Pentagon Tracking Suspected Chinese Spy Balloon Over the US

[1DOWN4UP]

 

[KG1]

They claimed something went awry and it was out of their control. (Not buying that) Ok well we'll control it now by shooting it down.

 

[Hawkeye]

The question is, if it's completely under control via EW measures, and effectively harmless, is there any value in shooting it down and risking it hitting someone?

That's pretty speculative. How do you know "it's completely under control via EW measures"?

 

[tomcat13]

Cows are OUT-Gate Closed!

 

[DragonGunner]

Somewhere there is a F-22 getting a China balloon decal under his cockpit. 4 more and he’s an ace!

 

[KellyinAvon]

That's pretty speculative. How do you know "it's completely under control via EW measures"?

We can monitor (EC-135 variants out of Offutt AFB, NE) we can monitor and jam it (EF-18F Growlers out of Whidbey Island NAS, Washington) or we could render it non-operational (F-22A Raptor has a Radar powerful enough to fry the electronics.)

I don't know much about balloons. I do know that with no guidance or propulsion where it goes depend on the wind. Altitude on the other hand? Does it drop ballast to gain altitude? The Japanese figured that out 80 years ago with much smaller balloons and no computer models.

Big picture: how did we look? What did the people of the US, the people of the world, the leaders of nations around the world, and Xinnie the Pooh see?

I'd say our National Command Authority was rated somewhere between "Couldn't beat their way out of a wet paper bag with a sledge hammer" and "from the people who gave us the evacuation of Afghanistan...".

First off, don't let stupid Uncle Joe talk except from the teleprompter. He says a few words, then let Kirby and that new Pentagon Robot cover everything.

Second, don't act like you didn't know it was coming, especially if you didn't. If it's not a threat, tell everyone how you know that. And it's a freakin humongous balloon! This ain't a Tu-95 Bear, or a 4th Gen MiG. It ain't that fast!! You got time to get it figured out.

Third, get on the same sheet of music!! Old Joe coming out saying, "I told them to shoot it down Wednesday..." calls into question many things. Many things that our friends and enemies around the world have noted.

Finally, it's ok to say we didn't have a plan on the shelf for humongous balloons. "We ran hundreds of computer models based on debris fields, weapons used, and our national security. We considered cattle herds, population centers, weather forecasts... frankly this was a bigger risk to the American people falling from the sky overland than it was letting it continue until it was over the ocean."

See how that works? Feel better, don't ya?

I agreed with the 44th President on very few things. "Never under-estimate Joe's ability to **** **** up" is one of the few.

 

[Onebad06vtx]

Somewhere there is a F-22 getting a China balloon decal under his cockpit. 4 more and he’s an ace!

Last I have heard is there are 2 more on the way.
They better be shot down before they get here!

 

[smokingman]

Unless is was something other than a sidewinder(as claimed) I do not believe we shot it down.
Why? 50,000 service ceiling of an f-22(lets give it some leeway and say 60k) that is still a FIN guided missile (ie needs air to steer) flying up 7.5 MORE miles to 100,000 feet(likely a lot longer as I doubt it was fired straight up). Even the aim9x(newest) uses the same solid rocket engine developed in 1983,it does not have the ability to steer with the engine. Clearly something brought it down based on images. No way I believe the sidewinder story. Also,at that altitude a cannon or any round propelled by gun powder would have almost no velocity(very little air for the powder to burn in),then again they do not understand the F-22 can not go that high. I see idiots saying the F-22 should have shot it down with their cannon(to save the $400,000 a sidewinder costs). sigh. Logic,reason,and knowledge seem to not be a part of most of these conversations.


Irrelevant. The cannon brings its own oxygen in the propellant. (and LOTS of it) Thats why guns can do this with NO oxygen:

 

[Hawkeye]

We can monitor (EC-135 variants out of Offutt AFB, NE) we can monitor and jam it (EF-18F Growlers out of Whidbey Island NAS, Washington) or we could render it non-operational (F-22A Raptor has a Radar powerful enough to fry the electronics.)

I don't know much about balloons. I do know that with no guidance or propulsion where it goes depend on the wind. Altitude on the other hand? Does it drop ballast to gain altitude? The Japanese figured that out 80 years ago with much smaller balloons and no computer models.

Big picture: how did we look? What did the people of the US, the people of the world, the leaders of nations around the world, and Xinnie the Pooh see?

I'd say our National Command Authority was rated somewhere between "Couldn't beat their way out of a wet paper bag with a sledge hammer" and "from the people who gave us the evacuation of Afghanistan...".

