Interesting encounter at the DNR shooting range

[Prometheus]

From what I gather from these posts, the "I woulda done" people are talking about reflexes. Which seem pretty normal to me.

Exactly. My wife or I would have nailed him with the buttstock as well. I would think as we saw him go stumbling backwards we'd have held off on the double tap, but who knows how quickly the brown range shirt would register in such an adrenaline filled moment.

ChalupaCabras, I can't believe you didn't react. Looking back it was the good move, but at the time... wow.

They need to fire that idiot.

Also, not to rub it in, but it's also why I don't go to kingsbury range lik eeveryone wanted on saturday and why I went to JP.

 

[Rlee]

Went to the local range Thursday (Wilbur Wright FWA) and talked to the attendant on duty about this crazed mistake this moron made. To say the least, he was stunned. He did note though, "Weapons are suppose to be on the table if not in use though". But as I explained to him thats fine with me (which he said it wasn't enforced unless people were drawing there weapons from the table and firing) but the way this jack fu*k handled it was wrong. He agreed and helped me sight in my scope on the 50 yd range

 

[rhino]

..and I understand that. I was just curious if some people didn't realize that this isn't just some random RO, it's a DNR Officer with police powers.

Why do you keep saying this?

There is no evidence or even a suggestion that the criminal in question is a conservation officer. It's just a range employee who was hired to serve as a range officer. The "officer" in the two titles is coincidental.

It's kind of silly to assume a range officer at a public shooting range is a conservation officer. There are not enough conservations officers to do the jobs they're actually responsible for doing, so it makes no sense one would be a range officer.

 

[rhino]

Yesterday, around 3PM I believe, I received a call from the manager of the DNR Kingsbury property. He said that he had received notice of the incident from Major Hunter of the DNR conservation officers and the he wanted me to fill him in on the details. I was polite and informed him that the RO had approached unannounced on a hot range and snatched my gun. I told him that he said it was against state law. I told him that the RO committed a spectacular safety breech and that he has no business being a safety officer. The manager didn't seem happy, and he said that he would speak with the RO in question. We will see if anything comes of it.

I was in a class in Rochester over the weekend and I asked anyone if they knew about the incident. Another student told me that he lives near the range and that the RO in question has been fired.

Can you confirm? I certainly hope he was correct and the jacka** was fired. He should be barred from the range as well.

My big question for you is, are you going to sign a complaint against him for criminal conversion? You should.

 

[GhostofWinter]

Rhino, I was just at the range in question on Saturday and talked to the 'good' range officer Ed, and he didn't say anything about the @sshole getting fired, but I don't know if it was due to not knowing, or not wanted to say. He did howeger agree that the the whole thing should have NEVER happened. While the idiot was correct in the fact that rules say all weapons are to be on the table, the whole ting was handled very wrong. He then went on to mention that this RO in question also walks up and down the line carrying a weapon in his holster. Sound to me like the pot calling the kettle black....

Greg

 

[ChalupaCabras]

He then went on to mention that this RO in question also walks up and down the line carrying a weapon in his holster. Sound to me like the pot calling the kettle black....

Greg

I called him on that at the time in question. He re-directed the conversation without an answer.

 

[rhino]

Rhino, I was just at the range in question on Saturday and talked to the 'good' range officer Ed, and he didn't say anything about the @sshole getting fired, but I don't know if it was due to not knowing, or not wanted to say. He did howeger agree that the the whole thing should have NEVER happened. While the idiot was correct in the fact that rules say all weapons are to be on the table, the whole ting was handled very wrong. He then went on to mention that this RO in question also walks up and down the line carrying a weapon in his holster. Sound to me like the pot calling the kettle black....

Greg

Yeah, the guy that told me about the firing also mentioned that the criminal in question carries in a holster. I suppose that's okay since he knows so much about safety and no one else could be trusted with a gun in their holster. It's kind of like the video of the DEA guy telling the classroom full of kids that he's the only one in the room professional enough to handle a gun . . . right before he negligently shot himself.

