Jackbooted Thugs!!

[AndersonIN]

Anyone else think that 'Frank" Burnsy problem just might stem from his just live'n a little to close to the communistic state of IL and that why he feels the way he does?

I have no doubt he believe that the kids were just reacting to a movie they had seen and if we would ONLY apologize to them for it and anything else that might be bothering them at the time they would leave us alone. But I have no doubt that if they ready the comments on this forum then Frankie will understand when they start screaming "I want to kill. I mean, I wanna, I wanna kill. Kill. I wanna, I wanna see, I wanna see blood and gore and guts and veins in my teeth. Eat dead burnt bodies. I mean kill, Kill,
KILL, KILL."

 

[Movealongmovealong]

While I am glad you had a positive outcome. Turning your dogs "loose" as a result of a punk landing a piece of your food on the ground could have ended in a lawsuit and a dog put to sleep had one of them bit someone.

I agree that they were in the wrong, but I don't agree with your response. It was drastic, an over reaction and could have cost you a hospital bill. If your fine with that, I am too. Just keep in mind if they were also armed, they would be justified in ventilating your dog and suing you for the cost to get stitched up.

If puffed chests result in violence on your part, please keep your dogs at home and stop carrying.

Entirely agree. Now these dumb kids did provoke you, and their behavior was threatening to a degree, but let's keep in mind who is the adult in the situation and what is not only a strictly legally appropriate response, but also what it would look like to the police and possibly a jury. IMO, not good. They were not seemingly armed and you are a large, grown man. Can you possibly legally assert yourself in a violent defensive manner? Yes. Is it always a good idea to do so? Not if you don't want potential serious legal trouble and a depleted bank account because of hiring a crack legal defensive team.

Some OC spray placed on the table would have probably been a much better response. If they did anything else, then using would have been my next step. I haven't seen too many people put up a fight after getting heavily OC'd, and the legality of such a move is much easier to justify.

 

[AndersonIN]

Entirely agree. Now these dumb kids did provoke you, and their behavior was threatening to a degree, but let's keep in mind who is the adult in the situation and what is not only a strictly legally appropriate response, but also what it would look like to the police and possibly a jury. IMO, not good. They were not seemingly armed and you are a large, grown man. Can you possibly legally assert yourself in a violent defensive manner? Yes. Is it always a good idea to do so? Not if you don't want potential serious legal trouble and a depleted bank account because of hiring a crack legal defensive team.

Some OC spray placed on the table would have probably been a much better response. If they did anything else, then using would have been my next step. I haven't seen too many people put up a fight after getting heavily OC'd, and the legality of such a move is much easier to justify.

Now we hear from the Communistic City of Bloomington!

 

[paddling_man]

Natural selection was thwarted when them dogs wasn't able to eat them little fellas 'fore they could go and breed out some young'uns.

For shame, for shame.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J6_1Pw1xm9U

 

[Movealongmovealong]

Now we hear from the Communistic City of Bloomington!

Right-o. Everyone in and around Bloomington is a communist.

Please pardon me for impugning your superior intelligence and incredible knowledgebase of facts and reason with my attempt to make a balanced and informed comment. I'm sorry for taking you away from the delicate thoracic surgery or that multi-million dollar corporation that you undoubtedly are involved in with such a vastly superior intellect, education and complete motivation in life. No doubt if you act in the same way some day, by just generically knee-jerking a response you'll be best served in life.

I'll digress and allow you to return to your circlejerk. I'm not at all able to defend myself from your awesomeness.

 

[Burnsy]

Since you decided to "cooked bird" out and didn't reply to my post previously directed towards you, I'll take another crack at it.

When do you defend your property? Clearly, someone destroying your food supply and invading personal space is not sufficient, in your opinion, to initiate defense, so where do you draw the line?

Would you let someone steal your car? Would you let a gang of teens break into and occupy your house without taking personal action? Would you let them steal the clothes off of you and your wife/daughter's bodies? There is no difference between turkey bits you bought with intentions to eat and clothes you bought with intentions to wear, a car you bought with intentions to drive, or a house you bought with intentions to live in.

It's yours, because you worked for money, and used that money to buy it. Now someone who doesn't own it is coming along, trying to destroy it or steal it. Are you willing to defend any property you own or do you reserve defense only to the preservation of your own life?

Well well well, I think I found the disconnect between me and everyone else here. I am still new, and most of my education has come from Massad books and videos which are of course self defense and IN carry laws for obvious reasons.

As Massad's content is exclusive to self defense and NOT property defense so I have death or grave bodily harm drilled in my head and stealing my car doesn't create that.....You people are going to REALLY laugh now, I didn't actually KNOW I could use deadly force to protect something that's not a currently living thing. I knew the Castle Doctrine allows me to protect me home but thought that was it.

Your car question is what did it. I thought one would actually need to be IN said car at the time, hence danger. So I looked into and Google learned me.

To answer your questions I don't have a daughter and my wife carried years before I did so I will let her decide that one. My house, of course I know about the Castle Doctrine and of course would defend it.

