Stopped and detained by Beech Groves Finest

[Hotdoger]

That depends on the totality of the circumstances. I heard that somewhere.

By the OP confessing it was in his vehicle the LEO was good to go........

 

[Jack Burton]

Didnt read the 40 pages of posts. Ill say this--Should have checked that all your headlights worked. Should have put rifle in a case. Would have saved you the butthurt, would have saved these posts from being made

Because we all carry spare headlights in the trunk along with a spare tire, eh.

 

[Jack Burton]

By the OP confessing it was in his vehicle the LEO was good to go........

You want to quote a law on that. I can confess I have a case of Oreos in the back seat but that doesn't give a cop permission to pull one out and eat it... or to check to see if I laced them with rat poison.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

You want to quote a law on that. I can confess I have a case of Oreos in the back seat but that doesn't give a cop permission to pull one out and eat it... or to check to see if I laced them with rat poison.

Well duh...

Oreos, no...Dunkin Donuts, yes

 

[Hotdoger]

You want to quote a law on that. I can confess I have a case of Oreos in the back seat but that doesn't give a cop permission to pull one out and eat it... or to check to see if I laced them with rat poison.

Guess I needed purple for ya. Because the laugh wan't enough.

 

[KG1]

You want to quote a law on that. I can confess I have a case of Oreos in the back seat but that doesn't give a cop permission to pull one out and eat it... or to check to see if I laced them with rat poison.

That depends on what kind of car you drive and the type neighborhood it is or what time of day and if there is enough light out to see what your intentions might be with those Oreos.

Totality of the circumstances.

 

[LockStocksAndBarrel]

That depends on what kind of car you drive and the type neighborhood it is or what time of day and if there is enough light out to see what your intentions might be with those Oreos.

Totality of the circumstances.

Rep inbound!

 

[MPD179]

You want to quote a law on that. I can confess I have a case of Oreos in the back seat but that doesn't give a cop permission to pull one out and eat it... or to check to see if I laced them with rat poison.

Want to try me

 

[Timjoebillybob]

Older than *me*, you goofball.
You're still a whippersnapper.
When you look like this, call me.

I don't know if I'm older than you (I'm 41), but how about if I just look older? My sister when she introduces me to people always asks "which one of us is older?" They almost always answer her.

The help is out there and even readily available. The problem is when you have persons inadvertently causing second, and third order effects to the treatment by including crap like Mental Illness Clauses to legislation. In some places once that title is hung on you, you reputation may be scared for life.

Once again, I'll ask who gets to decide what is crazy and what is sane?!

Also, all it takes is an anti psychologist to deny anyone.

People here need to understand the distinct and unique difference between the Indiana Code and Terry.

Correct, they also need to understand the Indiana Constitution and case law regarding Terry stops from that point of view. There have been several which stress the "and dangerous" part. And iirc limit Terry under the IN Constitution.

The mental illnesses that immediately pop into my mind are things like schizophrenia and bi-polar disorder, granted that not everyone who has these illnesses is dangerous. One of my good friends is a diagnosed schizophrenic and as far as I know has never had a history of violence and probably never will.

My main point in my original statement was that some people are for lack of a better word, crazy. My opinion has always been that if you're talking to dogs, or hearing voices in your head, and have been deemed seriously mentally ill by a healthcare professional, than you shouldn't own a gun.

I've know several people with bi-polar, most of them are armed. They also are not violent or criminals. Bi-polar does not mean violent. It is characterized as swings between depression and "manic" moods. Manic does not mean violent or agressive, it refers to hyperactive, extreme happiness, etc. I also know people who are sane who are violent and very aggressive, but have no criminal past. Should they be allowed to own guns?

And I talk to my dog, although he usually doesn't answer though.

And if they have been deemed to be seriously mentally ill, why shouldn't they be allowed to own firearms? How about them owning fertilizer? Gasoline? Propane tanks? Knives? Axes? Chainsaws? etc.......

If they are so dangerous that they shouldn't be allowed to own firearms, why should they be free to walk the streets?

While not authoritative, it certainly reinforces the argument. Though there are footnotes to verify.

Wiki: Traffic stops

As stated notice the part about "and dangerous" also the part about a crime being afoot. What crime did the officers believe was afoot? In IN having a headlight out is not a crime, it is a civil infraction.

