First Crossdresser Working in the White House

[Arthur Dent]

Not apples to apples comparison.

I see your point but yes, the are screwed up by current standards. What standards are you using. Compassion is a good thing but some of this stuff is way out in left field. JMHO of course.

I do not suffer from a phobia. I do not have a disorder. I am not challenged by my own sexuality as I know full well who I am.

I dressed up as a woman several times on festive occasions as in Halloween. Man I could not wait to get home and dump those heels.

It is apples to apples. These people are born feeling this way. They know they are different (gay, lesbian, transgender, etc) just like you and I know we are straight.

 

[churchmouse]

It is apples to apples. These people are born feeling this way. They know they are different (gay, lesbian, transgender, etc) just like you and I know we are straight.

And you think that is normal.

I do not. For whatever reason there is something amiss in the chemistry. There has to be.

I will say these folks do not "Deserve" special treatment. The media spotlight etc.

Again.....Jmho and personal feelings on the matter.

 

[foszoe]

For something that people don't agree with, which doesn't affect them AT ALL, there sure is a lot of negativity. Are these people screwed up? No, they just are the way they are. You don't believe a person with Down syndrome chose to be that way, do you? "Can't you just NOT be retarded? Have you tried being normal?" If you truly believe it is a choice then try being transgender or gay for a week. If it's a choice you should find it just as comfortable as being straight. I don't know about the rest of you but I didn't choose to be straight, I just am. Some people are just gay or are transgender. They weren't thinking to themselves "wouldn't it be cool to act and dress this way so I can be ridiculed, possibly assaulted or murdered!" They are thinking "this is who I am." So that's what they are. The disorder is in the people with the phobia.

So a person with Downs syndrome is retarded? If so, does retarded means not normal? Is it due to a chromosomal disorder? Do tests confirming the condition result in abortions because it's considered difficult to raise a child with Downs syndrome? Does this mean you are conceding the same for the LGBT community? That its members are not normal and that if genetic testing can determine the condition that in utero termination would be acceptable based solely on a positive result?

Otherwise I fail to follow the parallels you are drawing.


Are you saying that if no choice is involved in a behavior, the the behavior must be accepted by society?

I think your entire statement really rests on the premise it doesn't affect anyone else, but I don't accept that premise, without clarification on what it means.

 

[Trigger Time]

The White House just got scarier. Imagin finding that thing in a secret dark tunnel. Or rather it finding your secret dark tunnel!!!! Ewwwwww

 

[cbhausen]

If one finds something repulsive and cannot change it, best to avert one's vision until it passes.

That having been said, America is looking more like a Bracken novel every day.

 

[Kutnupe14]

Ya got that backwards

....waiting for the "Z" word

 

[BehindBlueI's]

Wow... The Dog Days of Summer must be really kicking in as the temperatures rise and the humidity increases. People are getting short-tempered, quick to anger, eager to assault someone verbally or physically.

In a recent thread about Transgender folk, I thought I had seen lots of posts with sheer hatred and anger. But I was wrong. This thread, with 96 posts as I type this, far exceeds what I read earlier.

People, people, people! Please get it together!. The person all this anger and hatred being directed at is a Human Being, just like everyone here on INGO. The fact they live their life differently than you should not be an issue at all. If you look around at your fellow members of society you will see many differences in them.

Do you hate someone because they have a better job than you? Do you hate this person because they wear a suit to work and you wear jeans and a tee shirt? Do you hate someone because they drive a certain car and you drive something different.

The majority of INGO members have NO IDEA what a Transgender person go through in their lives. Transgender folk already know lots and lots of people don't like them for the way they live. They already know a friend, or the friend of a friend, that has been physically assaulted (Take IT in the an alley and give them a beating!). They have already read in the news of a Transgender person being killed because of the way they wanted to live their life.

"So if you see a crossdresser in public and that person has no interaction with you whatsoever are they still pushing their lifestyle on you?"

"Yes - I can still see them."

