Kut's Trump Approval Thread #1 (Starts Out at 100%)

[SheepDog4Life]

Sorry, but even my lowest level for acceptance doesn't allow for habitual liars.

Then please tell who was an acceptable candidate in 2016 Presidential election as BOTH major candidates fail that test.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Sorry, but even my lowest level for acceptance doesn't allow for habitual liars.

I understand. 'If you like your plan, you can keep your plan' irritated me pretty bad too!

 

[Dddrees]

Then please tell who was an acceptable candidate in 2016 Presidential election as BOTH major candidates fail that test.

See thats kind of my point. We've got to a place where we've either gotten used too or have learned to accept it to the point where we now have some one like Trump where we've even given up on expecting our leaders not to do it.

i guess I'm still that naive young SGT and SFC Ret to a large degree. I told my troops what the standards where,I reminded them through counseling when they went astray, and then I recommended UCMJ when appropriate. See for me there where consequences when you didn't do what your supposed to do.


Just one example of where I'm coming from.

Unlike that team I took over just prior to Desert Storm which had not bothered to clean their vehicle and equipment since that last major field exercise in January. Now it was August and they where faced with going to war with unclean, unmaintained, missing, and untrained individuals. My expectations and my demands always included consequences when things where not done the way they were supposed to be. Standards, expectations,performances, and consequences for not only performance but integrity as well.

See even when the 1SGT had people gave me equipment to make up my shortages they gave me broken and missing stuff. Now when I told him what they were giving me he said Sgt do you expect others to give you their best stuff. I told him my worst stuff isn't that bad because I maintain all my stuff.


i know it's naive to expect people to do the right thing. But to me the only way you get it that way is to not accept anything less. Because after all people tend to travel the path of least resistance. They'll actually choose the easiest or more selfish path if allowed too.

 

[T.Lex]

Sorry, but even my lowest level for acceptance doesn't allow for habitual liars.

Then please tell who was an acceptable candidate in 2016 Presidential election as BOTH major candidates fail that test.

Heck, let's look beyond the last election cycle. In any of our lifetime's has there been a major politician who met that standard?

 

[indiucky]

I've accepted it. I call Trump "president." I have yet to refer to him in any way comparable to the creative monikers many (here) had for the last president. Any criticism I assign, is backed up specific action.

And I thank you for that consistency.....

 

[indiucky]

Heck, let's look beyond the last election cycle. In any of our lifetime's has there been a major politician who met that standard?

Only as a character......

 

[Dddrees]

Heck, let's look beyond the last election cycle. In any of our lifetime's has there been a major politician who met that standard?

I know we've been lied too in the past, but you can't tell me honestly that Trump hasn't gone where no one has previously gone before. I mean you can pick examples from others and some serious ones as well, but Trump would try to tell you it's night when it's clearly day. Heck, he has the possibility of lying every time he opens his mouth. And yes there is a difference between a person who has lied and a habitual liar.

 

[T.Lex]

I know we've been lied too in the past, but you can't tell me honestly that Trump hasn't gone where no one has previously gone before.

That's like a triple negative entanglement!

I'll rephrase as best I can: Trump, as POTUS, has been about average in truthfulness (IMHO) among POTUSs since I came of age about the time of Carter/Reagan. Now, he has time to race to the bottom, but I think his truthiness rate is perhaps better than Obama, worse than Bush, about the same as Clinton, Bush and Reagan.

That IMHO.

One caveat there, is that he's used to being able to lie in the business world and create strategic advantages. Politics is not business. He will have to become either a better person or a better liar for this to work out well for him.

I mean you can pick examples from others and some serious ones as well, but Trump would try to tell you it's night when it's clearly day. Heck, he has the possibility of lying every time he opens his mouth. And yes there is a difference between a person who has lied and a habitual liar.

I agree there is a distinction. But, when it comes to national politics, it is a distinction without a difference. Partly because it is all about perception.

 

[PaulF]

Then please tell who was an acceptable candidate in 2016 Presidential election as BOTH major candidates fail that test.

None. There were none.

We had, as Jamil has repeatedly highlighted, a binary choice between two deeply flawed candidates. Many justified voting for a horrendous candidate by voting in accordance to party allegiance. Others justified their decision by selecting "the lesser of two evils".

One thing we heard a lot in conservative circles was talk about holding Trump accountable for his negatives. That talk all but disappeared from the conversation following the election. The very same people who screamed that the sky is falling every time Obama played golf or made a stinging wisecrack seem to find the same behaviors from Trump simply delightful.

