My experience today at the 1500

[Tactical Dave]

Personally I try and remember that the guys working the booths are probably tired and are fed up with everyone and their brother trying to nickle and dime them and telling them about how so and so is cheaper.... I ask if they can do X dollars, if they say no then it is up to me if I want to hand over the cash or walk away, saying that so and so has it cheaper often just aggravates people.... May be better to just ask if they can sell it for X price. Yeah people have a bad day sometimes but if you are in the business of selling goods you have to remember that if you are having a bad day that many have a one strike rule and that one table down is another dealer.... and the same rule goes for that table.


There was a guy today that seemed like he was new to guns and had just got his first pistol. He asked a dealer if this particular ammo was good ammo, the dealer looked like he barley looked at it and without even looking at the customer with an annoyed tone said "yeah". The customer asked if it would work good in this particular gun and he got pretty much the same response. It was obvious that this dealer felt that talking was a waste of time and that getting money was the only thing that he should be bothered with..... I made a mental note to never deal with him. I do realize that at shows dealers loose money the longer they talk to one customer and that it is better to get what you want and go but like I have said.... having a bad day often costs you the seller money.

 

[chasekerion4]

OP, I don't think you have a right to be pissed off that he doesn't want to sell at your price.

In a free economy, the transaction is mutually agreed upon.

This sort of mindset - where vendors OUGHT to match the price of their competitors, is the precursor to the kind of emotions that make people petition their governments for price controls or "unfair business practices".

The guy had the only gun of that kind at the entire gun show. Bob didn't have it. That convenience comes at a price, and there is absolutely nothing unfair about what he's doing. What would be unfair would be demanding that he sell it at your price.

To the OP, it is called capitalism.

1. If you don't like his price, go somewhere else.
2. If you don't like his attitude, go somewhere else.
3. If you don't like that he had to remind you about #1, go somewhere else.
4. If all things considered, you are comfortable buy, give him your money.

Whoa! Let's take a step back, read, think and re-post. Put some thought into this folks... Read it and take minute, grab your favorite beverage and ponder it objectively by thinking about the FACTS stated, not what you would like to assume - because there are a LOT of assumptions in this thread and people putting out feelings and thoughts that just flat out didn't happen..

No one said I was pissed he wouldn't sell it at my price - I certainly didn't.

I never said it was unfair, either..

As to IndianaGTI...

1. I did.
2. I did.
3. I did.
4. I did not.

Did you have anything of value to the conversation?


For those who comprehend English and the sentences posted, thanks. For those who still don't get it, let me try another time.

He's free to price as he wishes.

He doesn't have to please everyone.

He DOES have to show a certain amount of respect to a potential buyer (at least this buyer) in order to make a sale.

In my opinion, and "perception is reality" in every individual's eyes, he made a rude remark to a potential buyer.

Buyer has every right to expect better service from anyone he might give his money to.

In the end, the power of the complaint works. As someone else said, forums carry weight.

Absolute kudos to hemicharger from FL for stepping up to the plate here. I will be PM'ing you shortly.

Now, in the end.... Poster tells a story about his experience, some good points made, some incredibly unintelligent posts made by complete strangers who weren't there, taking the facts of a stated story and turning them into assumptions, with total disregard for what the OP says.

Light is then shed to the employees of the shop, who in turn make the attempt to rectify the situation.

This, folks, is capitalism and America at its finest.

 

[IndianaGTI]

No one said I was pissed he wouldn't sell it at my price - I certainly didn't.

I never said it was unfair, either..

He's free to price as he wishes.

He doesn't have to please everyone.

This, folks, is capitalism and America at its finest.

Well then, what were you whining about if you understand the above????

He is really free to make money in whatever legal manner he chooses.

 

[fahappy]

He sounds like one the same vendor i dealt with. I spoke with him about a Walther pk 380 and told him that another vendor had the same weapon priced $45 cheaper than his and he told me that was then table I needed to be at

 

[zenbruno]

Well then, what were you whining about if you understand the above????

