The conspiracy against Black History Month

[Kutnupe14]

It wasn't for lack of trying

Anyhoo, if anyone really wants to have a "White History Month", there are several groups trying to get one started....

...have fun on those websites. Just a small sample of the efforts to date:

I hate that people use the battle flag to push that nonsense. Back home that would be a punch in the nose.... by white people who understand the heritage of that flag.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

If you don't know where you're from, you don't know where you're going. It may propagate the feeling that one is different, but that should be discouraged. What it should do, is highlight capabilities and illustrate that anything can be accomplished. You can be inspired by anyone, but seeing someone "make it" that comes from a similar background certainly resonates better.

...and that is where you and I (and my ex-wife) will disagree. Not on intent, but on actual effect.

Teaching "Black history" means its separate. Like you can't learn about a cotton gin in the same history as you learn about the Model T. It's not even "Black history" as much as "those of Western African descent history". I had a friend in the military who's parents were immigrants from the West Indies. I couldn't find that on a map right now if I had to and don't know anything about the West Indies. What I do know is he looked "black" but he was quite different than the African descent blacks and constantly complained that the black soldiers treated him like a turncoat because he wasn't "black enough." Where's his part in black history month? There's your problem. Once you start slicing, no matter how thinly you want to slice it, someone is left out. "Black culture" is not monolithic, as I'm sure you're more aware than most. "Black history" isn't either. You either want to integrate, or you don't.

I learned from, admired, and despised a multitude of NCO's and commissioned officers while I was in the military. I never thought I couldn't learn from the example of our XO because he didn't look like me, nor share my ancestry. Teaching someone they have more to learn from someone who shares a physical characteristic of theirs vs someone else isn't integration. Expecting a West Indies kid to relate better to someone of African descent over, say, Asian descent, just because of shared skin color doesn't either, and propagates the "you're different" as well.

The fact this is even a conversation shows it is divisive on some level, does it not?

**on edit**

Oh, and I meant to address "but seeing someone "make it" that comes from a similar background certainly resonates better" as well.

Just because someone is black, they have a similiar background? My ex-wife grew up in the projects of Jersey City with a single parent and in poverty. I had a guy in my company who grew up middle class with both parents on a ranch in Texas. Both were black. How are their backgrounds similar? Skin color =/= background, and again goes toward an expectation of a monolithic black culture.

 

[Kutnupe14]

i wonder what their crime rate is in that town?

Why? How is that relevant?

Kut (sees this thread taking an ugly turn, because we all know what TT means)

 

[HoughMade]

i wonder what their crime rate is in that town?

I don't know about the crime rate, but it clearly has a measurable A-hole rate.

 

[chezuki]

IBTL.

 

[hornadylnl]

i wonder what their crime rate is in that town?

Most importantly, does their Walmart check receipts?

 

[Trigger Time]

Why? How is that relevant?

Kut (sees this thread taking an ugly turn, because we all know what TT means)

Why do you know what I mean. Are you using statistics to deduce my thought process?
this thread is a waste. Neither side will EVER agree

 

[phylodog]

I have no issue with Black History Month or the Summer Celebration (Black Expo).

The pic in the OP is ridiculous and deserves zero response.

 

[Kutnupe14]

...and that is where you and I (and my ex-wife) will disagree. Not on intent, but on actual effect.

Teaching "Black history" means its separate. Like you can't learn about a cotton gin in the same history as you learn about the Model T. It's not even "Black history" as much as "those of Western African descent history". I had a friend in the military who's parents were immigrants from the West Indies. I couldn't find that on a map right now if I had to and don't know anything about the West Indies. What I do know is he looked "black" but he was quite different than the African descent blacks and constantly complained that the black soldiers treated him like a turncoat because he wasn't "black enough." Where's his part in black history month? There's your problem. Once you start slicing, no matter how thinly you want to slice it, someone is left out. "Black culture" is not monolithic, as I'm sure you're more aware than most. "Black history" isn't either. You either want to integrate, or you don't.

I learned from, admired, and despised a multitude of NCO's and commissioned officers while I was in the military. I never thought I couldn't learn from the example of our XO because he didn't look like me, nor share my ancestry. Teaching someone they have more to learn from someone who shares a physical characteristic of theirs vs someone else isn't integration. Expecting a West Indies kid to relate better to someone of African descent over, say, Asian descent, just because of shared skin color doesn't either, and propagates the "you're different" as well.

The fact this is even a conversation shows it is divisive on some level, does it not?

The vast majority of west Indians are of African descent. You know where it is, as it's commonly referred to as the Caribbean. Jamaicans, for instance, often refer to themselves as west Indian. You basically have just illustrated my point. You have a deeper knowledge of something you always knew. Something, I would wish, given its proximity to the U.S., was common knowledge. West Indians, share the same lost heritage. Marcus Garvey was Jamaican, and is often cited during BHM.

