License, registration.....and religious status?

[Mark 1911]

Honest question:

I have heard "the word"...as a Hoosier it would appear I have no realistic choice otherwise. Now, please tell me...what on Earth does it take to get Christians to keep "the word" to themselves?

That is not an honest question. There is sincere hearing, and there is thinly veiled intolerance, yours seems closer to the latter. There is no need for Christians to keep the word to themselves when one has already made up one's mind not to hear. Christians aren't who they are out of the goodness of your heart, any more than you are who you are because of their lack of goodness. They have no need of your permission to follow their beliefs any more than you need theirs to follow yours. They should respect your free will as you should. Christ does not ask permission to complicate our lives, but he respects our choice to hear him or not. But when the time comes he will know who gave him an honest hearing, and who was simply looking for a way to silence him.

 

[Cameramonkey]

The difference being, neither Glock owners nor Seahawks fans have ever knocked on my door to tell me about it.

No, it would be the JMB fanbois or CZ freaks that would do that.

 

[PaulF]

Not everybody harbors such animus. Much like if someone asks you if you're interested in buying an insurance policy or a used car or Girl Scout cookies, all you have to do is say something like: "No thanks. I'm not interested". If they insist, escalate as you see fit.

On the other hand, there are people that change their hearts and may not realize they are ready to receive Jesus and the Holy Spirit and if we "kept it to ourselves", then that would be a shame for those people.

I don't know your first name, but there is no doubt you would be welcome in my home.

You and I understand each other better, I think, than we sometimes let on.

It is hard to explain the saturation of the Christian message from the perspective of a non-believer...it is everywhere, and in many ways incredibly uncomfortable. We are constantly reminded that something we cannot see, or feel, or measure, or interact with in any way waits to torture us forever. Every day. Everywhere we look.

It's maddening, honestly. I don't mean that to be condescending, I don't know how else to explain it...If something were to change my mind, please believe me: I will know where to find you.

Christians have every right to broadcast their message, and I support that right. They need to understand that a broadcast message can have a dark side...you want your message to be easy to access, but not suffocate and oppress. The very universality that sounds appealing to the broadcaster can sound appaling to the listener.

 

[hopper68]

I'm an atheist, swear to god.

 

[PaulF]

That is not an honest question. There is sincere hearing, and there is thinly veiled intolerance, yours seems closer to the latter. There is no need for Christians to keep the word to themselves when one has already made up one's mind not to hear. Christians aren't who they are out of the goodness of your heart, any more than you are who you are because of their lack of goodness. They have no need of your permission to follow their beliefs any more than you need theirs to follow yours. They should respect your free will as you should. Christ does not ask permission to complicate our lives, but he respects our choice to hear him or not. But when the time comes he will know who gave him an honest hearing, and who was simply looking for a way to silence him.

Yes you are correct. That was not an honest question. You snipped the honest question. That was frustration and snark.

 

[Leo]

I hear things that I do not like constantly at every level of society. Much of it comes from people on taxpayer funded paychecks. It is just part of life.

 

[GodFearinGunTotin]

I don't know your first name, but there is no doubt you would be welcome in my home.

You and I understand each other better, I think, than we sometimes let on.

It is hard to explain the saturation of the Christian message from the perspective of a non-believer...it is everywhere, and in many ways incredibly uncomfortable. We are constantly reminded that something we cannot see, or feel, or measure, or interact with in any way waits to torture us forever. Every day. Everywhere we look.

It's maddening, honestly. I don't mean that to be condescending, I don't know how else to explain it...If something were to change my mind, please believe me: I will know where to find you.

Christians have every right to broadcast their message, and I support that right. They need to understand that a broadcast message can have a dark side...you want your message to be easy to access, but not suffocate and oppress. The very universality that sounds appealing to the broadcaster can sound appaling to the listener.

I think folks have certain sensitivities. From my posting history here, it's probably not hard to guess which messages, which positions, etc. that are broadcast (figuratively and literally) I find uncomfortable. And they're everywhere in today's culture. I can't turn a TV on without various trash being thrown in my face or being preached at me. The message is clear-- if I don't enlighten and modernize my thinking, I'm a hateful bigot and believe me, it causes me to be at least a little careful on the other social media outlets so that I'm not mob-shamed or my employer is not cowed into firing me.

And you're right. Constant harping on the virtues of veganism, the evils of being a LBGTQ bigot, or a sinner doomed to hell if you don't repent tends to fall on deaf ears when folks are not interested in hearing it. That's why you may see me profess my faith; I might even engage in discussions (such as this one); but I try to be the light rather than a pest about it.

 

[jamil]

There's a thing called freedom of speech, but not a freedom not to be spoken to. It would be nice if the people doing the speaking would consider the wishes of the people they're speaking to.

I think if the officer approached his "witnessing" first by letting her know she was free to go, and then indicating that he had something he wanted to talk to her about if she wouldn't mind listening. Fair game then. Probably not productive, but I don't think it's out of line. I wouldn't mind telling the officer that, thanks, but I'm not interested, and then leave. If he didn't let the woman know she was free to go and that she didn't have to listen, I think the ACLU should win.