Way back in time, in my parent's generation, there were similar thoughts about Black people, or African-Americans to be politically correct. Lots of them were beaten, killed, hung from a tree. And here we are, 50 to 75 years later, wanting to do the same thing to people just because they LOOK different, or ACT different, or want to LIVE a different life.

All I can do is shake my head and wonder...

I do have a question to pose to the INGO membership in general. Okay, may be two questions.

1. What will you do when one of your children comes to you and says, "Dad. Mom. I am a Transgender person."

2. What will the INGO membership do when a Transgender person becomes a Forum Member?

Okay, I'm going to go eat supper now. If the Ban Hammer is gonna fall on my happy butt, I want to have a full stomach.

Have a great evening!

Redtbird

We had a transgender member. He didn't last long because he's also the head of CopBlock and couldn't turn it off and was subsequently banned. I don't recall anyone being negative or threatening based on the transgender part of the equation.

Here's the issue many of us have. The celebration of it. Bruce Jenner is "brave" and gets awards for doing something that the statistics show leads to increased suicide rates and less satisfaction with life overall long term. Yes, it doesn't effect me personally. Neither does someone with an eating disorder or who cuts themselves. Yet we don't praise (and thus encourage) people who "identifies as a fat person" and eats in an unhealthy way. If you truly love and support someone, you don't praise their self destructive decisions. I don't have to praise cocaine use to feel empathy or to attempt to help an addict, and I don't have to play along with delusions to feel empathy for someone who denies reality.

I used to have a woman who called 911 because of a demon in her house. Some of you would say there's no way I could know there wasn't a demon in her house, or that I need special training to recognize that there was no demon. But I went ahead and made the command decision there was no demon. She'd call, I'd show up, she'd say the demon was a snake under her couch, I'd lift the couch and look under it...and no snake. So should I have played along? Told her how brave she was to live with this demon? Or tell her the truth. There is no demon. If you got proper treatment and no longer saw the demon yourself you would be happier long term and you would have a better standard of living. I chose the second one. I spoke with her family and did everything I could to try and get her into proper treatment, and eventually she did go. I don't know if it worked or not, but she went. To me, that is brave, fighting the delusion instead of giving in to it.

 

[rambone]

We had a transgender member. He didn't last long because he's also the head of CopBlock and couldn't turn it off and was subsequently banned.

Really?? How did I miss this?

 

[Dead Duck]

Really?? How did I miss this?

Was it a friend of yours?

 

[rambone]

Was it a friend of yours?

No, yours?

 

[indiucky]

I dressed up as a woman several times on festive occasions as in Halloween. Man I could not wait to get home and dump those heels.

You would make a great Elvira CM.....

 

[g00n24]

It is apples to apples. These people are born feeling this way. They know they are different (gay, lesbian, transgender, etc) just like you and I know we are straight.

No, it is not. Down's syndrome is a genetic/chromosomal defect. That is truly being born with a disorder. As far as I know gender dysphoria has no known genetic component. Maybe there is one, but it certainly isn't like Down's syndrome (trisomy 21). They are biologically male or female, and have a psychiatric disorder making them think they are not male or female. As posted earlier on in this thread it is known these individuals have serious psychological problems that persist even following surgery to physically change their sex, and have a much higher suicide rate than the rest of the population. Ignoring their psychiatric disorder will not help these people, they will continue to harm themselves through these surgical procedures, and will continue to kill themselves after they realize the surgery did not fix their mental problems. This is nothing like Down's syndrome.

 

[churchmouse]

We had a transgender member. He didn't last long because he's also the head of CopBlock and couldn't turn it off and was subsequently banned. I don't recall anyone being negative or threatening based on the transgender part of the equation.

Here's the issue many of us have. The celebration of it. Bruce Jenner is "brave" and gets awards for doing something that the statistics show leads to increased suicide rates and less satisfaction with life overall long term. Yes, it doesn't effect me personally. Neither does someone with an eating disorder or who cuts themselves. Yet we don't praise (and thus encourage) people who "identifies as a fat person" and eats in an unhealthy way. If you truly love and support someone, you don't praise their self destructive decisions. I don't have to praise cocaine use to feel empathy or to attempt to help an addict, and I don't have to play along with delusions to feel empathy for someone who denies reality.