And before you say there could of been a report of a vehicle resembling his for a murder/rape/armed robbery/shots fired/sheep molestation/etc. Why didn't they perform a felony stop? It doesn't sound like one in the OP.

I suppose a $100 Dodge Dart in a rich neighborhood, or a $150,000 Mercedes Benz in the ghetto would be an obvious clue to something being out of place.
​

I've driven a $150 Plymouth satellite in a rich neighborhood and while I've never driven a $150,000 Benz. I have driven a Corvette though Gary and a new Lexus through some not very nice neighborhoods. All while in my early 20s.

And nothing was out of place in any of them, the satellite was mine and was going to visit my Dad, the Vette was my Dad's and I was following him back to his house after he had some work done on it. The Lexus I was with a friend who was transferring it between dealerships.

Because we all carry spare headlights in the trunk along with a spare tire, eh.

I usually do at least after I have the first one go out in a vehicle. When one goes out, I change both and put the good one in the glove box. But before the first one goes out I'm SOL.

 

[KG1]

Correct, they also need to understand the Indiana Constitution and case law regarding Terry stops from that point of view. There have been several which stress the "and dangerous" part. And iirc limit Terry under the IN Constitution.




And before you say there could of been a report of a vehicle resembling his for a murder/rape/armed robbery/shots fired/sheep molestation/etc. Why didn't they perform a felony stop? It doesn't sound like one in the OP.

All good points. I've just pulled out the quoted parts of your post relative to my post here.

There were a few of us trying to make some headway with the poster you addressed this to but he was'nt having any and preferred to just laugh it off and referred to us as "armchair quarterbacks".

IDK about anybody else but I was basing my posts strictly on the version the OP presented.

You also make an excellent point about how the stop took place and it refutes Ted's arguments about totality of circumstance and all of that.

If they had a predetermined notion that the OP fit the description and may have been previously involved in an violent criminal act then this stop would've went down a lot different from the beginning such as in a felony stop which you suggest.

As I have previously stated there was nothing in the OP's post that led me to believe or the OP for that matter from his comments that he was pulled over for anything other than an infraction.

That's all I have to go by and it's what I base my posts on and I stand by my opinion that the OP's rights may have been violated.

 

[Ted]

snip....

I'm sure that the terms as "plain view, probable cause, reasonable suspicion, constructive possession, and access" have very different definitions to many here.

The fact being is that given the circumstances of any particular encounter, may or may not be considered when painting a picture to a judge to suppress evidence presented by the prosecution.

• A rifle in plain view in the back seat of a car may very well be of concern to a police officer in the city after dark, while merely typical in the more rural parts of the state. Though such a find may be of special consideration if a recent shooting occurred reasonably nearby to the stop.

• A beat up Chevy in the typically poor and high crime ridden areas of the city, would certainly stand out as being out of place in a suburban neighborhood where the mean value of homes run $500k.

• A white cargo van driving down the street at 3am with new electronics, would garner high police attention after a report of a break-in at a local Rent-a-Center.

• A 2012 black BMW driving nearby a school, of which a similar automobile has been reported as involved in drug activity near a local high school, certainly would be concern to law enforcement.

• A LTCH presented that does not match the physical description of the person presenting same, certainly warrants further police scrutiny and should be investigated.

In of itself, not one of the above circumstances would necessarily present itself to be of probable cause to effect an arrest. However, the police do have the authority to investigate criminal activity that is about to occur, is occurring, or has occurred. They do such with the tools provided to them by the statutory and common law, and to deny LE these abilities, would be as fatal as living in a society that had no rule of law.

 

[JetGirl]

I don't know if I'm older than you (I'm 41),

No, you're not...

 

[Bunnykid68]

No, you're not...

I know how old you are

 

[MrsGungho]

No, you're not...

nor me either

I know how old you are

not me

 

[Bunnykid68]

nor me either

not me

No maam, if I did I wouldnt tell either.

I can be a gentleman sometimes

 

[JetGirl]

The difference is... I don't care!





43

 

[MrsGungho]

The difference is... I don't care!





43

grumble grumble

younger than me damnit

 

[Bunnykid68]

grumble grumble

younger than me damnit

Yeah, but you are much nicer than the monkey

 

[KG1]

The difference is... I don't care!





43

You sure?

 

[JetGirl]

Yeah, but you are much nicer than the monkey

Oh, that's a fact!

You sure?

Pretty dang!