First off, don't let stupid Uncle Joe talk except from the teleprompter. He says a few words, then let Kirby and that new Pentagon Robot cover everything.

Second, don't act like you didn't know it was coming, especially if you didn't. If it's not a threat, tell everyone how you know that. And it's a freakin humongous balloon! This ain't a Tu-95 Bear, or a 4th Gen MiG. It ain't that fast!! You got time to get it figured out.

Third, get on the same sheet of music!! Old Joe coming out saying, "I told them to shoot it down Wednesday..." calls into question many things. Many things that our friends and enemies around the world have noted.

Finally, it's ok to say we didn't have a plan on the shelf for humongous balloons. "We ran hundreds of computer models based on debris fields, weapons used, and our national security. We considered cattle herds, population centers, weather forecasts... frankly this was a bigger risk to the American people falling from the sky overland than it was letting it continue until it was over the ocean."

See how that works? Feel better, don't ya?

I agreed with the 44th President on very few things. "Never under-estimate Joe's ability to **** **** up" is one of the few.

My point is the bald statement without ANY support that "it's completely under control via EW measures" is very presumptuous. Maybe we were actively jamming any emissions, maybe we were passively monitoring. Who knows.

I'm sure we have the capability, if the assets are available and can be moved in place to do so. But I've seen nothing that would make me conclude that "it's completely under control via EW measures"?

 

[Shadow01]

Replace the balloon with a plane headed towards a large city building and apply the Biden response.

 

[KG1]

This version makes more sense to me.

ZeroHedge

ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero

www.zerohedge.com

Unless is was something other than a sidewinder(as claimed) I do not believe we shot it down.
Why? 50,000 service ceiling of an f-22(lets give it some leeway and say 60k) that is still a FIN guided missile (ie needs air to steer) flying up 7.5 MORE miles to 100,000 feet(likely a lot longer as I doubt it was fired straight up). Even the aim9x(newest) uses the same solid rocket engine developed in 1983,it does not have the ability to steer with the engine. Clearly something brought it down based on images. No way I believe the sidewinder story.


View attachment 253067

Not saying that this can't be plausible, but I think it should also be noted that the author of this theory has taken on the role of Chinese PR.

 

[1DOWN4UP]

 

[Super Bee]

 

[kickbacked]

Wouldn’t be the first time balloons were weaponized over the US

 

[MRockwell]

 

[Sigblitz]

Yesterday my wife told me the balloon was shot down. This morning she told me her and my granddaughter saw a fuzzy balloon in the sky last night.

 

[BugI02]

I haven't heard that on the news. I did hear 60K feet, which is over 11 miles. 300 miles? I don't think so. 62 miles is considered where "space" begins. 300 would be low earth orbit.

Balloon wasn't high enough to cause much of an EMP. Optimum altitude over northern plains would be about 250 mi/400 km. The gamma rays interacting with the atmosphere to generate the electric field do so at 20 - 40 km (about 65000 to 130000 feet) so a detonation at balloon height would hardly generate any electric field

They still could be using the much clearer imagery to assess all sorts of attack vectors, though, and such should not be downplayed or ignored. I cannot fathom why it was ever allowed to reach more than just the edge of US airspace

 

[Twangbanger]

...Also,at that altitude a cannon or any round propelled by gun powder would have almost no velocity(very little air for the powder to burn in),.... sigh. Logic,reason,and knowledge seem to not be a part of most of these conversations.

Ammunition doesn't need "air to burn in." The gunpowder contains its own oxidant, built right in. You can fire it in a vacuum.

C'mon man...this is a gun forum.

 

[BugI02]

So, you are willing to drop this on your family in Montana after it’s been neutralized by jamming just to say you shot it down? (BTW how do you know the kids survive?)

And let’s face it, by the time it got to Montana, the only reason to shoot it down there would be for pride.

Why do you feel it was or could be successfully jammed? A burst transmission at common satellite frequencies in the gigahertz, directed upward at a satellite in low earth orbit would not only be difficult to jam, because not only would it be digital and line of sight, but would require disrupting many other forms of satcom in order to keep it continuously jammed. If it used terahertz it might be that no airborne jamming for that range would be available. Since theoretical maximum transfer rates are linear with frequency, operating in terahertz would actually shorten necessary transmission time by a factor of at least 100

Don't let the yestertech method of transport fool you into thinking any flint package would be equally unsophisticated

 

[BugI02]

The question is, if it's completely under control via EW measures, and effectively harmless,

That is a VERY big 'if'