 

[Roadie]

Why do you keep saying this?

There is no evidence or even a suggestion that the criminal in question is a conservation officer. It's just a range employee who was hired to serve as a range officer. The "officer" in the two titles is coincidental.

It's kind of silly to assume a range officer at a public shooting range is a conservation officer. There are not enough conservations officers to do the jobs they're actually responsible for doing, so it makes no sense one would be a range officer.

My apologies. I assumed they would be a DNR officer. My bad.

 

[Bubba]

+1 for a positive experience with this range on Saturday. At one point I was approached by one of the range officers (GoW tells me it was the one named Ed) who inquired whether I was carrying a pistol in a pocket holster. I was not, and I can only assume he saw my billfold or some of the other assorted crap I carry around with me on a regular basis as I leaned over the rifle bench. He was very polite and professional about it - he walked into my field of vision and stood about 7-10 feet away until I noticed him, then approached and asked his questions. He accepted my denial on face value and did not make me empty my pockets or other such BS. Very sad that ChalupaCabras was the victim of this sort of rampant asshattery, and sad also that one bad RO has left such a lasting negative impression on his facility that shooters such as Prometheus feel it isn't worth returning.

 

[rhino]

My apologies. I assumed they would be a DNR officer. My bad.

 

[Soundslikejosh]

+1 for a positive experience with this range on Saturday. At one point I was approached by one of the range officers (GoW tells me it was the one named Ed) who inquired whether I was carrying a pistol in a pocket holster. I was not, and I can only assume he saw my billfold or some of the other assorted crap I carry around with me on a regular basis as I leaned over the rifle bench. He was very polite and professional about it - he walked into my field of vision and stood about 7-10 feet away until I noticed him, then approached and asked his questions. He accepted my denial on face value and did not make me empty my pockets or other such BS. Very sad that ChalupaCabras was the victim of this sort of rampant asshattery, and sad also that one bad RO has left such a lasting negative impression on his facility that shooters such as Prometheus feel it isn't worth returning.

#1- What's in my pocket is not your business and it's weird that you noticed. Mind your own business. Is that a penis enlarger pump in your range bag?

#2- I don't believe that the "RO" has any authority to ask someone to empty their pockets. If they do, they shouldn't. It doesn't matter if you have a howitzer in your shirt pocket, if it stays there it's not their business. Their job is to ensure the safe use of the firearms that are on the line. <insert madman laughter here> I firmly maintain that anything else isn't their stinking business. I don't intend to add to the chest-thumping in this thread, but no one should empty their pockets for an RO. Period. You may have nothing to hide, but you also have no reason to show. You may have something to hide.

 

[Bubba]

In large part, I agree with what you say, Soundslikejosh, but this whole thread has been about a range officer making a huge error in judgement and alienating at least one shooter directly and how many others on this board. I'm not making any statements about what is and is not within a RO's authority, or about what i would or would not do in the OPs position, or about whether I would have emptied my pockets if asked on Saturday. I merely write to relay a positive experience with an RO at the range in question attempting to enforce the rules of the range with dignity, safety and professionalism.

 

[Soundslikejosh]

In large part, I agree with what you say, Soundslikejosh, but this whole thread has been about a range officer making a huge error in judgement and alienating at least one shooter directly and how many others on this board. I'm not making any statements about what is and is not within a RO's authority, or about what i would or would not do in the OPs position, or about whether I would have emptied my pockets if asked on Saturday. I merely write to relay a positive experience with an RO at the range in question attempting to enforce the rules of the range with dignity, safety and professionalism.

Bubba,

I apologize for misdirecting the intent of what you wrote. Obviously you had a satisfactory range experience and I agree that patronizing the DNR ranges is important. Getting rid of a few bad apples is wiser than boycotting something good.

I suppose it stuck in my craw that in your case the guy was checking out your pockets. IMO, that doesn't fall under the umbrella of "professionalism". Having said all that, I don't mean to nit-pick a guy who does his job and is interested in range safety.

My mistake for the derailment.

