Smoking Ban Feelings?

[longbarrel]

I'm cool with it.. So long as they ban wifi, and suv's. Wifi is more harmful, just hasn't been around long enough to have any gov't studies done. And the carcinogens put off by motor vehicles are far more than cigs.. I don't smoke, but if someplace allows it and I elect not to be around it, Don't go.

 

[goinggreyfast]

You're obviously too young to remember this.
There were ash trays at the end of every aisle in every Grocery store.
Doctors offices had at least one ashtray on each table and desk.
MOST Doctors, Nurses, Health Care people smoked.
Hospitals had a "Non Smoking" area, usually a small room at the end of a hallway, for non smokers to escape the clouds of smoke that were everywhere.
Every restaurant had at least one ashtray at every table, usually with the Restaurants own matches in them.
When the Blue Laws were in effect in Indiana the only place that you could buy cigarettes on Sunday was the Snack Bar at the Hospital.
Cig machines were just inside the entrance to almost every store, restaurant, and bar in the state. ($.25 a pack and most gave a book of matches too)
Smoking was promoted for it's "health benefits".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEx44ETP8Ac

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAExoSozc2c

 

[mike8170]

I haven't read every post in this thread, but this was written by James Madison, Federalist Number 10

The diversity in the faculties of men, from which the rights of property originate, is not less an insuperable obstacle to a uniformity of interests. The protection of these faculties is the first object of government. From the protection of different and unequal faculties of acquiring property, the possession of different degrees and kinds of property immediately results; and from the influence of these on the sentiments and views of the respective proprietors, ensues a division of the society into different interests and parties.

Hmm, I wonder what he would think about what the .gov is doing to property owners? Property ownership without government involvement is a basic need to prevent the formation of tyranny is my take.

 

[nemo97]

I hate smoking. I hate smoking bans more. Let market forces dictate a business' reward or loss for any decisions they make.

Funny how so many of these anti-smoking nazis are oh-so-pro-choice about many other issues.

 

[Ranger_Ranson]

Should be completely up to the property owner because if it is not, how long before they try and tell me I cannot smoke in my own house!

 

[J_Wales]

Should be completely up to the property owner because if it is not, how long before they try and tell me I cannot smoke in my own house!

Exactly correct....

Of course, some statist pig will attempt to rationalize it by stating the state can already say what you can and cannot do in your own house.

 

[level.eleven]

If you complain about the smoking ban and invoke images of the American revolution, are you a hypocrite if you pay property taxes?

 

[mike8170]

If you complain about the smoking ban and invoke images of the American revolution, are you a hypocrite if you pay property taxes?

Last ime I checked, my property taxes don't go to areas such as this, no such regs in my county. I am not a hypocrite because I still need fire service, schools, county roads, etc., so we pay our property tax, which is rather low here.
Plus, last time I checked, the Federalist Papers were pulblished 4 years AFTER the revolution, when the Philadelphia Convention was opened to address the problems with the Articles of Confederation. Federalist 10 dealt with small groups of citizens, with interests contrary to the rights of others or the interests of the whole community. It was written 224 years ago and look what is happening......

 

[level.eleven]

Last ime I checked, my property taxes don't go to areas such as this, no such regs in my county. I am not a hypocrite because I still need fire service, schools, county roads, etc., so we pay our property tax, which is rather low here.
Plus, last time I checked, the Federalist Papers were pulblished 4 years AFTER the revolution, when the Philadelphia Convention was opened to address the problems with the Articles of Confederation. Federalist 10 dealt with small groups of citizens, with interests contrary to the rights of others or the interests of the whole community. It was written 224 years ago and look what is happening......

So then someone else dictates your "private property"? Interesting.

 

[mike8170]

So then someone else dictates your "private property"? Interesting.

If it wasn't for property tax, there would not be one cop/firefighter/EMT working for a paycheck on this forum. WTF are you driving at?

 

[level.eleven]

If it wasn't for property tax, there would not be one cop/firefighter/EMT working for a paycheck on this forum. WTF are you driving at?

