Tariffs on Chinese goods?

[BugI02]

How China can win a trade war in 1 move

So this is interesting. I had a client a few years ago that was developing an application for rare earth magnets. (That's still one of the most fascinating technologies I've ever come across, but unfortunately, the whole thing fell apart.) Working with him, I learned about the Magnaquench thing and the issues surrounding it. [snip]

It occurs to me that it is better to learn this lesson during an economic war than later during a shooting one. And hopefully China has what passes for a war college and their officers really study what led the US and Japan to war, not just the ideological version of events

Also I thought there is a basis for commercial RE production (given high enough prices) dissolved in the hypersaline brine of Mono Lake, all you have to do is pump and process

 

[trailrider]

Agreed. The interesting thing is that a lot of the imports that China has hit with tariffs are food. Unlike most commodities, that amount of food is not easily replaced with food from other countries - there is not a lot of spare supply and the supply is not easily elastic. The U.S. is a food production powerhouse and production cannot be easily ramped up in other places. I think we're in a good position to come out ahead in the negotiations if some weak-kneed folks don't cause us to blink first. They HAVE to have food and will be paying more for it. We don't have to have rubber dog **** and we can buy it elsewhere. Rare earth elements for fancy batteries and guidance systems is just about the only thing they have that we can't cheaply/quickly replace, but we've been working on that infrastructure issue for a few years (domestic REE production and refining).

Here is the list of stuff China is adding tariffs on:
https://qz.com/1242652/china-tariffs-the-complete-list-of-128-affected-good-class-of-goods/

Unless China is willing to starve their people to win this economic battle. I'm guessing the Chinese response was anticipated by the White House. Unfortunately a stand off could be devastating to farmers. They'll have to pay for it twice as speculation has already affected markets. They'll pay again if it comes to fruition.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Unless China is willing to starve their people to win this economic battle. I'm guessing the Chinese response was anticipated by the White House. Unfortunately a stand off could be devastating to farmers. They'll have to pay for it twice as speculation has already affected markets. They'll pay again if it comes to fruition.

Oh... I think we already know China has no qualms doing that. But honestly, they wouldn't need to. Their govt is powerful enough, and more importantly trusted enough (by the people), that all they would need to do was implement a war footing rationing program.

 

[KLB]

Oh... I think we already know China has no qualms doing that. But honestly, they wouldn't need to. Their govt is powerful enough, and more importantly trusted enough (by the people), that all they would need to do was implement a war footing rationing program.

Trusted? That is a big assumption.

Feared by possibly.

 

[BugI02]

Oh... I think we already know China has no qualms doing that. But honestly, they wouldn't need to. Their govt is powerful enough, and more importantly trusted enough (by the people), that all they would need to do was implement a war footing rationing program.

Odd, I believe the conventional wisdom was the Chinese instituted market-based reforms largely because they didn't think they could keep a lid on the aspirations of their people, and they were leery of yet another "people's revolution" if they did not provide an outlet for those pressures

Somehow I think they won't go there without a truly existential reason

 

[luger fan]

Trusted? That is a big assumption.

Feared by possibly.

We have a winner kids. Slave labor is a way life there. Not so much here unless you are a minority driving through Carmel.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Trusted? That is a big assumption.

Feared by possibly.

Nope, I meant trusted. Trusted by the people who would bear the brunt of a trade war, which is China's still sizeable, and still pro-Communist, peasantry. Rich people start wars, poor people start revolutions. China has no fear of the latter.

 

[KLB]

Nope, I meant trusted. Trusted by the people who would bear the brunt of a trade war, which is China's still sizeable, and still pro-Communist, peasantry. Rich people start wars, poor people start revolutions. China has no fear of the latter.

Only because they have an unarmed peasantry.

Again, I disagree with your opinion on their trust. I wonder if polled in a manner in which they could be guaranteed safety from retribution what their opinions would be.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Only because they have an unarmed peasantry.

