Syrian Refugees

[BugI02]

Well, I didn't get across to you what I was attempting.

What I meant by that was: Radical ideologies (like militant Islam) can appeal to vulnerable people anywhere...even natural-born citizens could fall victim to the siren song of eternal religious reward.

And that was my greater point, Islam and Christianity offer a terrible loophole: any wickedness you visit on your fellow men during your life is moot, as you are "forgiven" by your imaginary god. It is ridiculous, and it leads to all manner of ridiculous behaviour: from refusing medical treatment for your own children, to shooting non-believers in the streets of foreign capitals: it's all good, my god is great!

I don't think that leaving religion behind us would eliminate violence. I also don't think you really thought I was arguing that in the first place. I do think leaving religion behind us would remove another excuse for the use of violence when it is in no way necessary.

Paul, I don't think in many of the most egregious cases that it is the religion at work at all. I really think that there is a certain subset of humanity that just likes to hurt and kill. I think an organization like Daesh just gives them an excuse - a religious fig leaf - and a framework within which to sate their sadistic desires.

 

[1861navy]

...
One thing is for sure, GPIA7A's graphic up thread shows a relatively high number of pro-Daesh tweets coming from the US. They're coming from somewhere. Probably not the Christians. So...

.

Right, I meant; would rather avoid having them here in the sense of any possibles from the refugees.

That brings up another point, with such a high number of pro IS tweets/sentiment among members of similar creed as the refugees. Wouldn't conversion of some of the refugees to pro IS sentiment be rather likely?

 

[mrjarrell]

I'll just leave this here. Not sure what Pence thinks he'd be able to do about it.

Agency will defy governor, bring Syrian refugees to Indiana | WISH-TV

 

[jamil]

I'll just leave this here. Not sure what Pence thinks he'd be able to do about it.

Agency will defy governor, bring Syrian refugees to Indiana | WISH-TV

“Refugees who end up in the United States are the most vetted, scrutinized, thoroughly investigated individuals that ever arrive on American shores,” said Barack Obama.

​

First, maybe he's not embellishing--after all this statement doesn't have red lines and the word "period" at the end. So let's assume he's not embellishing. I don't doubt that the government expends tremendous energy searching records no one has on them. And sometimes expending energy for the sake of expending energy accomplishes something, like when I run on my treadmill without going anywhere. What does "thoroughly investigating individuals", when there are really no records on them, accomplish?

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

Canada To No Longer Accept Single Male Refugees From Syria | The Daily Caller

I guess they're a little dubious of their vetting process. Maybe Obama ought to send them a copy of our procedures, task sheets, and job aids.

 

[churchmouse]

Canada To No Longer Accept Single Male Refugees From Syria | The Daily Caller

Ha

 

[Gunner72]

What gets me is some politicians want extensive background checks on gun owners and buyers , but are they checking these refugees?????

 

[churchmouse]

900 million dollars.

 

[churchmouse]

What gets me is some politicians want extensive background checks on gun owners and buyers , but are they checking these refugees?????

Checking what. There are little if any physical records to check.

 

[PaulF]

No, you got your point across. That's exactly how I read it. You don't think ideology has as much impact on behavior as religion? What impact has the BLM movement had on police? At least one instance of "justified" murder happened because of that belief/ideology. And it had nothing to do with religion.

The way I see it, people just believe stuff. Humans are vulnerable to believing things that promote violence. Ideologies, religions, prejudices, it's all based on belief. I don't see it as any of my business to take steps to stop people from believing because most belief is benign. It's only my business to stop actions against me.

C'mon, jamil...how long have you and I been involved in these discussions? What do you think I am advocating here? I want people to leave religion behind for themselves, because they see for themselves the damage that it does. I want no part in using force (or intimidation) to quell independent thought.

I don't care what Muslims or Christians believe, I care how they behave in my neighborhood. Given the demographics of where the most violence is coming from, I'm more confident living in a Christian neighborhood than a Muslim neighborhood. If Muslims think that is an unfair characterization, maybe they need to take bigger steps to fix the demographic perceptions.

Jamil, if you are a victim of violent crime in Indiana, your attacker is almost certainly going to identify as a Christian. Our prisons are full of Christians. Hell, basically every crime in our state is committed by Christians. Every beating. Every robbery. Every rape. Every murder.

Christians and Muslims believe they can do harm to other humans and go on to collect a reward in the "afterlife". They believe their god is coming any day now to end the world, and they welcome this.

These ideas are not founded in reality. These ideas are dangerous, belief in them leads people to behave abhorrently.

The ideas that an all-powerful creator of the universe exists at all, that we are able to communicate with it using our mind, and that we will live forever after our deaths...these are not supported by any empirical evidence, and would likely disappear from our lexicon if not for religious tradition.

Right now, in very real terms, parts of the world are tearing themselves apart over forces that exist solely within their imaginations. Generations wasted, over literally nothing.

Religion is a waste of a good person's energy. Of course I fully support a person's right to engage in that waste.

 

[Jludo]

C'mon, jamil...how long have you and I been involved in these discussions? What do you think I am advocating here? I want people to leave religion behind for themselves, because they see for themselves the damage that it does. I want no part in using force (or intimidation) to quell independent thought.