It's hypocritical coming from side of the discussion that claims to value small government, distributed powers, and checks and balances...and it just reeks of government by Cult of Personality.

To me, Trump carries the appearance of would-be oligarch, not a populist reformer. Like Obama before him, he has a flair for saying exactly what his base wants to hear, exactly when they need to hear it.

What we have is exactly what we voter for: Evil, lesser as it may be. Trump is approaching 200 days is office with Republican control of both houses of congress, and has accomplished nothing notable but get Gorsich to the bench. Even there my excitement is tempered. As an atheist I have some reservations with how his ideology might influence his decision-making. Still, in most respect he is a far better choice than any HRC would be likely to nominate.

Let's face it: a choice between HRC and Trump is frightening because the president wields too much power. We have allowed the executive to amass far more influence than that office was ever intended to access. Handing over the presidency to evil, even a lesser one, would be less fearsome if the office didn't seemingly bestow a crown upon the head of its occupant.

It was infuriating to watch Obama supporters obsfuscate and define away his wrongs. It is even more infuriating to watch conservatives do the very same thing...we claim to hold ourselves to a higher standard. It's nice to hear, but I'd like to see that ideal in action a little more than I do.

 

[Dddrees]

That's like a triple negative entanglement!

I'll rephrase as best I can: Trump, as POTUS, has been about average in truthfulness (IMHO) among POTUSs since I came of age about the time of Carter/Reagan. Now, he has time to race to the bottom, but I think his truthiness rate is perhaps better than Obama, worse than Bush, about the same as Clinton, Bush and Reagan.

That IMHO.

One caveat there, is that he's used to being able to lie in the business world and create strategic advantages. Politics is not business. He will have to become either a better person or a better liar for this to work out well for him.


I agree there is a distinction. But, when it comes to national politics, it is a distinction without a difference. Partly because it is all about perception.

Like I tried to point out, I think to a large degree we get what we're willing to accept. He's only doing what he believes he can get away with. For some it seems to be working, for some they chalk it up to politics as usual or a simple evolution or next step. I simply can't invision him somehow being saved, so I doubt very much he'll ever be honest.

 

[IndyDave1776]

None. There were none.

We had, as Jamil has repeatedly highlighted, a binary choice between two deeply flawed candidates. Many justified voting for a horrendous candidate by voting in accordance to party allegiance. Others justified their decision by selecting "the lesser of two evils".

One thing we heard a lot in conservative circles was talk about holding Trump accountable for his negatives. That talk all but disappeared from the conversation following the election. The very same people who screamed that the sky is falling every time Obama played golf or made a stinging wisecrack seem to find the same behaviors from Trump simply delightful.

It's hypocritical coming from side of the discussion that claims to value small government, distributed powers, and checks and balances...and it just reeks of government by Cult of Personality.

To me, Trump carries the appearance of would-be oligarch, not a populist reformer. Like Obama before him, he has a flair for saying exactly what his base wants to hear, exactly when they need to hear it.

What we have is exactly what we voter for: Evil, lesser as it may be. Trump is approaching 200 days is office with Republican control of both houses of congress, and has accomplished nothing notable but get Gorsich to the bench. Even there my excitement is tempered. As an atheist I have some reservations with how his ideology might influence his decision-making. Still, in most respect he is a far better choice than any HRC would be likely to nominate.

Let's face it: a choice between HRC and Trump is frightening because the president wields too much power. We have allowed the executive to amass far more influence than that office was ever intended to access. Handing over the presidency to evil, even a lesser one, would be less fearsome if the office didn't seemingly bestow a crown upon the head of its occupant.

It was infuriating to watch Obama supporters obsfuscate and define away his wrongs. It is even more infuriating to watch conservatives do the very same thing...we claim to hold ourselves to a higher standard. It's nice to hear, but I'd like to see that ideal in action a little more than I do.

Well said.

 

[Fargo]

None. There were none.

We had, as Jamil has repeatedly highlighted, a binary choice between two deeply flawed candidates. Many justified voting for a horrendous candidate by voting in accordance to party allegiance. Others justified their decision by selecting "the lesser of two evils".

One thing we heard a lot in conservative circles was talk about holding Trump accountable for his negatives. That talk all but disappeared from the conversation following the election. The very same people who screamed that the sky is falling every time Obama played golf or made a stinging wisecrack seem to find the same behaviors from Trump simply delightful.

It's hypocritical coming from side of the discussion that claims to value small government, distributed powers, and checks and balances...and it just reeks of government by Cult of Personality.