Again, I disagree with your opinion on their trust. I wonder if polled in a manner in which they could be guaranteed safety from retribution what their opinions would be.

They may not have even considered it. Ok, you disagree with my opinion on trust. How about I frame it another way.... the Chinese trust their govt more than Americans trust their govt?

 

[BugI02]

They may not have even considered it. Ok, you disagree with my opinion on trust. How about I frame it another way.... the Chinese trust their govt more than Americans trust their govt?

That's why we still have guns

 

[KLB]

They may not have even considered it. Ok, you disagree with my opinion on trust. How about I frame it another way.... the Chinese trust their govt more than Americans trust their govt?

Again, openly or in private? I would expect the level of trust in a totalitarian government to be low privately. Not publicly of course, because then you disappear.

 

[kings650]

Recent tariff dispute is like a game to see who can endure the "pain" more. Both sides will have wins and loses during this dispute. We just have to wait and see how much both sides are willing to sacrifice in order to win this trade war.

 

[SheepDog4Life]

And the answer is....

CNBC: China's Xi announces plans to 'open' China, including lowering tariffs on imported autos
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/09/chinese-president-xi-jinping-speaks-at-boao-forum-for-asia.html

China's Xi promises to cut auto import tariff, warns against ?Cold War? mentality | Fox News

Xi Jinping speech: China pledges to cut tariffs on car imports this year

Those millions of people who were going to be devastatingly affected by Trump's global trade war with China... suddenly will have a vastly easier China market to export to.

How about that? Who'd a thunk it?

 

[Thor]

Trump is doing with China exactly what Reagan did with Japan. It's the reason we have Japanese auto manufacturers in this country at all. Most Asian countries look at big industry as a public good and subsidize it heavily which provides a very biased playing field. China has been systematically killing our heavy industry and high tech electronics...American's don't prefer to invest in financial and software development companies because the ChiComs are just better at this stuff; it's because they are state owned industries being weaponized to sweep us from the world stage.

And of course the average chinaman fears their government, it's a regime so totalitarian it makes Hitler and Stalin look like pikers...the difference is that as long as it benefits them they keep their mouth shut and don't care. They shut up, do their work and hope that the government rewards them, I guess it beats having a warlord burn your field and kill your family. Besides, Mao already killed 60+ million who disagreed and spoke up.

They are ready to go to war over the S China Sea which they view as their property now, they will go to war over Taiwan because no inch of what they claim can become independent. It's long past time we stopped funding their ambitions and took a more strategic view of what we need in this country for our long term good...not just a short term profit and cheap ****. We need heavy industry, and we need technology companies that actually make things.

 

[kings650]

We are also partially responsible for China's economic growth. After all, US is their biggest market and we do buy a lot of their products. If we bought more "Made in USA" products, our manufacturing sectors might be in much better shape.

 

[Thor]

That would be my (repeatedly repeated) point exactly Kings650...no more products from the ChiComs, no more fish from the S China Sea from the ChiComs. In the long game Nixon was wrong.

 

[kings650]

That would be my (repeatedly repeated) point exactly Kings650...no more products from the ChiComs, no more fish from the S China Sea from the ChiComs. In the long game Nixon was wrong.

Now that sounds too harsh. I did not mean a total end of trade with them. China is big market now and their growing middle class offers huge opportunities for many US companies. We can be more conscious consumers to protect our industries than just boycotting "Made in China" goods.

 

[BugI02]

US trade deficit with China $375 billion in 2017

We are paying for the "belt and road" and their military build up. Way to go cheapos

Got rope?

 

[Thor]

Yeah, I'm even starting in on harsh...flock them, flock them in the heart, flock them till they're dead. Buck up ya' slack jawed ****ots. Time to pick sides.

I apologize if any snowflakes were melted. Though not really.

 

[edporch]

Trump says, and I have no doubts, that Red China has stolen technology from us, and is now selling it to us.

Why doesn't he simply ban the import of any product that is shown to contain stolen technology?
And make an effort to get the rest of the free world to enact this same policy.