No Tax on Tips!!!

[sapper83]

You just put the tip in....

Usually they get more then just the tip! Even get a full deposit!

 

[sapper83]

Again apologies, I should have used a purple font.

Some of us are color blind so it is good you state the color you mean!

 

[JettaKnight]

I don't like any specific trade being a special tax class. That will end up perverted like all the hiring quotas for "protected classes" of citizens. No one wins except the incompetent.

The whole TIP centered culture has me aggravated anyway. Especially since they built it into computerized billing, it has become just a way for stealing from me while claiming I am a cheap criminal. There have been restaurants caught with bad programming where Pressing the 20% tip button gives the company above 25%, and it often includes the sales tax in the calculation.

PREACH!

End this tipping nonsense now!

There are so many reasons why it's utterly ridiculous that we have these societal rules. Just pay servers to do their job, and stop depending on the largess of patrons.

 

[JettaKnight]

Why do I pay Federal taxes on my .MIL retirement then file taxes and get it all back?

Good question - Trump had his chance to make tax filing easier - all he did was rearrange forms to make more paperwork.


All this talk of taxes just makes me look forward to 1040 season!

 

[sapper83]

Good question - Trump had his chance to make tax filing easier - all he did was rearrange forms to make more paperwork.


All this talk of taxes just makes me look forward to 1040 season!

I used to itemize. Wife used to run a hom biz. Thing i really freaking hate is milage is gone for a w2 worker along with things like union dues an uniforms. Only 1099 workers can claim those now. That used to get me back a couple more grand. Now we do 1040ez

 

[sapper83]

Don't know if it was mentioned yet..... but the MANDITORY gratuity mainly at asain resteraunts... That should be illegal becuase they are taking it to the house not the servers.

Not to mention what if the service sucked!!! I refuse to eat at a place like that.

 

[JettaKnight]

Don't know if it was mentioned yet..... but the MANDITORY gratuity mainly at asain resteraunts... That should be illegal becuase they are taking it to the house not the servers.

Not to mention what if the service sucked!!! I refuse to eat at a place like that.

Or they're using it pay their servers an honest wage. If their servers don't like it, they can move to restaurant with a wage structure that benefits them better. Capitalism is a wonderful thing.

Wait, you're actually saying that a system that ensures they get paid a flat fee should be illegal, but a carved out exception that let's management paid servers below minimum wage should exist.

Really?


Every fast food restaurant or pretty much every other industry in the world has what amounts to mandatory gratuity. It's just put into to price up front rather than a hidden fee at the end.

Tipping is the ultimate hidden fee - it's so hidden you can't see it all.

 

[sapper83]

Or they're using it pay their servers an honest wage. If their servers don't like it, they can move to restaurant with a wage structure that benefits them better. Capitalism is a wonderful thing.

Wait, you're actually saying that a system that ensures they get paid a flat fee should be illegal, but a carved out exception that let's management paid servers below minimum wage should exist.

Really?


Every fast food restaurant or pretty much every other industry in the world has what amounts to mandatory gratuity. It's just put into to price up front rather than a hidden fee at the end.

Tipping is the ultimate hidden fee - it's so hidden you can't see it all.

What on are you talking about? Can you explain?

How does that ensure they get paid? By law employers have to pay minimum wage if tips don't equate. I'm sure the house is taking a cut as well.

For example,say house of kobe is 300$ for the family with MANDITORY 20% that is 60$ that is unreasonable!

The MANDITORY gratuity is not a tip to the wait staff.

I didn't, nor did anyone else create this tip culture. So now if you force me to pay something I have been taught is completely voluntary based on MY opinion of the service but took that power away and doesn't go directly to my server, then that destroys the very definition of GRATUITY. Also kills service qaulity bc there is zero incentive to provide good service. Build it into your prices, then have a no tip policy.

Oh fast food for most part doesn't have wait staff.

 

[Ingomike]

There are so many reasons why it's utterly ridiculous that we have these societal rules. Just pay servers to do their job, and stop depending on the largess of patrons.

Do you believe that system would result in better or worse service? I believe in capitalism and the incentives it provides. I believe if servers were paid by the restaurant, which itself has an incentive to cut servers pay, service would suffer.

 

[foszoe]

Do you believe that system would result in better or worse service? I believe in capitalism and the incentives it provides. I believe if servers were paid by the restaurant, which itself has an incentive to cut servers pay, service would suffer.

You are free to give your money to anyone you wish, no matter what their salary or wag3 structure

 

[Ingomike]

You are free to give your money to anyone you wish, no matter what their salary or wag3 structure

Not the topic. The discussions are about the system…

 

[sapper83]

Not the topic. The discussions are about the system…

But it is about the tip system. If i dont want to tip, i don't have to, though it is built in to the culture. I think was part of the point.

On your point of food service quality, I totally agree. I have been to other countries where there is zero tiping, and the wiating service always SUCKED bigtime. No incentive. That's back to my point about these resteraunts forcing gratuity, I refuse to eat at places like that bc there is no incentive to give good service.