I used to have a woman who called 911 because of a demon in her house. Some of you would say there's no way I could know there wasn't a demon in her house, or that I need special training to recognize that there was no demon. But I went ahead and made the command decision there was no demon. She'd call, I'd show up, she'd say the demon was a snake under her couch, I'd lift the couch and look under it...and no snake. So should I have played along? Told her how brave she was to live with this demon? Or tell her the truth. There is no demon. If you got proper treatment and no longer saw the demon yourself you would be happier long term and you would have a better standard of living. I chose the second one. I spoke with her family and did everything I could to try and get her into proper treatment, and eventually she did go. I don't know if it worked or not, but she went. To me, that is brave, fighting the delusion instead of giving in to it.

Pretty much spot on.

Bruce is not brave, he is a wacko that saw a way to cash in on his "Wackiness"

He is a capitalist plan and simple.

 

[ruger1800]

20% regret changing genders, over 40% attempt suicide, and even after surgery a large number remain traumatized - Sex Change Info

Trouble In Transtopia: Murmurs Of Sex Change Regret



. . . transsexualism was invented by psychiatrists. . . .You fundamentally can’t change sex … the surgery doesn’t alter you genetically. It’s genital mutilation. My ‘vagina’ was just the bag of my scrotum. It’s like a pouch, like a kangaroo. What’s scary is you still feel like you have a penis when you’re sexually aroused. It’s like phantom limb syndrome. It’s all been a terrible misadventure. I’ve never been a woman, just Alan . . . the analogy I use about giving surgery to someone desperate to change sex is it’s a bit like offering liposuction to an anorexic.

 

[HoughMade]

I've been lead to believe that doing what feels right always brings happiness and lasting satisfaction with life.

Studies and statistics must be changed to reflect this belief, or they are hateful.

 

[Dead Duck]

No, yours?

Nope -
All my friends are N-O-R-M-A-L.

 

[Blackhawk2001]

My wife is convince that the first "cross-dresser" to work in the White House is "Mike" Obama.

 

[Arthur Dent]

So a person with Downs syndrome is retarded? If so, does retarded means not normal? Is it due to a chromosomal disorder? Do tests confirming the condition result in abortions because it's considered difficult to raise a child with Downs syndrome? Does this mean you are conceding the same for the LGBT community? That its members are not normal and that if genetic testing can determine the condition that in utero termination would be acceptable based solely on a positive result?

Otherwise I fail to follow the parallels you are drawing.


Are you saying that if no choice is involved in a behavior, the the behavior must be accepted by society?

I think your entire statement really rests on the premise it doesn't affect anyone else, but I don't accept that premise, without clarification on what it means.

How do LGBT people affect you?

Following the logic most here are using it is straight parents raising LGBT children. Tell the straight people to stop raising them that way.

 

[Arthur Dent]

No, it is not. Down's syndrome is a genetic/chromosomal defect. That is truly being born with a disorder. As far as I know gender dysphoria has no known genetic component. Maybe there is one, but it certainly isn't like Down's syndrome (trisomy 21). They are biologically male or female, and have a psychiatric disorder making them think they are not male or female. As posted earlier on in this thread it is known these individuals have serious psychological problems that persist even following surgery to physically change their sex, and have a much higher suicide rate than the rest of the population. Ignoring their psychiatric disorder will not help these people, they will continue to harm themselves through these surgical procedures, and will continue to kill themselves after they realize the surgery did not fix their mental problems. This is nothing like Down's syndrome.

How do you know it is not chromosomal? Like I just said, tell their straight parents to stop raising LGBT kids and the problem will go away.

 

[BehindBlueI's]

How do LGBT people affect you?

Following the logic most here are using it is straight parents raising LGBT children. Tell the straight people to stop raising them that way.

Again, how does someone with an eating disorder affect me?

I've got no issues at all with people who are gay, in to fat chicks, skinny dudes, whatever. I also will not play into someone's delusion that they are the opposite sex, a different race, etc. any more than I would if they told me they could fly or are haunted.