My car? I don't know... On one hand I would like to keep it around but what if the gun malfunctions in a way that alerts the thief that I am trying to kill him? What if I do get a good hit but he is also carrying (pretty likely)? People don't always die when you want them to. He just might pull his own before he leaves this world and we end up exchanging fire? Now my life really IS in danger but would not have been if I simply call the police and let my insurance handle it. I really dunno about that one.

A peice of chicken? Still no. Legal or not it's not worth ensuring court costs, days off work etc to me.

 

[shadohman]

Right-o. Everyone in and around Bloomington is a communist.

Please pardon me for impugning your superior intelligence and incredible knowledgebase of facts and reason with my attempt to make a balanced and informed comment. I'm sorry for taking you away from the delicate thoracic surgery or that multi-million dollar corporation that you undoubtedly are involved in with such a vastly superior intellect, education and complete motivation in life. No doubt if you act in the same way some day, by just generically knee-jerking a response you'll be best served in life.

I'll digress and allow you to return to your circlejerk. I'm not at all able to defend myself from your awesomeness.

So you must have missed that the OP uses a walker to get around. OC is a no go if you or a loved one is severely asthmatic.

 

[Glock19]

?

So you let your dogs chase some idiots? That could be considered a threat, what happens when something like that escalates into them shooting the dog or hitting the dog because they are scared.. It would have been your fault, not theirs....idiots or not...your just as much in the wrong.

 

[2A_Tom]

My wife carried years before I did.

ROFLMELBO

 

[Burnsy]

My wife carried years before I did.

ROFLMELBO

Yeah.....I know....and I thought about not including that little bit but, eh I am honest guy and can take some ribbing

 

[2A_Tom]

Glad you can take a joke.

I was afraid you were going to go all Krav Maga on me.

 

[308jake]

It's a shame the dogs didn't get a chunk of their arses. You handled yourself better than my dad would've.....he'd cut a ***** for wasting a piece of chicken.

 

[Burnsy]

Did you miss the part where he's crippled and requires mechanical means to move around?

The hole is getting deep, Burnsy. Let me hold that shovel for you awhile.

No I didn't miss it and I didn't say run either. The man is capable of moving from one location to another, he got to that table somehow and has to be able to get to his car to go home so unless he plans on living there I think it's safe to assume he can at least get to his car.


If expressing my opinion that is different than what turns out to many people means I am in a hole I am fine with that and don't mind a healthy debate.

 

[Josh Ward]

A peice of chicken? Still no. Legal or not it's not worth ensuring court costs, days off work etc to me.

Dude, you are still COMPLETLY missing the point. It wasn't the chicken he was defending

 

[lashicoN]

You people are going to REALLY laugh now, I didn't actually KNOW I could use deadly force to protect something that's not a currently living thing.

Not to nit pick, but when I said "defend" in my previous post, I wasn't specifically talking only about deadly force. You can put up a reasonable defense without having to use deadly force at times. I just wanted to gauge whether you would only defend your life, or if you would defend (by any means, not just deadly force) your property as well.

 

[88GT]

Well well well, I think I found the disconnect between me and everyone else here. I am still new, and most of my education has come from Massad books and videos which are of course self defense and IN carry laws for obvious reasons.

As Massad's content is exclusive to self defense and NOT property defense so I have death or grave bodily harm drilled in my head and stealing my car doesn't create that.....You people are going to REALLY laugh now, I didn't actually KNOW I could use deadly force to protect something that's not a currently living thing. I knew the Castle Doctrine allows me to protect me home but thought that was it.

Your car question is what did it. I thought one would actually need to be IN said car at the time, hence danger. So I looked into and Google learned me.

To answer your questions I don't have a daughter and my wife carried years before I did so I will let her decide that one. My house, of course I know about the Castle Doctrine and of course would defend it.

My car? I don't know... On one hand I would like to keep it around but what if the gun malfunctions in a way that alerts the thief that I am trying to kill him? What if I do get a good hit but he is also carrying (pretty likely)? People don't always die when you want them to. He just might pull his own before he leaves this world and we end up exchanging fire? Now my life really IS in danger but would not have been if I simply call the police and let my insurance handle it. I really dunno about that one.

A peice of chicken? Still no. Legal or not it's not worth ensuring court costs, days off work etc to me.

Just answer me this one question: when you walk out your door in the morning to get in you vehicle and you catch a thief in the act of attempting to steal it, what do you do?

 

[El-Cigarro]

I guess what it comes down to is, ya' gotta do, what ya' gotta DO, to protect YOU, & your LOVED ONES...

 

[El-Cigarro]

Just answer me this one question: when you walk out your door in the morning to get in you vehicle and you catch a thief in the act of attempting to steal it, what do you do?

Call A A A ???

 

[Burnsy]

Dude, you are still COMPLETLY missing the point. It wasn't the chicken he was defending

Try re-reading the past 20 pages, we have been through this already.

 

[Burnsy]

Just answer me this one question: when you walk out your door in the morning to get in you vehicle and you catch a thief in the act of attempting to steal it, what do you do?

I am honesty not sure I work from as a programmer so I have no experience in this situation, my gut reaction is to let my insurance deal with it I don't think its valid reason to put myself in danger. if you disagree, please share why, I may learn from it.