To me, Trump carries the appearance of would-be oligarch, not a populist reformer. Like Obama before him, he has a flair for saying exactly what his base wants to hear, exactly when they need to hear it.

What we have is exactly what we voter for: Evil, lesser as it may be. Trump is approaching 200 days is office with Republican control of both houses of congress, and has accomplished nothing notable but get Gorsich to the bench. Even there my excitement is tempered. As an atheist I have some reservations with how his ideology might influence his decision-making. Still, in most respect he is a far better choice than any HRC would be likely to nominate.

Let's face it: a choice between HRC and Trump is frightening because the president wields too much power. We have allowed the executive to amass far more influence than that office was ever intended to access. Handing over the presidency to evil, even a lesser one, would be less fearsome if the office didn't seemingly bestow a crown upon the head of its occupant.

It was infuriating to watch Obama supporters obsfuscate and define away his wrongs. It is even more infuriating to watch conservatives do the very same thing...we claim to hold ourselves to a higher standard. It's nice to hear, but I'd like to see that ideal in action a little more than I do.

Very well said.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Very well said.

OK, if we're going to get into a bidding war...EXTREMELY WELL SAID!

 

[Fargo]

OK, if we're going to get into a bidding war...EXTREMELY WELL SAID!

Lol, your post wasn't up when I was typing.

 

[IndyDave1776]

Lol, your post wasn't up when I was typing.

 

[indiucky]

None. There were none.

We had, as Jamil has repeatedly highlighted, a binary choice between two deeply flawed candidates. Many justified voting for a horrendous candidate by voting in accordance to party allegiance. Others justified their decision by selecting "the lesser of two evils".

One thing we heard a lot in conservative circles was talk about holding Trump accountable for his negatives. That talk all but disappeared from the conversation following the election. The very same people who screamed that the sky is falling every time Obama played golf or made a stinging wisecrack seem to find the same behaviors from Trump simply delightful.

It's hypocritical coming from side of the discussion that claims to value small government, distributed powers, and checks and balances...and it just reeks of government by Cult of Personality.

To me, Trump carries the appearance of would-be oligarch, not a populist reformer. Like Obama before him, he has a flair for saying exactly what his base wants to hear, exactly when they need to hear it.

What we have is exactly what we voter for: Evil, lesser as it may be. Trump is approaching 200 days is office with Republican control of both houses of congress, and has accomplished nothing notable but get Gorsich to the bench. Even there my excitement is tempered. As an atheist I have some reservations with how his ideology might influence his decision-making. Still, in most respect he is a far better choice than any HRC would be likely to nominate.

Let's face it: a choice between HRC and Trump is frightening because the president wields too much power. We have allowed the executive to amass far more influence than that office was ever intended to access. Handing over the presidency to evil, even a lesser one, would be less fearsome if the office didn't seemingly bestow a crown upon the head of its occupant.

It was infuriating to watch Obama supporters obsfuscate and define away his wrongs. It is even more infuriating to watch conservatives do the very same thing...we claim to hold ourselves to a higher standard. It's nice to hear, but I'd like to see that ideal in action a little more than I do.

I am going to get in on the bidding war...

Very, very, very, very well said.......INGO's Magna Carta....

(And I say that as a die hard Trump supporter who wanted to see him win to watch the media freak out and man has Trump delivered...I love it....Also note that I was not that hard on Obama...Didn't like him, but didn't come on here saying he plays too much golf or is an idiot...Kut inspired me in that regard...)

 

[Brad69]

Rand Paul for 2026

 

[SheepDog4Life]

See thats kind of my point. We've got to a place where we've either gotten used too or have learned to accept it to the point where we now have some one like Trump where we've even given up on expecting our leaders not to do it.

i guess I'm still that naive young SGT and SFC Ret to a large degree. I told my troops what the standards where,I reminded them through counseling when they went astray, and then I recommended UCMJ when appropriate. See for me there where consequences when you didn't do what your supposed to do.


Just one example of where I'm coming from.

Unlike that team I took over just prior to Desert Storm which had not bothered to clean their vehicle and equipment since that last major field exercise in January. Now it was August and they where faced with going to war with unclean, unmaintained, missing, and untrained individuals. My expectations and my demands always included consequences when things where not done the way they were supposed to be. Standards, expectations,performances, and consequences for not only performance but integrity as well.