 

[Timjoebillybob]

As a Christian, I support the spreading of the Word, we're instructed to do so. But it should be consensual and should not be done by someone in a authoritative position like this.

It might technically have been consensual. If the traffic stop is officially over it turns into a consensual encounter. The article states this interaction happened after she received a warning ticket. But hypothetically let's say he gave her the warning and her ID/registration/etc told her to drive safe and have a nice day. Then asked her if she would mind if he asked her a question. Whether that is what happened or not I have no idea. But I have heard of similar being done to fish.

Agreed, but I also think that the ISP should deal with him and if he refused to stop after instructed not to, fire him. The awarding of damages? Not necessary.

I can agree with that.

Honest question:

Do you think there is anyone in Indiana that hasn't heard "the word"?

Honest answer. Yes. Hearing the words and hearing "the word" are two different things. I believe and sincerely no snark, that you have heard the former rather than the latter. But perhaps that will change.

I wish you guys would at least try to see things from our side once in awhile...it's like marrying a woman and finding out her whole family is vegan.

It gets old..

You may not believe it, but quite a few of us do. But quite a few of us tolerate it due to understanding why they do it. Seriously talk to some of the members who live in NWI, specifically Crown Point or Hammond areas and ask them about Hyles-Anderson Baptist College or the iirc 1st Baptist Church of Hammond. You think JW or LDS can be persistent? The're pikers compared to these folk. The college has what they call sweeps week a couple times a year, the freshmen are required to go out and I believe save x amount of souls. Other grades are not required but it is highly recommended/suggested. My wife lived 3-4 blocks from the college and it wasn't uncommon to get several groups a day, everyday during sweeps week. I didn't live anywhere close and I would get one a day.

God hates it when you hit on 18?

But he usually looks favorably on splitting aces and eights.

I take a different approach as a Christian, than those that approached me.

If seeds are not cast in fertile ground they lack success to grow.

Nothing wrong with a different approach, but you have to admit sometimes you have to work the soil a bit to make it amenable to the seed.

Thank [STRIKE]God[/STRIKE] (insert someone of importance) for the ACLU. Invited her to church? She'll likely never recover.

Agreed, the lady will never be the same.

OK. Believe it or not, in this day and age, I've had a Kirby vacuum guy show up at my house. I tell him to go away if I don't want to hear it.

Never had a vacuum salesman, I have had an avon lady, schwans drivers, and the people selling random cleaners. And my approach is generally the same as yours.

 

[MisterChester]

ACLU sues ISP Trooper over faith questions - TheIndyChannel.com

I'm wondering if I should invest in one of those little fish emblems to avoid speeding tickets.

I did see a bumper sticker once that said "With a coupon Jesus Christ will save". I mean, it's not wrong.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

It is hard to explain the saturation of the Christian message from the perspective of a non-believer...it is everywhere, and in many ways incredibly uncomfortable. We are constantly reminded that something we cannot see, or feel, or measure, or interact with in any way waits to torture us forever.

While there are fire and brimstone churches, that's not really the Christian message.

 

[Gluemanz28]

Not everybody harbors such animus. Much like if someone asks you if you're interested in buying an insurance policy or a used car or Girl Scout cookies, all you have to do is say something like: "No thanks. I'm not interested". If they insist, escalate as you see fit. A few days ago, a Jehovah's Witness came knocking on my door. I'm not JW and really didn't have time to talk to her. I simply smiled, and told her I really didn't have time to talk to her and she thanked me for my time and we wished each other a nice day. It didn't hurt one single bit. No butt-hurt on either side. She didn't force her religion on me and I didn't force mine on her. I got rid of her much easier than getting rid of one of those kids selling peanut brittle or popcorn.

On the other hand, there are people that change their hearts and may not realize they are ready to receive Jesus and the Holy Spirit and if we "kept it to ourselves", then that would be a shame for those people.

Very well said GFGT.
I believe that there is someone that crosses our paths daily that needs to hear the word, but not everyone that crosses our paths needs to hear it.

The success is knowing which is which.

Nothing wrong with a different approach, but you have to admit sometimes you have to work the soil a bit to make it amenable to the seed.

It's not my job to work the soil.
It's my job to plant the seed.
Not even my job to water it.

I have traveled the majority of the US, Canda, Ecuador and Honduras planting seeds. There was not enough time for me to work the soil or water the seeds at the opportunities presented to me. God and I have an agreement that I will go wherever he sends me to plant seeds. He has prepared the ground in advance and waters them after I'm long gone.

 

[Route 45]

Thank [STRIKE]God[/STRIKE] (insert someone of importance) for the ACLU. Invited her to church? She'll likely never recover.

You wouldn't be so flippant if your wife got pulled over and asked if she knows the truth of Allah as revealed by his prophet, Mohammed, and then got an Islamic pamphlet along with her warning ticket. Go ahead. Lie to me and say that it wouldn't bother you.