He is really free to make money in whatever legal manner he chooses.

Yeah, I think that's the way many of us are seeing it, too.

Negotiating for the best deal is often closer to art than science; in fact, it's a skill. And it's a skill which is not inherently shared by all, equally. Even though he's loathe to admit it, I think, in the end, the OP made a purchasing decision based more on emotion that he failed to manage well, than on simple economics -- which, of course, never remain "simple" once people and personalities become involved.

OP, I have every confidence that you could have at least met an agreement with that gentleman at Liberty to split the difference -- twenty dollars -- with you -- resulting in $10 over your desired buying price, AND netting you the gun that you actually wanted.

 

[samwathegreat]

The bottom line here seems to be: Show some respect.

While personally, I'd prefer to get the best deal possible, there is no excuse for rudeness. While some people would be happy to deal with an ***hole in order to save a few bucks, the first sign of rudeness would send me in the other direction.

Regardless of economics, this situation could have been dealt with better. A simple, "Unfortunately, that's the best price I can offer" would have sufficed, and if handled this way, PROBABLY would have resulted in a sale.

Based on this info, I will not be a customer of Fort Liberty, and no doubt many others would agree with me.

I have been a businessman for a long time (and had plenty of dealings with "penny-pinchers"), and would not be successful if I had FL's attitude with my customers. Shame...

Those of you who have never been involved in sales - you would be amazed how much a positive, friendly attitude can increase your success.


R-E-S-P-E-C-T....find out what it means to me.....


And to Fort Liberty: You most definitely have every right to conduct business in whatever way you see fit....but the way you treat your customers will have a profound impact on your bank accounts.

My 2 cents.

 

[pinshooter45]

Personally I think the 1500 Is a "Flea Market Setting". Lots of competition. I think if a dealer believes people won't try to get the best deal they can by asking for a little more of a discount, should not come back to the 1500! I always scan the whole 1500 before I do any purchasing. Only gun I've bought there was my Mosin back in March. Mostly it acc and components. And usually I can get a Match. ET Brass seems to be the most flexible. They usually ask if I need any thing else, and I'll say well I need X and those guys over there had it for y, and they'll match every time. Same thing for one of the other big reloading suppliers, just can't remember the name. But this time ET brass had the best price on what a I was looking for 1lb of Varget $24.00 vs $24.50 and $25.00.

 

[DeadeyeChrista'sdad]

It's ALL about customer service, baby. I've had two business owners/managers tell me that if I didn't like their deal to take it down the road. Both times I did. Neither is still in business. Am I saying that's because of me? No. I am saying a pattern of poor customer service will sink what otherwise may be the best business model every time. For the OP, good for you for calling FL out on it. To. FL, BETTER for you for trying to make it right and apologizing. To those who tried to suck up to FL by implying the OP was being a Whiner, get a life. It IS all about customer service. To think otherwise is to set yourself up for failure.

 

[Osobuco]

I have purchased from Fort Liberty but not from PSS although I was in the store once. I was at both tables this weekend. Anyway, back when I bought my Beretta 92 from FL, Mike treated me like a prince. Unfortuntaly, I think Mike is no longer with the business - too bad. The last time I was at FL was for a transfer and I really didn;t like the attitude - or the price of $30 for a transfer - ouch. Now I do all my business and transfers at Indy Trading post - Brian has great prices and $15 for a transfer no matter how many guns you bring in at a time. Once I had 3 guns come into ITP from three different shops and the fee was $15 for all 3!! I asked FL once how much to transfer 2 guns and the reply was $60.

 

[chasekerion4]

Yeah, I think that's the way many of us are seeing it, too.

Negotiating for the best deal is often closer to art than science; in fact, it's a skill. And it's a skill which is not inherently shared by all, equally. Even though he's loathe to admit it, I think, in the end, the OP made a purchasing decision based more on emotion that he failed to manage well, than on simple economics -- which, of course, never remain "simple" once people and personalities become involved.