Funny story.... so me and the wife get deep tissue massages from time to time. Usually $120 to 200 depending on length. I dont tip them. And the wife gets upset. I have already paid for their service, which IS the product. Why should I tip on top of that! And if they get lazy next time, I move on.

Lead into another quam, there are way to many service jobs out there that have this entitled attitude, thinking they deserve a tip when they are already making good money charging for their service. No one tips the hvac guy, or me when i turn your power back on, or the guy that services car, we are all service workers.

 

[Shadow01]

How can you know this? Do you see their W-2?

Be careful. He will accuse you of racism.

 

[Ingomike]

But it is about the tip system. If i dont want to tip, i don't have to, though it is built in to the culture. I think was part of the point.

This is likely where we differ, if you sit down in a restaurant you know the system, if you do not tip for average or above you have broken the contract implied by sitting down where a server makes a living from tips.

On your point of food service quality, I totally agree. I have been to other countries where there is zero tiping, and the wiating service always SUCKED bigtime. No incentive. That's back to my point about these resteraunts forcing gratuity, I refuse to eat at places like that bc there is no incentive to give good service.

Yep, the market works.

Funny story.... so me and the wife get deep tissue massages from time to time. Usually $120 to 200 depending on length. I dont tip them. And the wife gets upset. I have already paid for their service, which IS the product. Why should I tip on top of that! And if they get lazy next time, I move on.

That is the norm and that level of service deserves personal acknowledgment of the service rendered, particularly if they are employees and not owners.

Lead into another quam, there are way to many service jobs out there that have this entitled attitude, thinking they deserve a tip when they are already making good money charging for their service. No one tips the hvac guy, or me when i turn your power back on, or the guy that services car, we are all service workers.

Does the HVAC guy rub your back? It is generally personal service that is tipped. Where I draw the line is counter people, I will ask them what they are paid, usually if they make server pay. If the answer is no I do not tip, they are compensated employees.

 

[DoggyDaddy]

We had Stanley Steemer out to clean our carpet yesterday. When I went to pay there was a tip screen, but I didn't tip. Never would've occurred to me to do so in the past. The service was ~$200.00 and I thought that was enough. I was happy with the service. The young man that did it was courteous and professional, but I still didn't tip. Lawn Pride was out yesterday for our first service (just signed up). I didn't tip that guy either. I was however, taxed for their services.

 

[foszoe]

We had Stanley Steemer out to clean our carpet yesterday. When I went to pay there was a tip screen, but I didn't tip. Never would've occurred to me to do so in the past. The service was ~$200.00 and I thought that was enough. I was happy with the service. The young man that did it was courteous and professional, but I still didn't tip. Lawn Pride was out yesterday for our first service (just signed up). I didn't tip that guy either. I was however, taxed for their services.

Hate to see THAT lawn next spring.

 

[sapper83]

We had Stanley Steemer out to clean our carpet yesterday. When I went to pay there was a tip screen, but I didn't tip. Never would've occurred to me to do so in the past. The service was ~$200.00 and I thought that was enough. I was happy with the service. The young man that did it was courteous and professional, but I still didn't tip. Lawn Pride was out yesterday for our first service (just signed up). I didn't tip that guy either. I was however, taxed for their services.

Exactly my point I was making about massages. I pay a dollar a minute for them to rub my muscles. Why should you tip on top of that? I don't care if that is consider the norm.

 

[sapper83]

This is likely where we differ, if you sit down in a restaurant you know the system, if you do not tip for average or above you have broken the contract implied by sitting down where a server makes a living from tips.

Does the HVAC guy rub your back? It is generally personal service that is tipped. Where I draw the line is counter people, I will ask them what they are paid, usually if they make server pay. If the answer is no I do not tip, they are compensated employees.

Curious, in your opinion, if the service is terrible have they broken that implied contract? Should there be consequences or compensation?

What constitutes personal service? Touching? When i get called for a side job say to fix someone's outlet or change a ceiling fan, is that not a personal service? I don't ever expect a tip because I am being paid for the labor just like the massage therapist. We dont tip doctors??? Maybe I will give 5 minute back rub to get a tip. Lol

 

[Ingomike]

We had Stanley Steemer out to clean our carpet yesterday. When I went to pay there was a tip screen, but I didn't tip. Never would've occurred to me to do so in the past. The service was ~$200.00 and I thought that was enough. I was happy with the service. The young man that did it was courteous and professional, but I still didn't tip. Lawn Pride was out yesterday for our first service (just signed up). I didn't tip that guy either. I was however, taxed for their services.

The service provider usually did not put the tip screen on their CC payment system, the system provider did. It is a contentious issue among business owners, many of whom don’t want that screen, but the economical system providers seem to have it. Then we went through the wuwho flu where many of us tippped about anyone that would get off their butt and work and here we are.

Tips were historically for personal service not handing over a muffin from the case.

 

[Ingomike]

Exactly my point I was making about massages. I pay a dollar a minute for them to rub my muscles. Why should you tip on top of that? I don't care if that is consider the norm.

Because it is a personal service and customary, nails hair, massage, pedicure are all personal services that are customarily tipped for average and above service. Since that is the norm, I believe that by engaging the masseuse you are agreeing to the norm.