See even when the 1SGT had people gave me equipment to make up my shortages they gave me broken and missing stuff. Now when I told him what they were giving me he said Sgt do you expect others to give you their best stuff. I told him my worst stuff isn't that bad because I maintain all my stuff.


i know it's naive to expect people to do the right thing. But to me the only way you get it that way is to not accept anything less. Because after all people tend to travel the path of least resistance. They'll actually choose the easiest or more selfish path if allowed too.

I can see how anyone in active duty or retired would have extreme difficulty saluting a Commander in Chief lacking integrity and of low character. I'll grant you that. However, life offers us choices and choose we must.

With the choice of having this clown at the top, but with him giving Mattis fairly free reign to accomplish his mission with field officers and NCOs actually able to make decisions without consulting a lawyer first...

Versus 4/8 more years of top-down micro-management to the nth degree, charged with completing the mission with both hands tied behind their backs and a microscope up their rectum...

I guess I have no choice but to hold my nose and choose the clown.

Wish there was another choice... but there wasn't. Such is life sometimes... no good choices.

None. There were none.

We had, as Jamil has repeatedly highlighted, a binary choice between two deeply flawed candidates. Many justified voting for a horrendous candidate by voting in accordance to party allegiance. Others justified their decision by selecting "the lesser of two evils".

One thing we heard a lot in conservative circles was talk about holding Trump accountable for his negatives. That talk all but disappeared from the conversation following the election. The very same people who screamed that the sky is falling every time Obama played golf or made a stinging wisecrack seem to find the same behaviors from Trump simply delightful.

It's hypocritical coming from side of the discussion that claims to value small government, distributed powers, and checks and balances...and it just reeks of government by Cult of Personality.

To me, Trump carries the appearance of would-be oligarch, not a populist reformer. Like Obama before him, he has a flair for saying exactly what his base wants to hear, exactly when they need to hear it.

What we have is exactly what we voter for: Evil, lesser as it may be. Trump is approaching 200 days is office with Republican control of both houses of congress, and has accomplished nothing notable but get Gorsich to the bench. Even there my excitement is tempered. As an atheist I have some reservations with how his ideology might influence his decision-making. Still, in most respect he is a far better choice than any HRC would be likely to nominate.

Let's face it: a choice between HRC and Trump is frightening because the president wields too much power. We have allowed the executive to amass far more influence than that office was ever intended to access. Handing over the presidency to evil, even a lesser one, would be less fearsome if the office didn't seemingly bestow a crown upon the head of its occupant.

It was infuriating to watch Obama supporters obsfuscate and define away his wrongs. It is even more infuriating to watch conservatives do the very same thing...we claim to hold ourselves to a higher standard. It's nice to hear, but I'd like to see that ideal in action a little more than I do.

Agreed! (just to say something different, lol)

 

[indiucky]

With the choice of having this clown at the top, but with him giving Mattis fairly free reign to accomplish his mission with field officers and NCOs actually able to make decisions without consulting a lawyer first...

I had an active duty NCO here in the shop today stationed at Fort Knox......He has been in 10 years and he said moral is higher now that it has been his entire time in...I asked him why??? I said is it Trump????

He kind of stepped back and said, "Yes...But hear me out...It's not what he has done but what he doesn't do...He gave our Commanders free reign...He said you are the experts so do your thing..."

He said the biggest positive was giving the generals on the ground freedom regarding the "Rules Of Engagement"...

He said he has been overseas and it used to take two days to get permission to have some air support knock something out...He said by that time we may have lost two guys and the bad guys are long gone...I asked what about now and he said, "However long it takes that Warthog to get here...It's saving lives sir...It really is..."

 

[Route 45]

I had an active duty NCO here in the shop today stationed at Fort Knox......He has been in 10 years and he said moral is higher now that it has been his entire time in...I asked him why??? I said is it Trump????

He kind of stepped back and said, "Yes...But hear me out...It's not what he has done but what he doesn't do...He gave our Commanders free reign...He said you are the experts so do your thing..."

He said the biggest positive was giving the generals on the ground freedom regarding the "Rules Of Engagement"...

He said he has been overseas and it used to take two days to get permission to have some air support knock something out...He said by that time we may have lost two guys and the bad guys are long gone...I asked what about now and he said, "However long it takes that Warthog to get here...It's saving lives sir...It really is..."

This alone is worth the price of admission.

I don't mind so much that Trump, himself, is not exactly my idea of "presidential" material.
I didn't really vote for Trump. I voted for a Trump administration.

So far, so good. Anyone who makes leftists lose their **** to this degree has got to be doing something right.