 

[Trigger Time]

I don't know about the crime rate, but it clearly has a measurable A-hole rate.

Haha. Now that was pretty funny even for you. Good job

 

[Kutnupe14]

Why do you know what I mean. Are you using statistics to deduce my thought process?
this thread is a waste. Neither side will EVER agree

We ALL know what you meant with that little quip.

 

[THE BIG SITT]

Apparent you do too....



Nor do you have an issue trying to make correlations....



I have no issue with race giving a person a different outlook on life. I do have an issue with race being used to attribute behavior. You, I guess have neither issue.

And you think that someone who looks at the world in a "different" way won't let that affect their behavior?

 

[BehindBlueI's]

The vast majority of west Indians are of African descent. You know where it is, as it's commonly referred to as the Caribbean. Jamaicans, for instance, often refer to themselves as west Indian. You basically have just illustrated my point. You have a deeper knowledge of something you always knew. Something, I would wish, given its proximity to the U.S., was common knowledge. West Indians, share the same lost heritage. Marcus Garvey was Jamaican, and is often cited during BHM.

Descent perhaps, but is the culture not quite a bit different than those who came straight to America from West Africa? My friend sure seemed to think so, and the folks who treated him like an outcast seemed to agree. I did learn where the West Indies is, though, so thanks for that. I have no idea who Marcus Garvey is, so BHM failed me there, I suppose.

I'll quote myself here, as I edited after you'd probably already read the post:

Oh, and I meant to address "but seeing someone "make it" that comes from a similar background certainly resonates better" as well.

Just because someone is black, they have a similiar background? My ex-wife grew up in the projects of Jersey City with a single parent and in poverty. I had a guy in my company who grew up middle class with both parents on a ranch in Texas. Both were black. How are their backgrounds similar? Skin color =/= background, and again goes toward an expectation of a monolithic black culture.

 

[HoughMade]

 

[churchmouse]

Wow!
people can always find issues where they don't exist!

Just this.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

What's the point of this post, and what in this thread does it address?

 

[Kutnupe14]

And you think that someone who looks at the world in a "different" way won't let that affect their behavior?

I should have qualified that with "negative behavior." Outlook based on race should never justify hooliganism. There are many times, that I personally, think of my "condition," and adjust my behavior. I've the guy in the elevator with the lady with a purse in a death grip.... So I purposely stand as far away from a woman if we're on an elevator alone. I was the 12 year old in the comic store followed by the owner my entire time there, and when I went to the counter to pay, he was so embarrassed at his behavior, he gave me my comic for free. So now if I know exactly what I'm looking for, I immediately ask a clerk for help upon entering a store. I had a fairer skinned girlfriend, and once while at a grocery store, she opened up a bag of candy (she intended to buy) and began eating them. I was horrified. I took the bag from her and paid for it immediately. I'm the guy who constantly hears "you're the whitest black person I know" which they think is a compliment, but is actually highly offensive. I'm the guy who tips at minimum, a 1/3 of my dinner bill, because "black people dont tip well" (i have lots of friends in the restaurant industry). How can I not be conscious of the way I look, and certain perceptions some people have. And why wouldn't I adjust my behavior to debunk ignorance?

 

[Kutnupe14]

Descent perhaps, but is the culture not quite a bit different than those who came straight to America from West Africa? My friend sure seemed to think so, and the folks who treated him like an outcast seemed to agree. I did learn where the West Indies is, though, so thanks for that. I have no idea who Marcus Garvey is, so BHM failed me there, I suppose.

I'll quote myself here, as I edited after you'd probably already read the post:

West Indian immigrants, recent ones, have far more in common with black Americans, than recent African immigrants. West Indians assimilate quite well. Your friend no doubt was dealing with ignorant people. People, I have no doubt haven't a clue about their culture, American, Black or otherwise.
As for your wife, and the guy from Texas. I can assure you that if she was the poorest of the poor, and the guy the richest of the rich, they would have very similar experiences. Ask your wife.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

As for your wife, and the guy from Texas. I can assure you that if she was the poorest of the poor, and the guy the richest of the rich, they would have very similar experiences. Ask your wife.

I just know what I observed and what they said and will disagree.

 

[Slawburger]

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

The "one nation", "indivisible" and "for all" portions seemed relevant to the thread. Sometimes we forget that we are all Americans and should direct our attention to external threats instead of internal differences. There are lots of categories by which to sub-divide the American people and pit us against one another. Let's not fall into that trap. We have enough trouble with external enemies that hate all of us because they see us as one group, "Americans".