Jamil, if you are a victim of violent crime in Indiana, your attacker is almost certainly going to identify as a Christian. Our prisons are full of Christians. Hell, basically every crime in our state is committed by Christians. Every beating. Every robbery. Every rape. Every murder.

Christians and Muslims believe they can do harm to other humans and go on to collect a reward in the "afterlife". They believe their god is coming any day now to end the world, and they welcome this.

These ideas are not founded in reality. These ideas are dangerous, belief in them leads people to behave abhorrently.

The ideas that an all-powerful creator of the universe exists at all, that we are able to communicate with it using our mind, and that we will live forever after our deaths...these are not supported by any empirical evidence, and would likely disappear from our lexicon if not for religious tradition.

Right now, in very real terms, parts of the world are tearing themselves apart over forces that exist solely within their imaginations. Generations wasted, over literally nothing.

Religion is a waste of a good person's energy. Of course I fully support a person's right to engage in that waste.

Well put

 

[Dead Duck]

I will pray for you both - PaulF and the Troll....

 

[PaulF]

I will pray for you both - PaulF and the Troll....

I hope you brought enough for everyone, mister...

 

[RobbyMaQ]

What gets me is some politicians want extensive background checks on gun owners and buyers , but are they checking these refugees?????

I've seen plenty of left argue the similarities here... which leaves one party 'right' & the other 'wrong' regardless of whatever decision is made on either issue in their minds. But the spark has been ignited in their (left) heads, and they cannot ignore their clever arguments, especially ones which they've made themselves. Based on stats, refugees who've been vetted aren't nearly the security concern that asylum seekers or those with visa are (imo).

There are 300+ million people in this country, and 300 million guns. Do the math. More importantly, ISIS should do the math.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I know of no Christian that thinks if I go cut off some other guy's head for not believing as they do. Maybe you do. I hear Woopy Goldberg say things like this but of all the people I know, I've never heard them say they believe God will reward them for murder.

I see a lot of what I can assume are atheists on anti-gun sites wishing pain, injury, and death on gun owners though.

C'mon, jamil...how long have you and I been involved in these discussions? What do you think I am advocating here? I want people to leave religion behind for themselves, because they see for themselves the damage that it does. I want no part in using force (or intimidation) to quell independent thought.



Jamil, if you are a victim of violent crime in Indiana, your attacker is almost certainly going to identify as a Christian. Our prisons are full of Christians. Hell, basically every crime in our state is committed by Christians. Every beating. Every robbery. Every rape. Every murder.

Christians and Muslims believe they can do harm to other humans and go on to collect a reward in the "afterlife". They believe their god is coming any day now to end the world, and they welcome this.

These ideas are not founded in reality. These ideas are dangerous, belief in them leads people to behave abhorrently.

The ideas that an all-powerful creator of the universe exists at all, that we are able to communicate with it using our mind, and that we will live forever after our deaths...these are not supported by any empirical evidence, and would likely disappear from our lexicon if not for religious tradition.

Right now, in very real terms, parts of the world are tearing themselves apart over forces that exist solely within their imaginations. Generations wasted, over literally nothing.

Religion is a waste of a good person's energy. Of course I fully support a person's right to engage in that waste.

 

[actaeon277]

I know of no Christian that thinks if I go cut off some other guy's head for not believing as they do. Maybe you do. I hear Woopy Goldberg say things like this but of all the people I know, I've never heard them say they believe God will reward them for murder.

I see a lot of what I can assume are atheists on anti-gun sites wishing pain, injury, and death on gun owners though.

atheism is it's own religion

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

atheism is it's own religion

It certainly requires faith.

 

[ArcadiaGP]

Agency will defy governor, bring Syrian refugees to Indiana | WISH-TV

 

[Consciouscitizen18]

Not sure if anybody here has been exposed to this video or if it has been in this thread already but I haven't seen it in any of the pages I've scrolled through in this thread already. The video was published November 9, 2015, 1 day before the Paris attacks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZc

The video depicts what mass Islamic refugee crisis has meant most importantly Germany and Sweden but also France, Denmark, and Britain. A lot of violence and chaos are noted, but the theme of the video highlights on how natives are essentially being breeded out of existence. The UN Migration Chief wants "the EU to undermine national homogeneity." -Peter Sutherland, Ex- Goldman Sachs chairman and current UN Migration Chief and Ex Director-General of the WTO.

One of the quotes in the video I found interesting is of French PM Manual Valls addressing the mass immigration of Muslim refugees. "What's the goal? The goal is to meet the [EU] challenge of interracial marriage. It's not a choice. It's an obligation. If voluntarism does not work for the republic then the state will move into more coercive measures."

It's a 19 minute video with a lot of different clips but if this is the real life results that Europe is receiving how could anybody want this for America?
We're being bombarded with a lot of valuable and invaluable information right now, but I think we need particular with what is important and for now pay close attention to Europe and how the UN executives are handling and promoting the situation at hand. What are their goals with this? The French PM told his, but I'm sure other people in power see different benefits of this as well.

 

[308jake]

I will pray for you both - PaulF and the Troll....

And The Pop too?