OP, I have every confidence that you could have at least met an agreement with that gentleman at Liberty to split the difference -- twenty dollars -- with you -- resulting in $10 over your desired buying price, AND netting you the gun that you actually wanted.

I'll be the first to admit, it was absolutely based on emotion. It took a LOT of thought, though. But ultimately I decided that the $20 more coupled with my perception of the interaction was not worth it based on the gun's intended purpose for me. Because in the end, I could have just ordered the one without the safety come Monday.

Now, after it's all said and done... I need to get to the range and shoot this puppy!

 

[printcraft]

............
Now, after it's all said and done... I need to get to the range and shoot this puppy!

OMGIH chasekerion4 is going to shoot a puppy!

 

[zenbruno]

I'll be the first to admit, it was absolutely based on emotion. It took a LOT of thought, though. But ultimately I decided that the $20 more coupled with my perception of the interaction was not worth it based on the gun's intended purpose for me. Because in the end, I could have just ordered the one without the safety come Monday.

Now, after it's all said and done... I need to get to the range and shoot this puppy!

That's an outcome that we can all agree upon!!

Hope your range trip is awesome! And give us a report back on that new gun.

 

[EXLINE]

Got to love Plainfield Shooting Supplies. Can't beat there prices I wont go anywhere else. (Because I'm cheap)

 

[CindyE]

I can see both sides. If I'm selling something, i do tend to get a little irked if someone says they can get it cheaper elsewhere. IMO, it's best to just ask if the dealer can take any less, or "sweeten the deal".
the response was kinda rude, but you'll have that!

 

[Haikufunk]

Op, you stated you run your own business so I am curious as to what business you are in? Is it one where people are always trying to get you to lower their margins that are already ridculously low? Because if it is then certainly you can sympathize with a business owner that may be tired of being "beat up" concerning price over and over again (trust me, you were not the first to try to get a lower price).

Being a person who works for an FFL and regularly sells guns, I can attest to the fact that constant haggling gets old. Especially when someone says, "Well so and so has it for x dollars." Although I don't respond in this manner, you often want to respond, "Then why are you here?"

The worst is when you have the best price (and you know it), and someone says, "Can you take $10 off?" Then when you say no they act as though you insulted there mother. I guess gun dealers are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

 

[duffman0286]

I agree there are many people i wont buy from for that exact reason..... especially that bigger guy (with the pony tail) that always has ammo cans..... $12 bucks for a .50 ammo can is a little high i made a offer of 10 bucks each for 10 can's i know he pays far less than 10 bucks a can.... now i got a guy in muncie that sell me all sorts of cans for $3 for .30, $4 for .50's, 40mm for $8 and so on.....

 

[MilitaryArms]

Op, you stated you run your own business so I am curious as to what business you are in? Is it one where people are always trying to get you to lower their margins that are already ridculously low? Because if it is then certainly you can sympathize with a business owner that may be tired of being "beat up" concerning price over and over again (trust me, you were not the first to try to get a lower price).

Being a person who works for an FFL and regularly sells guns, I can attest to the fact that constant haggling gets old. Especially when someone says, "Well so and so has it for x dollars." Although I don't respond in this manner, you often want to respond, "Then why are you here?"

The worst is when you have the best price (and you know it), and someone says, "Can you take $10 off?" Then when you say no they act as though you insulted there mother. I guess gun dealers are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

There are people that believe they are doing a business owner a favor by offering to by their products at prices that often times yield little or no profit. Take the ops comment about him taking a $20 profit vs. a $40 profit. The op has no idea what the owners overhead is. People seem to think that $20 over cost is enough to cover the cost of business and make enough to earn a living.

If you don't like someones price, move on. There's no need to make a scene.

You also have folks in business that lack business sense. They will show up and give everything away at near cost just to undercut everyone else, thinking its a sound business practice. Many of these people don't last long, but they appeal to the bargain hunters lurking everywhere.

