due to experiencing same issue with P-09 in 9mm and numerous Glocks in 9mm.

I has a deep confusion.

Maybe you just need more practice. I've noticed myself during dry fire being absolutely perfect, but when at the range doing the same stuff you mention..... It's all in the mind. For whatever reason my brain is telling my hand "there is a freakin explosion about to happen on you!"

 

[LockStocksAndBarrel]

Uh oh. 15% off sitewide...

CZUSA - Home

 

[RustyHornet]

Just ordered threaded barrel for the P-09

She's gonna be sweet! I'm gonna be excited to shoot her next time.

 

[churchmouse]

She's gonna be sweet! I'm gonna be excited to shoot her next time.

Yup. When the stamp comes it might go "Pew-Pew-Pew"

 

[Snapdragon]

Uh oh. 15% off sitewide...

CZUSA - Home

I saw that, but they didn't have anything I needed. I need grips and a holster for the RAMI, and they didn't have either one.

 

[db1959]

I saw that, but they didn't have anything I needed. I need grips and a holster for the RAMI, and they didn't have either one.

Your RAMI came without grips?

When you find a holster let me know. I am looking for one too. Actually I am looking for 2, IWB and OWB.

 

[Snapdragon]

I had an IWB holster that I bought from Amazon, but I sent it back. It was way too bulky. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00YTEWOSE?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00

Looking for some purtier grips, but not going to spend a lot on them. If some fall into my lap, fine, if not, that's OK too.

 

[IndyGlockMan]

My last range trip I decided to focus on shooting handguns at extended distances from a standing position. I have realized and confirmed that I am shooting high left with most handguns and have been for quite some time after really thinking about it. It's just really come to light here lately though, it's subtle at 7yds with some handguns, but really starts to show it's ugly head at 15-25yds. I have always shot Glocks high left and blamed the gun not fitting my hand properly. However I noticed it with the P-09 in 9mm that I had. This last range trip it was occurring with the Springer Loaded 1911 (.45) and the Sig P320 Carry (.40). But it did not happen with the P320 Compact (9mm), that did shoot a bit high but windage was right on the money. I realize the shooting high could have other factors thrown in there, like style of sights and ammo being used, so I'm not overly concerned about that unless the shooting high is related to the pulling left part and could possibly be remedied together.

I tried to correct on the spot with no real success. I made changes in my grip, my stance, where my thumbs were in relation to each other, tighter grip, looser grip. I also played around with finger placement on the trigger, more/less finger. I tried pulling the trigger in a more straight back motion. Nothing really seemed to correct the issue.

I don't really want to drift a bunch of rear sights to the right to correct something that I am doing wrong. According to this fancy chart, I'm possibly anticipating recoil and breaking my wrists up. This does make some sense as I will admit that I caught myself several times "flinching" right before firing and sometimes flinching bad enough that I caught myself and didn't pull the trigger enough to fire the gun. The flinching only occurred with the .40 and the .45, not with the 9mm. But I don't think it's necessarily a caliber issue due to experiencing same issue with P-09 in 9mm and numerous Glocks in 9mm.

I has a deep confusion.

The "flinching" you refer to is called Healing. Your mind thinks that it can anticipate the recoil and try to make up for it with a sudden flinching type reflex, but it can't. Nobody can.
We are all guilty of healing and it's something a lot of people struggle with (myself included), even people with 30+ years shooting experience.
A lot of people's shooting problems stem from the fact that most of us are self taught and we think we are doing the right things for us.
We make adjustments to feel more comfortable or to try and make up for an issue by changing our stance, grip, or whatever and it all ends up being a big mess.

The best thing you can do to start correcting a healing issue (and most other issues) is dry fire practice.
You have to re-program your brain and learn new muscle memory. Dry firing your gun at home will help a lot.
I always think of shooting the way manufacturers test fire guns in a robotic jig that holds the gun perfectly still while the trigger is perfectly pulled by the exact same force and angle each time.
Of course, we are not machines and can't to it perfectly every time but we can get close.

Grip the gun properly (make sure it's not loaded ), aim at something on the wall, and pull the trigger with out the sights moving a C-hair.... when you can to that, then repeat 10,000 more times.
When the hammer/striker falls, it should almost take you by surprise... like it went off a split second before you were expecting it. This technique will bring those groups right into the 9 & 10 ring every time.

Shooting requires consistency just like a good golf swing, bowling, or whatever. It also requires setting your ego aside and realizing that it's not the gun causing accuracy issues... sorry, it's not the gun.
Dry fire practice every day from now until the next time you go to the range and I promise you will see a difference.
Next is stance, grip, sight picture... but I won't get into that now.
Once you cure the healing issue and shoot more consistently, you will find that you can shoot any gun well... 1911, CZ, Glock, Sigs, revolvers, what ever... it won't matter what gun is in your hand.

A good way to test yourself at the range is to load up a mag with live ammo and add couple snap caps to the mix. If you re-load, you can make some duds with a spent primer.
When you pull the trigger on a snap cap, you will know if you are still healing or not... click...flinch... awwww crap! LOL!

This is a public service announcement and is not directed entirely to T-DOGG

 

[Woobie]

Sig academy had another cool recommendation along these lines for various anticipation-related maladies. Load up a couple of mags of ammo. Insert mag and chamber a round, then remove the mag. Fire the first shot, then try to fire a second shot. Obviously nothing will happen, as there is no round chamberred, but you will heel or push or whatever you do when the trigger breaks. You can keep doing this until you run through a mag or two, and by the end you should see improvement. Obviously this will not work with a pistol that has a magazine safety. This isn't a substitute for dry firing, but it is less boring, and it is something productive you can do at the range.