An on-duty police officer exercising authority over a citizen in a non-consensual encounter (traffic stop) has no business proselytizing. It is at the very least, wildly inappropriate.

 

[Route 45]

In your work place, any discussion of any religion or religious beliefs with a client or employee is risky. This includes religious "activities". Asking specific questions about someone's religion can be intimidating to them and is a no-no. As a former Fed, this kind of activity could earn you an unexpected position in the unemployment line. Have to be PC about everything sometimes! Good that we can still talk among friends.

This has nothing to do with a workplace. Or being "PC." This is a law enforcement officer promoting his religion during the performance of his duties.
An on-duty police officer can't even wear a political button or have a political bumper sticker on his patrol car, and politics is one of the only things that even approaches how deeply personal religion is. Promoting religion while holding the coercive power of the state as an on-duty law enforcement officer is really beyond the pale.

 

[Route 45]

As a Christian, I support the spreading of the Word, we're instructed to do so. But it should be consensual and should not be done by someone in a authoritative position like this.

This guy gets it. I've got no problem with people inviting others to share in their faith. I have a HUGE problem with an armed on-duty government agent doing it.

 

[PaulF]

While there are fire and brimstone churches, that's not really the Christian message.

BBI, I grew up in a Christian home. I Graduated from a Christian high school. I attended a Christian college.

Their message is: The only way to Heaven in through Jesus Christ, accept Him to avoid eternal damnation.

I am an atheist. Despite years of soul-searching and effort I am unable to reconcile the Christian message. When I look into the sky I see stars, not gods. When I close my eyes in prayer, I feel nothing...absolutely nothing. My whole family is Christian. All of my childhood friends were Christian. I have never experienced the connection that they seem to take for granted. It is not for a lack of trying, and it isn't for a lack of exposure to their message...their message, time and again, does not describe the world that I experience. The problem with any message is one cannot control how it is received by the listener...

...In the end, BBI, the Christian message reads simply enough to me: be damned.

In the OP, this agent of the State Government spreads that message with a gun on his hip, and the badge of authority displayed. Maybe his intentions were benign, maybe they were less so...maybe he should just do the job he's paid to do...enforce the State's laws.

 

[phylodog]

You wouldn't be so flippant if your wife got pulled over and asked if she knows the truth of Allah as revealed by his prophet, Mohammed, and then got an Islamic pamphlet along with her warning ticket. Go ahead. Lie to me and say that it wouldn't bother you.

An on-duty police officer exercising authority over a citizen in a non-consensual encounter (traffic stop) has no business proselytizing. It is at the very least, wildly inappropriate.

You can project the currently popular, overly sensitive, whining ***** mentality this country has adopted all you want but you'll be wrong. I've never needed to go find a "safe space" after someone said words I didn't care for. I tend to lean more toward being an adult as well as a man and (gasp) considerate and accepting of the fact that there are lots of different people in this world with different beliefs and values than mine.

It's no lie. I don't cry when people say things I don't like. I also don't overreact to stupid bull****. I have a real life and I don't feel the need to play the role of a victim to garner attention. In spite of the signs to the contrary I still have people from various religions show up at my door. Somehow I can muster the strength to remain polite and decline to listen to their information without spending the rest of my life crying to whomever will listen about how abused I've been.

You are correct in that this was inappropriate. She was absolutely within her rights and should have complained. The officer should have been told to knock it off and provided he did that, that should have been the end of it. Unfortunately this is America where people only feel important if they can paint themselves as a victim. It's as embarrassing as it is disgusting. You can participate all you want, I have better things to do.

 

[LPMan59]

Get off my lawn

 

[jamil]

Given what Route 45 said, I think it would be an interesting experiment to tell your Christian friends about this story, except report that it was a Muslim cop that did this. Note their reaction, and then tell them that it really was a Christian cop. See how they feel about it then.

 

[jamil]

I have to admit an ACLU lawsuit is a bit over the top. Just file a complaint.

You can project the currently popular, overly sensitive, whining ***** mentality this country has adopted all you want but you'll be wrong. I've never needed to go find a "safe space" after someone said words I didn't care for. I tend to lean more toward being an adult as well as a man and (gasp) considerate and accepting of the fact that there are lots of different people in this world with different beliefs and values than mine.

It's no lie. I don't cry when people say things I don't like. I also don't overreact to stupid bull****. I have a real life and I don't feel the need to play the role of a victim to garner attention. In spite of the signs to the contrary I still have people from various religions show up at my door. Somehow I can muster the strength to remain polite and decline to listen to their information without spending the rest of my life crying to whomever will listen about how abused I've been.

You are correct in that this was inappropriate. She was absolutely within her rights and should have complained. The officer should have been told to knock it off and provided he did that, that should have been the end of it. Unfortunately this is America where people only feel important if they can paint themselves as a victim. It's as embarrassing as it is disgusting. You can participate all you want, I have better things to do.