I routinely buy from local dealers and willingly pay more. I even buy from online vendors and pay a little more - for customer service. I buy from them because they're reputable, they take care of me when I have a problem and we're all happy. There's more to a good relationship than how cheap you can buy something.

 

[chasekerion4]

Op, you stated you run your own business so I am curious as to what business you are in? Is it one where people are always trying to get you to lower their margins that are already ridculously low? Because if it is then certainly you can sympathize with a business owner that may be tired of being "beat up" concerning price over and over again (trust me, you were not the first to try to get a lower price).

Being a person who works for an FFL and regularly sells guns, I can attest to the fact that constant haggling gets old. Especially when someone says, "Well so and so has it for x dollars." Although I don't respond in this manner, you often want to respond, "Then why are you here?"

The worst is when you have the best price (and you know it), and someone says, "Can you take $10 off?" Then when you say no they act as though you insulted there mother. I guess gun dealers are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

I own 2 landscaping companies; one here and one in Florida. As with nearly all landscaping companies, the 'bread and butter' of sales comes from mowing and snow removal contracts, to which I am 'beat up' on a daily basis. My business in Indiana is coming along, and I'm following the exact same model to match what I have built in Florida, which is entirely self-sufficient now.

The reality is that everyone wants the best deal. Who am I to get upset when someone wants a better price than I quote them? I would do the exact same thing, because as someone said, it's not a customer's obligation to understand your profit margins. It's YOUR obligation as a business owner to make smart, informed, sound business decisions to build your business/brand.

I'm going to say this again - because for some reason, some people just can't comprehend. I just don't know how to make this any clearer. I never once complained about their prices. Just because I asked if he could match a competitor and then told him another dealer's price on his M&P's does NOT mean I had a problem with his price. Again, there is nothing wrong with asking for a better deal. Who knows how it would have played out. $20 bucks is $20 bucks. That's 80 rounds of ammo to put through the pipe of that new gun.

My issue was simply with the response. The response is what lost a customer; not the price.

Good, polite customer service is all but dead to a lot of companies at a time when competition is more fierce than ever before.

Think about that last sentence for a couple minutes. You simply can't afford to lose customers in this day and age, because those of us who still believe in being treated courteously before giving our money to you, can and will make a statement. All businesses can look back at why they failed, and very few fail because of a bad business idea.

 

[U.S. Patriot]

I look at it this way. The owner of a local shop of mine that I have done a lot of business with, had a customer wanting a gun priced for him. The customer said I'll buy from Buds because it's $50 cheaper. This is after the shop owner spent time with him. After paying an FFL fee of $20 he saved a whopping $30. I really do not understand the thinking of some people honestly. You have to understand it from a buisness stand point. If you do not like someones price move on and buy elsewhere. Now, if the price difference was larger I could see holding off and waiting.

 

[MilitaryArms]

I'm going to say this again - because for some reason, some people just can't comprehend. I just don't know how to make this any clearer. I never once complained about their prices. Just because I asked if he could match a competitor and then told him another dealer's price on his M&P's does NOT mean I had a problem with his price. Again, there is nothing wrong with asking for a better deal. Who knows how it would have played out. $20 bucks is $20 bucks. That's 80 rounds of ammo to put through the pipe of that new gun.

It was you that typed this several pages back, I believe:

Again, this is simple business. You either want to make money or you don't. He wanted to hold out for $40 profit vs. a guaranteed $20 right then and there. Maybe he'll get his $40, but at what cost? He lost $20 from me today, and who knows how much later on down the road?

Now read my comments again. You did make it about price and profits with this statement. You have no idea what his business costs are or if he truly would make any profit at $20 over cost.

Given your tone in this thread, it stands to reason that perhaps you weren't the most pleasant person in your dealings with this dealer and thus contributed to his response. Or perhaps you read more into his response that was actually there.

Either way it's water under the bridge.