 

[churchmouse]

The "flinching" you refer to is called Healing. Your mind thinks that it can anticipate the recoil and try to make up for it with a sudden flinching type reflex, but it can't. Nobody can.
We are all guilty of healing and it's something a lot of people struggle with (myself included), even people with 30+ years shooting experience.
A lot of people's shooting problems stem from the fact that most of us are self taught and we think we are doing the right things for us.
We make adjustments to feel more comfortable or to try and make up for an issue by changing our stance, grip, or whatever and it all ends up being a big mess.

The best thing you can do to start correcting a healing issue (and most other issues) is dry fire practice.
You have to re-program your brain and learn new muscle memory. Dry firing your gun at home will help a lot.
I always think of shooting the way manufacturers test fire guns in a robotic jig that holds the gun perfectly still while the trigger is perfectly pulled by the exact same force and angle each time.
Of course, we are not machines and can't to it perfectly every time but we can get close.

Grip the gun properly (make sure it's not loaded ), aim at something on the wall, and pull the trigger with out the sights moving a C-hair.... when you can to that, then repeat 10,000 more times.
When the hammer/striker falls, it should almost take you by surprise... like it went off a split second before you were expecting it. This technique will bring those groups right into the 9 & 10 ring every time.

Shooting requires consistency just like a good golf swing, bowling, or whatever. It also requires setting your ego aside and realizing that it's not the gun causing accuracy issues... sorry, it's not the gun.
Dry fire practice every day from now until the next time you go to the range and I promise you will see a difference.
Next is stance, grip, sight picture... but I won't get into that now.
Once you cure the healing issue and shoot more consistently, you will find that you can shoot any gun well... 1911, CZ, Glock, Sigs, revolvers, what ever... it won't matter what gun is in your hand.

A good way to test yourself at the range is to load up a mag with live ammo and add couple snap caps to the mix. If you re-load, you can make some duds with a spent primer.
When you pull the trigger on a snap cap, you will know if you are still healing or not... click...flinch... awwww crap! LOL!

This is a public service announcement and is not directed entirely to T-DOGG

 

[churchmouse]

Make absolutely sure gun is not loaded. Put a laser bore site tool in your gun. If the barrel is too short get the chambered model.
Point the laser at a designated place (gun is unloaded yes) and run your dry fire drills. A dollar says the laser will not stay on point. This is a very good way to show what you are actually experiencing.

 

[Fordtough25]

Sig academy had another cool recommendation along these lines for various anticipation-related maladies. Load up a couple of mags of ammo. Insert mag and chamber a round, then remove the mag. Fire the first shot, then try to fire a second shot. Obviously nothing will happen, as there is no round chamberred, but you will heel or push or whatever you do when the trigger breaks. You can keep doing this until you run through a mag or two, and by the end you should see improvement. Obviously this will not work with a pistol that has a magazine safety. This isn't a substitute for dry firing, but it is less boring, and it is something productive you can do at the range.

Good drill from sig academy, eye opening!!

 

[IndyGlockMan]

Sig academy had another cool recommendation along these lines for various anticipation-related maladies. Load up a couple of mags of ammo. Insert mag and chamber a round, then remove the mag. Fire the first shot, then try to fire a second shot. Obviously nothing will happen, as there is no round chamberred, but you will heel or push or whatever you do when the trigger breaks. You can keep doing this until you run through a mag or two, and by the end you should see improvement. Obviously this will not work with a pistol that has a magazine safety. This isn't a substitute for dry firing, but it is less boring, and it is something productive you can do at the range.

this works too, but I prefer using snap caps because you don't know when it's coming and it's more of a true test

 

[wtburnette]

Just got back from meeting a couple of buddies at Point Blank range in Greenwood. Whew, what a fun time! I'm good now till next weekend when I should have my CCO

 

[T-DOGG]

Solid advice everyone. I will most likely utilize all of it. Snap caps, dryfire, and the laser tool. It saddens me a little that after years of shooting you'd think I wouldnt have issues like this. But at least it gives me a reason to shoot and practice more. It's a good goal to work towards. Thank you guys.

 

[IndyGlockMan]

Just got back from meeting a couple of buddies at Point Blank range in Greenwood. Whew, what a fun time! I'm good now till next weekend when I should have my CCO

How's the Greenwood range compared to Carmel? Same?

 

[Fordtough25]

How's the Greenwood range compared to Carmel? Same?

I've been to several Point Blanks around Cincy and they're all nice. Wish we had one closer down here!

 

[wtburnette]

How's the Greenwood range compared to Carmel? Same?

Very similar. The layout is a bit different and the range is split into two areas, ten lanes each. One side for rifle and the other for handguns (though you can shoot both in the rifle side, or just handgun if needed). They did this to make the handgun side quieter for newer shooters. There are some things I prefer about the Carmel location, but all told, very similar.

 

[Hopper]

Just got back from meeting a couple of buddies at Point Blank range in Greenwood. Whew, what a fun time! I'm good now till next weekend when I should have my CCO

Ahh, very nice choice. You'll have to post up a report when you get it, I'm sure it will be light's out!