That is a rather bold statement. I'm driving at, you are paying are being taxed for owning property and your beef is whether or not they allow you to smoke? The smoking "battle" was lost decades ago.

 

[RockofStrength]

If it wasn't for property tax, there would not be one cop/firefighter/EMT working for a paycheck on this forum. WTF are you driving at?

When the king owns the land, he has the right to tell you what you do with it, and can also charge you for the privilege of living on his land is the point. Land ownership is a fundamental aspect of true freedom, and property taxes do not permit anyone to truly own land.

 

[Designer99]

i think the number in indiana is around 51 percent of hoosiers smoke. dont quote me on that but i remember hearing that from a few differant sources.

FYI: WTHR News just said percentage of Indiana smokers is 21.1%

 

[J_Wales]

When the king owns the land, he has the right to tell you what you do with it, and can also charge you for the privilege of living on his land is the point. Land ownership is a fundamental aspect of true freedom, and property taxes do not permit anyone to truly own land.

Well said.

Likewise, those that encroach upon privately held land are free game. Their crown renders them clear targets.

 

[Bond 281]

When the king owns the land, he has the right to tell you what you do with it, and can also charge you for the privilege of living on his land is the point. Land ownership is a fundamental aspect of true freedom, and property taxes do not permit anyone to truly own land.

Truth

 

[mike8170]

That is a rather bold statement. I'm driving at, you are paying are being taxed for owning property and your beef is whether or not they allow you to smoke? The smoking "battle" was lost decades ago.

Not a bold statement, FACT. It is right in the Indiana Code. Even volunteers equipment comes from the tax base. That is how public services are funded. Completely different from telling a business owner how to conduct THEIR business. Business' I might add, collect sales tax, pay county/town/state fees to operate, and employ people. Taxes have always been around, and always will be. The difference is that now they don't go to a feudal lord or a tyrannical king.

FYI, you don't even know if I am a smoker, so you can't say I have a beef with the smoking ban, I have a problem with Liberty being destoyed.

 

[IncendiaryGunner]

It's idiotic. Even if you make it for "only private clubs" people will still get around it.

You know how?

They'll sell you a $1 membership with your drink or meal or game or whatever. Ta-da~!!! You're now a member of a private club and can effectively skirt the law.

You can't stop someone from doing something just by passing a law.

So you outlaw smoking. How many cops are you going to hire to enforce this? How many clerks are needed to process all the tickets? What if everyone goes to court over their smoking ticket?

Seriously?

Prohibition has never ended well. You'd think people would be smarter than this after 200 years of trying to tell people how to live.

They tried the "private club" thing here in Franklin... It was a small resaraunt by the name of Don and Donna's... Skip forward, private clubs are no longer excluded from the ban...

But yeah... very rarely have I seen it enforced - but when they do the business owners also get fined, forcing the owners to either pay ridiculous fines that increase per incident, or ban smoking. All it takes is a few weeks of random enforcement in succession to get owners to ban smoking.

Just like with seat belt tickets, you send out a "task force" every now and then, mostly paid for by ticketing, and people realize they cannot afford to do as they please.

 

[dice dealer]

The more freedoms the Goevernment is allowed to take away
The more they will want to take away

 

[ATOMonkey]

They tried the "private club" thing here in Franklin... It was a small resaraunt by the name of Don and Donna's... Skip forward, private clubs are no longer excluded from the ban...

But yeah... very rarely have I seen it enforced - but when they do the business owners also get fined, forcing the owners to either pay ridiculous fines that increase per incident, or ban smoking. All it takes is a few weeks of random enforcement in succession to get owners to ban smoking.

Just like with seat belt tickets, you send out a "task force" every now and then, mostly paid for by ticketing, and people realize they cannot afford to do as they please.

I don't know if it still is, but the smokiest bar in "smoke free" plainfield was the one adjacent to the FD, that I assume the FD frequented.

 

[Smokepole]

I don't know if it still is, but the smokiest bar in "smoke free" plainfield was the one adjacent to the FD, that I assume the FD frequented.

They are people and social animals too.