Regards

 

[GhostofWinter]

#1- What's in my pocket is not your business and it's weird that you noticed. Mind your own business. Is that a penis enlarger pump in your range bag?

#2- I don't believe that the "RO" has any authority to ask someone to empty their pockets. If they do, they shouldn't. It doesn't matter if you have a howitzer in your shirt pocket, if it stays there it's not their business. Their job is to ensure the safe use of the firearms that are on the line. <insert madman laughter here> I firmly maintain that anything else isn't their stinking business. I don't intend to add to the chest-thumping in this thread, but no one should empty their pockets for an RO. Period. You may have nothing to hide, but you also have no reason to show. You may have something to hide.

While I agree with you on the face of it Josh, I will say this. The rules for the range are plainly laid out. One of those rules is that no holstered weapons are allowed. With that in mind I would have to say that yes he DOES have a right to ask you if you have a gun in your pocket. By you coming onto the range you have agreed to abide by their rules. Kinda the old saying their house their rules. If I am going to play in their sandbox I have to be willing to follow their rules.

Greg

 

[Joe Williams]

Ya know, if a RO asked if I had a gun in my pocket, I'm really not sure I could resist saying "No, I'm just happy to see you!"

 

[edsinger]

Ya know, if a RO asked if I had a gun in my pocket, I'm really not sure I could resist saying "No, I'm just happy to see you!"

Thats just not right

 

[rhino]

While I agree with you on the face of it Josh, I will say this. The rules for the range are plainly laid out. One of those rules is that no holstered weapons are allowed. With that in mind I would have to say that yes he DOES have a right to ask you if you have a gun in your pocket. By you coming onto the range you have agreed to abide by their rules. Kinda the old saying their house their rules. If I am going to play in their sandbox I have to be willing to follow their rules.

He can ask anything he wants. No one is obligated to answer him truthfully or otherwise. He is probably empowered by his employer to eject someone from the range. So be it. He has no right or authority to conduct a search against someone's will.

My non-lawyer's analogy would be the people at the door in Walmart. They can ask to see your receipt and paw through your stuff, but you don't have to let them do it. They have no right or authority whatsoever to touch you, your belongings, or to detain you in any way unless they or someone else has witnessed you stealing something.

 

[Roadie]

He can ask anything he wants. No one is obligated to answer him truthfully or otherwise. He is probably empowered by his employer to eject someone from the range. So be it. He has no right or authority to conduct a search against someone's will.

My non-lawyer's analogy would be the people at the door in Walmart. They can ask to see your receipt and paw through your stuff, but you don't have to let them do it. They have no right or authority whatsoever to touch you, your belongings, or to detain you in any way unless they or someone else has witnessed you stealing something.

Ugh, WalMart Door Nazis! They asked to see my receipt, I say "No Thank You" and walk on out. After they stopped my teenage daughter and asked for her receipt for her coat, that she had brought IN with her, I was done. I go there as little as possible.

 

[seamus]

Whew! I've read every post on this subject and hope to hear that "John" the idiot range officer has been fired. Please keep us posted, inquiring minds need to know. Over the years I've seen a few stupid moves at public ranges but nothing by the ro?!

 

[joslar15]

Continuing the non-lawyer analogy...

He can ask anything he wants. No one is obligated to answer him truthfully or otherwise. He is probably empowered by his employer to eject someone from the range. So be it. He has no right or authority to conduct a search against someone's will.

My non-lawyer's analogy would be the people at the door in Walmart. They can ask to see your receipt and paw through your stuff, but you don't have to let them do it. They have no right or authority whatsoever to touch you, your belongings, or to detain you in any way unless they or someone else has witnessed you stealing something.

Saturday I bought the wife a new laptop from Best Buy for Mother's Day. A rather large, yellow-shirted "security guy" bellowed, "Sir, I need to see your receipt." Looking him in the eye, smiling as I walked past him I said, "No, you don't."

On a somewhat sadder side note, I've come to realize how dim the screen on my laptop has become! Lowers. LPKs, laptops, so many Ls, so few Benjamins!